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Sheffield Tony

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This might be a silly question, but maybe someone here can shed some light ...

Why, on seemingly all sanitary ware, are any holes made at least twice the size required ? Ceramic washbasins, plastic baths - the taps tails are as standard a size as you could wish for, 1/2" or 3/4" pipe threads. So why make the mounting holes so large that the backnut almost fits through the hole too, making it almost impossible to get the taps placed correctly, firmly attached and sealed to the sink ?

And loo seat fixing holes. A 6mm threaded rod, for which there is a ~16mm hole, with flimsy plastic nuts to limit the available clamping force. Almost ensures the thing starts to slide around with time.

Is it just me ?
 

MikeG.

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That's the least of it. Why are taps mounted in round holes? Why do they not have a square "tenon" in the casting fitting into a square hole in the basin or bath, so that the thing resisting turning isn't ultimately the plumbing joint?
 
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I've always wondered why the hex/allen key and associated hardware has six sides that can so easily be rounded.

Surely a square (like we have now with square drive screws) would have been the most obvious option?

I'm assuming it was to give you more angles of attachment? (for tight areas)
 

Sheffield Tony

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Now that, Phil, is smart thinking. It would also direct any "splash" back in the right direction.

So maybe it isn't just me. I've contrived plastic bushes to keep things central before now, bit like the idea of those rubber cones. The bath was a nightmare, the taps come with an O-ring to seal between the tap and the bath - and as there's a shower over that's needed - but the holes in the bath were so large it required quite precise positioning for the O-ring to be in contact with plastic rather than over the hole. And the back nut was only gripping by the very edge of its thin plastic flange so I needed to make big repair washers to be able to get the tap firmly fixed to the bath.

I've resolved if I ever fit a plastic bath again, I'll go for the undrilled option so I can make the right sized holes, in the right place !
 

flying haggis

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I think we all need to work for design departments.

When I fitted the tap for MILs sink,normally fit the tails then pass them through the hole fit back nut job done. except the nut on the end of the tails was too big too fit through the hole in the back nut if the other tail was in place!
 

sunnybob

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Its the way my grandfather made it, its the way I will make it.
Quote from "sanitary weekly"

Way back when sinks and basins were invented, taps werent a standard size. So the hole was made extra large, and the plumber when fitting the taps bedded them into plaster to make up the gaps. Remember that back then the pipes were lead, wiped onto the tap tails, that took up a lot of room.

On toilets, the holes were made large so that a wooden plug could be pushed through the pan into drilled hole in the floorboards, and a large brass slot head screw was driven into the wooden plug. This cushioned the pan from the hard edges of the screws.

The fixings industry has moved on, sanitary ware hasnt.
 

Jake

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Split Klick (or the like) is what you want for the original issue.
 

sunnybob

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phil.p":1mveiwvl said:
Its the way my grandfather made it, its the way I will make it.
Quote from "sanitary weekly"

Didn't know Jacob wrote for Sanitary Weekly. :D
I think Jacob is still coming to terms with the printing press, I think someone else types his internet stuff for him. =D> =D> =D> =D> =D>
8)
I used to really enjoy wiping lead pipe joints, very satisfying. The biggest lead pipe i worked on was in Bushy Park (very near Hampton Court palace) It was several hundred years old and about 8" diameter, It fed water to the palace. Of course that was half a century ago, I 'spect its plastic by now. :shock: (hammer)
 

samhay

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sunnybob":2lt8ot2n said:
Way back when sinks and basins were invented, taps werent a standard size. So the hole was made extra large, and the plumber when fitting the taps bedded them into plaster to make up the gaps. Remember that back then the pipes were lead, wiped onto the tap tails, that took up a lot of room.

On toilets, the holes were made large so that a wooden plug could be pushed through the pan into drilled hole in the floorboards, and a large brass slot head screw was driven into the wooden plug. This cushioned the pan from the hard edges of the screws.
Thanks for the excellent history lesson.
Will still be swearing at the design every time the tap comes lose and starts twisting though.
 

sunnybob

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samhay":3vouliph said:
sunnybob":3vouliph said:
Way back when sinks and basins were invented, taps werent a standard size. So the hole was made extra large, and the plumber when fitting the taps bedded them into plaster to make up the gaps. Remember that back then the pipes were lead, wiped onto the tap tails, that took up a lot of room.

On toilets, the holes were made large so that a wooden plug could be pushed through the pan into drilled hole in the floorboards, and a large brass slot head screw was driven into the wooden plug. This cushioned the pan from the hard edges of the screws.
Thanks for the excellent history lesson.
.

HISTORY LESSON!!! That was my apprenticeship I was talking about.
(hammer) (hammer) (hammer) (hammer) 8)
 

RogerS

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phil.p":2oxzj0qa said:
Its the way my grandfather made it, its the way I will make it.
Quote from "sanitary weekly"

Didn't know Jacob wrote for Sanitary Weekly. :D
Certainly never wrote for Sanity Weekly :lol:
 

Lons

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Anyone who's removed very old taps will know that many had a square section just under the flange and the taps were installed with putty which was hard as hell and difficult to remove without breaking the china, which still had round oversize holes. No problem if everything was scrapped but a swine if it was just the taps.
 

Yojevol

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Never mind all that, the biggest hole in public loos will soon be sloping (so you don't linger there too long):-
toilet.jpg
 

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samhay

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sunnybob":1qm4ifwn said:
samhay":1qm4ifwn said:
HISTORY LESSON!!! That was my apprenticeship I was talking about.
(hammer) (hammer) (hammer) (hammer) 8)
My son thinks the olden days were any time before he was born.
He's seven.
I guess it's all relative.
 

Phil Pascoe

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flying haggis":b6fn7c84 said:
I think we all need to work for design departments.
I do wonder sometimes who does the designing. Years ago I had problems with a BMW boxer engine - I found the "O" rings on the cylinders were on the skirt - every time you replaced them, you skimmed to top off them when replacing the cylinders. Why weren't thet put on one of the flat surfaces?
My mother had a little 924 Porsche with electrical problems ............... which we eventually found were caused by the black box being sited directly behind one of the headlamps (which popped up) - the wettest place in the whole engine bay.
 

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