How to stop veneer sliding/moving when gluing??

[sihollies]

Hi
Could anyone please advise or give me tips on how to ensure a leaf of veneer doesn't slide out of place when gluing up.
I have a smallish (bit bigger tha A4) size leaf of veneer, with a marquetry motif positioned in the centre of it and want to glue it to a box lid, using clamps, but dont want it to move as I need it to be'dead central'.
It is all marked up on the box and veneer and ready to go, but would like some advice on what is the best method to avoid any movement.
I dont want to use masking tape, as I have found that it sometimes damages the grain after gluing and on removal.
Would veneer tape be an option?
I have had a look online and saw a video, where someone advised sprinkling table salt on the glue, prior to positioning the veneer????

Thanks in advance
Simon

 

[Sgian Dubh]

I've never used the salt trick myself, although I understand it works going by the word of others. I've used very fine sand as an alternative, just a few grains sprinkled judiciously, and that works too.

You might also use a couple of very fine veneer pins driven through the veneer into the ground. It's hard to find traditional veneer pins nowadays - most modern ones are quite a large gauge and have a rather big knobbly head, but the heads can be cut off with pliers. Alternatively, you can often find very fine and short brads designed for shooting in a brad gun, or you can sometimes even cut a leg off a fairly heavy duty staple to drive through the veneer into the ground below. If you go the veneer pin or brad route you'd obviously be best to try and hide them within a feature of your panel, e.g., a glue line, some sort of disguising grain swirl or similar. Normally, after the veneer has been glued and dried, the pin or brad is driven below the surface of the veneer and a small localised disguising repair might be necessary, hence the suggestion to try and lose the pin in some disguising feature. Slainte.

 

[sihollies]

Thanks for the rapid reply.
The sand/salt trick may be the way forward on this project, as I don't have any veneer pins .
Just a though: Would a standard sewing pin do the same job, If I snip it to the required length??

Thanks
Simon

 

[Droogs]

You don't mention how you are fixing the panel, ie glue type and pressing process. Is the panel already exact size or have you left it oversize. Using pins is the traditional way when using animal glue and hammer or press but if you are using modern glue and/or a vacuum system then small tabs of 30gsm veneer tape will do the job fine and leave no marking once scrapped off.
hth

 

[sihollies]

Thanks Droogs
I am using PVA and clamps.
I am only a hobbyist so unfortunately I cant really justify the cost of a vacuum press.
The veneer is slightly oversized, but the issue is that i need the motif central.
As I dont have any veneer pins, I will probably use the veneer tape, as suggested.

Thanks
Simon

 

[Droogs]

Ok, first find the center-point of the field on the substrate and mark with a pencil all the way to the corners and bisect them. Then find the center of the marquetry panel and mark it with a small diagonal cross in pencil and also mark the exact point of the outer most part of the panel corners with a small right angle mark.
Then as you have no true pins use a staple leg that you have snapped off to pierce the center mark of the panel and then remove it and tap it into the mark on the substrate.
Place the veneer on the panel and center it by having the pin poke through the hole. Align the corner marks with the diagonals on the substrate and then tack down the edges at a couple of points on each side. When you get the pieces of tape to stick down the edges DO NOT cut them but rip them, this gives a feathered edge that is more difficult to see rather than a hard de-liniated edge.
Pull out the center pin and apply the platen and paper and then press

hth
edit typos

 

[RickG]

Have you tried doing the veneer without the need for clamps?

Please excuse me if you know about this method, as I'm new here.

I paint the veneer with watered down Pva. You might need to spray the other side of the veneer to stop it curling. Then paint the wood to be covered, with the same diluted Pva.

Leave both to dry. When dry, lay the veneer in place and press it down and iron it in place using a clothes iron.

Well, it might be worth a try. It's how I've always done veneer.

 

[Yojevol]

I dont want to use masking tape, as I have found that it sometimes damages the grain after gluing and on removal.

On a recent veneering job I was using masking tape and sure enough there was a danger of tearing off some filaments. What to do? I'd used a lot of tape. However I quickly found that with a bit of heat from a heat gun it came off very cleanly.
Brian

 

[Adam9453]

Can you add a temporary batten to one edge of your substrate that you can tape the oversize veneer to, so it’s held in place while glueing. Then just trim off your temporary batten and the excess veneer. We usually make the substrate oversize so it can be trimmed off after pressing the veneer onto it, gives you a nice clean and edge and allows it to be trued up if the veneer shifts a little out of square.
Hope that helps

 

[sihollies]

Thanks everyone for your advice and guides, I truly appreciate it and they have all been taken onboard.
The veneer is now glued and it was a success.
I trimmed the veneer allowing a 2mm overhang on each side and secured it in position using veneer tape prior to clamping.
I have seen the technique that RickG suggested, but have never tried it, and will probably experiment on a few scraps before risking it on a project.

Thanks again to you all

Simon