Have identified cat fouling garden, now what ?

[Paul Chapman]

So what are you going to do when you've dealt with the cat? Are you then going to campaign to ban birds, foxes, squirrels, hedgehogs, field mice, bees, slugs, worms, insects - they are all using your garden as a toilet or hadn't you thought of that?

Cheers :wink:

Paul

 

[Digit]

Come off it Paul, carry that argument forward and the OP will have the owner joining his cat! :lol:
BTW, my son uses a paint ball gun, choice of colours as well!

Roy

 

[mbartlett99]

Its only a crime if they find the body!

 

[woodbloke]

The majority of people deem cats a nuisance.

I can see that you're irritated by this situation and quite rightly, but that's pretty much a sweeping statement which I would question. There are millions of people who far prefer the company of cat's to any other sort of animal, myself included. I stand to be corrected but in law, a cat owner (unlike a dog owner) can't be held responsible for the animal's actions as it is deemed to be 'wild'...perhaps that's the wrong term, but the law runs something like that. For example, hit a cat when driving your car and it doesn't have to be reported to the police, whereas the opposite is true of a dog.
Even though a cat has this distinction in law, whatever action you take, the law is firmly on the side of the owner if the cat is damaged, hurt or killed etc, so have the greatest care when deciding how you're going to tackle the problem. As has been discussed, there are options open to you which won't physically hurt the animal and those are the ones which, in my view, you need to pursue - Rob

 

[Digit]

My daughter is a member of the Cat Protection League and was known here as the 'Cat Women' so I fully understand the legal position, my complaint with it is the same as with burglary.
'Serves you right Sir, you should keep your doors locked!'
No I damn well shouldn't! In both cases the responsibilty is being placed on the 'victim.'
Burglars should stay out of my house and cat owners should take responsibilty for their pets.
I wonder what the local rating office would say if the OP claimed a reduction in his Community Charge for loss of amenity, ie. use of lawn?

Roy.

 

[flanajb]

So what are you going to do when you've dealt with the cat? Are you then going to campaign to ban birds, foxes, squirrels, hedgehogs, field mice, bees, slugs, worms, insects - they are all using your garden as a toilet or hadn't you thought of that?

Cheers :wink:

Paul

So as to avoid confusion. Birds, foxes, squirrels, hedgehogs, field mice, bees, slugs, worms, insects are all warmly welcome in my garden as they are wild and bring enjoyment. In fact I actively encourage these animals and insects into my garden.

PS - Hear, hear Roy, well said. If you are ever in the Dorset area pop in for a beer

 

[Digit]

You're on mate! And if you ever holiday in west Wales we do I nice range of beers, DAHIK!

Roy.

 

[andymac]

I'm an avid lurker but rarely post, preferring instead to quietly learn from others more skilled and generally more outgoing than I.

However, I feel compelled to stick my oar in here..

I'm in utter disbelief at the, errr.... "humorous" or "tongue-in-cheek" suggestions that have been posted on how to cause an animal pain and physical harm.

Forums such as this are unparalled vehicles for the dissemination of knowledge and ideas. I sincerely hope that, this time, that has not been the case.

Utterly, unbelievably irresponsible to post such suggestions on a public forum, whether meant in jest or not.

Voice your opinions, ladies and gents, please do. it's a pleasure to read a well-balanced, thoughtful and intelligent debate. But please think twice about making posts that could be taken as instructive by some.

 

[Digit]

Ok Andy, point taken, so let's have an intelligent debate.
Firstly, my position, I rather like cats, but I prefer dogs.
The law divides 'wild' animals in the UK into two groups, 'Game' and 'Vermin'.
Vermin is not a derogative term, it simply defines non Game animals.
So if cats are legally 'wild', then they are also 'Vermin.'
The law permits the shooting of Dogs under prescribed conditions, as it does such other 'Vermin' as Grey Squirrels, with the caveat that the method used must not cause 'unneccessary suffering'.
I also love that phrase as it permits enormous suffering if deemed 'necessary.'
So a clean shot is legal, so where does that leave the OP's crapping moggy?

Roy.

 

[studders]

I think you'd have to be seriously lacking 'knives in the drawer' to take those suggestion seriously but, you do have a point.


PS I have the same problem with pooping critters, my War is with them, not their owners, though some Cat owners 'holier than thou' attitude in 'Cat v Dog' exchanges does tend to get up my snout somewhat.

 

[DTR]

A responsible cat owner will train the cat to use a litter tray, the lazy cat owner does not care where it goes to the toilet. So of course it can be trained.

How does one train a cat, exactly (serious question)? We lived in a flat with a cat for four years, and it had no option but to go in the litter tray. As soon as we moved to a house it neglected the tray in preference for the great outdoors. Not that my neighbours particularly have a problem with it; at times our garden has been frequented by their own cats (plural), rabbit, ferret, and chickens...

edit: for the record, I'm not a cat person, the missus is. I absolutely understand the frustration of people who have to put up with cats tom titting in their garden.

 

[cutting42]

My daughter is a member of the Cat Protection League and was known here as the 'Cat Women' so I fully understand the legal position, my complaint with it is the same as with burglary.
'Serves you right Sir, you should keep your doors locked!'
No I damn well shouldn't! In both cases the responsibilty is being placed on the 'victim.'
Burglars should stay out of my house and cat owners should take responsibilty for their pets.
I wonder what the local rating office would say if the OP claimed a reduction in his Community Charge for loss of amenity, ie. use of lawn?

Roy.

Sorry Roy but that is complete and utter nonsense, and a very poor analogy. You cannot compare a cats natural behaviour to that of a burglar. The cat (trained or otherwise) once outside and in the "wild" will go anywhere it wants to like it or not. The burglar makes a specific decision to target a house knowing they are personally responsible. Th cat has no sense of responsibility and is only loyal to a food source. Ownership of a cat is tenuous at best, training is pretty much only effective within the home. To hold the owner to the same account as a burglar is ludicrous.

So you dislike cats, fair enough, some dislike dogs, I am no fan of either but the language on here sounds like the daily Mail at times.

 

[cutting42]

Oh dear Gareth. You seem to have missed the point. A responsible cat owner will train the cat to use a litter tray, the lazy cat owner does not care where it goes to the toilet. So of course it can be trained.

Reread the posts and you will see that thankfully your type are a minority. The majority of people deem cats a nuisance.

Before you reply to my post 'Yawn. Is that the time!'

Blimey Ad Hom now is it? I don't recall defining "my type" or in fact explaining my position so that you can denigrate it.

You are the one missing the point, you take a swipe at my post but ignore every question in it, so once again for the hard of understanding!

1/ Please explain how to train a cat to not use the outdoors as a toilet - I am sure there are millions hanging on your every word - Indoors is possible and many do this but once outside, and certainly once far from home a cat will not return inside to relieve itself but revert to millions of years of evolution and go outside, sometimes in your Petunia's

2/ How do you propose that an owner who has little influence on the cats behaviour should stop it visiting your garden

Oh in case you were making a judgement (and I think you were), I am not a cat lover, in fact I am not really an animal lover. Don't mind them really but don't want to have them as pets. I get plenty of cats, foxes, squirrels and even a few Muntjac deer in the garden and they all create evidence of being there but it is part of having a garden in this country and I accept them all. The only animal that approaches pest status is the local Heron which eats my fish.

I wish you well dealing with cats in the future.

 

[Digit]

Eh Gareth, I did state that I like cats actually, also my point was responsibility. Personally I'm sick and tired of cat owners insisting that it's the cat's nature etc therefore it's nothing to do with me must put up with it blah blah blah!
Would you permit me the same excuse if my dog fouled the path outside your house? After all, it's their nature innit?
As regards the burglar, there was report this week, (not in the Mail so down boys,) that evil is genetic, so Gareth the analogy is spot on, it's in their nature, so we must put up with it!

Roy.

 

[cutting42]

Eh Gareth, I did state that I like cats actually, also my point was responsibility. Personally I'm sick and tired of cat owners insisting that it's the cat's nature etc therefore it's nothing to do with me must put up with it blah blah blah!
Would you permit me the same excuse if my dog fouled the path outside your house? After all, it's their nature innit?
As regards the burglar, there was report this week, (not in the Mail so down boys,) that evil is genetic, so Gareth the analogy is spot on, it's in their nature, so we must put up with it!

Roy.

Sorry, I missed your cat liking statement but I still don't think you cannot hold cat owners responsible for their cats behaviour. Cats by nature are solitary independent animals with little pack instinct and have very limited loyalty. You could try to argue that we should not even try to "own" cats and ban them as pets, you might try to argue that they should never be allowed outside to protect carefully manicured lawns. However whilst people are allowed to have cats as pets it will remain a frustration for some.

You are campaigning for the the impossible I believe, you would have more luck getting pigeon racers to train their racing birds to poop neatly into public pigeon toilets rather than on the heads and cars of the general public.

Evil may be genetic (in fact I tend to agree with much of the article) but humans still have significantly more intelligence than a cat and also are aware of the impact of our actions far in excess of all other animals in our world. Therefore we must be responsible for our actions therefore the analogy is still flawed.

Regarding your dog (theoretical or otherwise), I assume it is under your control typically when being walked in the street (otherwise given the general intelligence of dogs, the roads would be littered with the bodies of nice but dim hounds after unsuccessful chasing of motor vehicles) . Therefore whilst "under your control" the local council would take issue with your irresponsibility rather than me and issue a suitable financial admonishment. Now, if dogs were out and about on there own then you would indeed have a point and I would treat the activity as I do a fox, cat, squirrel etc. as I could not and would not hold you responsible.

Yours - non cat or dog owning

 

[Digit]

Obviously you do not believe in responsibility, it's simple Gareth, if your cat is a nuisance to neighbours then perhaps you should do the neighbourly thing and not have a cat!
People on this forum have stated that they do not use their machines in the evening so as not be a nuisance to their neighbours.
Same principle.

Roy.

 

[cutting42]

Obviously you do not believe in responsibility, it's simple Gareth, if your cat is a nuisance to neighbours then perhaps you should do the neighbourly thing and not have a cat!
People on this forum have stated that they do not use their machines in the evening so as not be a nuisance to their neighbours.
Same principle.

Roy.

Well I don't have a cat so it is a moot point but I am offended you draw the conclusion that I do not believe in responsibility period. I have stated my position very clearly in terms of responsibility for a cat owner and it is your right to express the view that people should not be allowed to own cats in case they behave naturally. You will be judged by some to be a NIMBY control freak and by others as a savior to the green lawn.

I also do not use power tools at anti social hours as I have social and personal responsibility for my actions and also for making sure my children behave and do not annoy other people amongst other things, it is what makes us create and maintain communities. But how can you assign or assume responsibility for something they have no control over?

So I ask, again, do you believe that cat ownership should be banned? I would also include your sympathizer flanajb in this question, or would you prefer to sit back on the porch clutching a cold one and a shotgun to protect your property against the hordes of pooping cats? You classified them as vermin in an earlier post and was it your son who uses a paint ball gun?

 

[cutting42]

Obviously you do not believe in responsibility, it's simple Gareth, if your cat is a nuisance to neighbours then perhaps you should do the neighbourly thing and not have a cat!
People on this forum have stated that they do not use their machines in the evening so as not be a nuisance to their neighbours.
Same principle.

Roy.

Well I don't have a cat so it is a moot point but I am offended you draw the conclusion that I do not believe in responsibility period. I have stated my position very clearly in terms of responsibility for a cat owner and it is your right to express the view that people should not be allowed to own cats in case they behave naturally. You will be judged by some to be a NIMBY control freak and by others as a savior to the green lawn.

I also do not use power tools at anti social hours as I have social and personal responsibility for my actions and also for making sure my children behave and do not annoy other people amongst other things, it is what makes us create and maintain communities. But how can you assign or assume responsibility for something they have no control over?

So I ask, again, do you believe that cat ownership should be banned? I would also include your sympathizer flanajb in this question, or would you prefer to sit back on the porch clutching a cold one and a shotgun to protect your property against the hordes of pooping cats? You classified them as vermin in an earlier post and was it your son who uses a paint ball gun?

 

[flanajb]

Let's just wrap this up.

Cat's are a lazy persons pet. You only need to feed it as you don't care where it does it's toilet business. The argument that cats are wild and you can't train them is ridiculous and just a convenient way of people sherking their responsibilities. A dog would do the same as a cat if you let in roam around the neighbourhood, but people dont.

Cats should be confined to their owners gardens. And before you say "You can't do that" http://www.countrystoredirect.com/acata ... nment.html

At the end of the day, I pay my mortgage and work hard to keep my garden clean and tidy for my daughter to play in. Those of you who think that the possibility of my Daughter becoming seriously ill as a result of coming into contact with cat faeces is acceptable, then you obviously don't have children of your own.

 

[cutting42]

Let's just wrap this up.

Cat's are a lazy persons pet. You only need to feed it as you don't care where it does it's toilet business. The argument that cats are wild and you can't train them is ridiculous and just a convenient way of people sherking their responsibilities. A dog would do the same as a cat if you let in roam around the neighbourhood, but people dont.

Cats should be confined to their owners gardens. And before you say "You can't do that" http://www.countrystoredirect.com/acata ... nment.html

At the end of the day, I pay my mortgage and work hard to keep my garden clean and tidy for my daughter to play in. Those of you who think that the possibility of my Daughter becoming seriously ill as a result of coming into contact with cat faeces is acceptable, then you obviously don't have children of your own.

I am happy to let the discussion go but both you and Roy will make these sweeping accusations such as " you obviously don't have children of your own". How do you know this, you know very little about me? Also to accuse a cat as a lazy persons pet is pathetic, what about goldfish, or an ant farm, are you going to accuse their owners as lazy too or don't they count as you cant see them in your garden.

You have still not explained how to train a cat by the way, were are all still waiting, you claim it is easy and anyone not doing it is shirking their responsibility. Rather than typing out your theory, maybe you can point a website when other people have done it. Good luck

You have already welcomed all the other wildlife into your garden in a previous post. What sets cat poo apart from everything else in its danger except maybe your prejudice?