Candle Stick and candle Safety/selling

[mark sanger]

Hi all

In response to a conversation on another forum about candle sticks etc. I thought my findings may be of interest.

A while ago in another thread it was mentioned that in Australia you could not sell candle holders that did not have a metal insert and that if you were then you could have your stand closed down.

Different countries obviously have differing legislation in the ways that products are made and sold.

So based on this I wanted to find out where we stand in the UK in relation to the making and selling of candle sticks/holders.

Contact was made with Trading Standards a while ago with me asking for specific legislation in relation to Candle sticks etc.

There are No regulations specifically covering candle sticks. And there is nowhere in UK regs or law that says you have to include a metal insert for a candle stick.

However the product will come under the General Product safety Legislation 2005 ( copy of the link and others I have included below. )

Each is responsible for making sure that they conform to any legislation and I will not take responsibility for the information I post here or use of in anyway. Each should make sure they read and comply and I only post to help point others in the direction of this legislation.

Basically of course to be on the side of safety is the best option is to include a metal shield.

However there has been discussion also about "T" lights and that a shield should still be included.

This is not the case.

You could make a candle stick without a metal shield. Whether you do or do not if you are selling any product which is likely to cause injury or damage then you

"Must also supply safety information"

This safety information could be " This product does not include a candle shield , Do not allow the candle to burn down to the holder, do not leave burning unattended, etc etc etc etc" Again this is just an example of what may or may not be suitable advice. ( much more detail and industry standards are included in the links)

If you are selling Candles with candle sticks then you must buy law/regs include candle safety information. If you are not to date then you ARE breaching UK law and could be hung up by something painful if your item burns down someone's house or causes injury.

So in short you do not have to include an insert ( but best to I think). If you do or do not then you must supply safety information.

If you sell an item without a candle then you do not have to supply the candle safety advice. ( But I would suggest is would be prudent to do so.)

You have to think what will happen if something goes to court as the court will in my experience use the " what a reasonable member of the public would consider"

If suitable info is given then this is deemed to be satisfactory ( as I was told the consumer also has to apply common sense) and if they have been given all the info then we as makers can not do a lot more.

So if you are selling at a craft fair and someone comes to shut you down as you do not have metal inserts, ( they can not, as long as you have the safety info which is given out with each and every item). Even if you do not have the safety info to hand then you can voluntarily remove the items which is the preferred cause of action.

However as I said earlier aiming for best scenario is always better than trying to fight something in court and for a few pence for an insert then I would personally use them. But I do not use them for "T" lights as they already have a metal shield. ( again do what you want based on your own research of the info below, as saying " well Mark Sanger doesn't use one" to a solicitor won't hold much weight. I don't think !!)

I hope this info helps.



Safety of T lights and Candles
http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/+/http://www.berr.gov.uk/files/file21807.pdf

Trading Standards candle safety

http://www3.hants.gov.uk/tradingsta...sumeradvice/tradingstandards-candlesafety.htm


Bristish Candle Makers Safety
http://www.britishcandlemakers.org/Safety.htm

General Product Safety regulations 2005
http://www.berr.gov.uk/files/file22713.pdf

 

[tekno.mage]

Thanks for that useful information, Mark. I personally have not (as yet) made any candle holders for sale, although I have made tea-light holders as gifts for friends.

I do not use metal inserts in my tea-light holders as tea lights come in metal holders already. I do, however, only make tea light holders out of oak heartwood - which is one of the most difficult of the native woods to set alight without an awful lot of heat (try making up a fire using only oak heartwood, newspaper & matches!!!)

I also occasionally use old wooden candle holders (again made of oak) which do not have metal inserts - but have always followed rule one regarding candles - never leave a candle burning unattended!

It's interesting that you mention candles should be sold with safety information - I have recently bought both candles & tea-lights from retail shops. These came in boxes or shrink-wrapped packs with no safety information on them at all! A box of tea-lights I bought from a market stall, however, did have safety info printed on the box.

 

[gnu]

Never had and problems selling candle sticks, tea lights lamps etc in making retailing turned work over a 20 year professional carreer selling at shows, festivals, craft markets etc. The only encounters with health and safety will mostly be to do with demonstrating, making sure you have a screen in front of you lathe. As long as you apply common sense with you products you shouldn't have a problem.

 

[mark sanger]

Hi

I hope the info is of use.

gnu

I too have never had any problems. But just because we do not do it and no ones house has been set on fire by one of our products yet, is not reason I believe to not comply with the law.

After all next year you may have a solicitors letter drop onto your door mat and then the last 20 years will count for little.

However as I have said in my initial post. People can do what they want, based on the info I have posted which has come from the horses mouth.

I am not overly worried what other people do, just thought it may help if peeps were concerned who may want to cover all aspects.

Also seeing in civil law compensation has no limits and can often go far beyond our insurance policies then for me a few stickers is worth a few pounds investment.

Be complacent if we want of course but then we can repent at our leisure. Taking into account the amount of money we have to spend of solicitors fee's of course.

Kym

I also brought up the subject that I have purchased items without warnings on. I was informed that the people should and that if anything goes wrong then they are on offer with no recourse.

There are lots and lots of instances out there where others do not do the things they do.

Like not wearing seat belts.

But it is when they get caught out that they whine and bleat but still have to pay the fine.

Especially today in a litigation society with solicitors out their wanting to get the work and some extra commission. I have worked with them and once they smell blood it is interesting how frightening the initial harmless situation can turn.

Trust me when you think you are going to loose your home you will wish you had spent a bit more time researching and covering your back.

As I say.

I have given the info. Please all do with it as you will.

 

[skeetoids]

Hi Mark,

I am grateful to you for pointing this out.

Even as a hobby seller I never gave it any thought at all.

As you say, it won't do any harm to include a small sticker or leaflet to cover ourselves for safety and legal reasons.

It's definately a sign of our times.

I remeber as a child sitting in highly combustable sofas, flamable pyjamas, synthetic sheets, zips that bite, toys that take your eyes out, sweets that alter your brain chemistry, lead paint, licking batteries, easter eggs with loose sweets and cars with no seatbelts - just checked and apparently i'm fine!

Cheers,

Lee.

 

[mark sanger]

Hi Mark,

I am grateful to you for pointing this out.

Even as a hobby seller I never gave it any thought at all.

As you say, it won't do any harm to include a small sticker or leaflet to cover ourselves for safety and legal reasons.

It's definately a sign of our times.

I remeber as a child sitting in highly combustable sofas, flamable pyjamas, synthetic sheets, zips that bite, toys that take your eyes out, sweets that alter your brain chemistry, lead paint, licking batteries, easter eggs with loose sweets and cars with no seatbelts - just checked and apparently i'm fine!

Cheers,

Lee.

Are you sure your fine

As has been mentioned the chances of anything happening is very remote. Most of what retailers sell will already satisfy the various regs and will have been addressed by the manufacturer prior to going out to sale.

 

[Elaine]

Mark, thank you for taking the time to post this information. It is always useful to become aware of these issues before it goes horribly wrong,than wishing 'if only I had known it before it happened'
I will file this away in the old brainbox and when I make candle holders it will be there as a useful reminder.
Much appreciated. =D>

 

[Bodrighy]

Whilst I go along 100% with what Mark has said we need also to remember that it isn't just the wood. A lot of us use finishes that are also inflammable. The oak mentioned is safe enough but what about any finish on it? Personally I prefer to use glass inserts in T lights simply because I have seen wood smouldering with a T light burning low in it. It was pine which is easily set fire to but the potential danger is there and as Mark says, why take the chance for the sake of a few pence?

pete

 

[skeetoids]

Hi,

I agree with Pete.

I thought about this too and realised that a lot of finishes are also likely to be flammable.

I guess it is a mixture of common sense and taking on board the points that Mark has highlighted.

At the end of the day, none of us are intending to cause any harm, however, there was a very interesting case of a lady, who having experienced a power cut, placed several t-lights in the little aluminium cups in her empty bathtub. Not realising that the enamel on a bath is highly flammable and after some time the heat generated by the t lights caused the bath to ignite and you can guess what happened.

Strange thing is she sued the company she bought the t lights from and won becuase there was no safety information at all!

Food for thought possibly.

Cheers,

Lee.

 

[miles_hot]

Hi,

I agree with Pete.

I thought about this too and realised that a lot of finishes are also likely to be flammable.

I guess it is a mixture of common sense and taking on board the points that Mark has highlighted.

At the end of the day, none of us are intending to cause any harm, however, there was a very interesting case of a lady, who having experienced a power cut, placed several t-lights in the little aluminium cups in her empty bathtub. Not realising that the enamel on a bath is highly flammable and after some time the heat generated by the t lights caused the bath to ignite and you can guess what happened.

Strange thing is she sued the company she bought the t lights from and won becuase there was no safety information at all!

Food for thought possibly.

Cheers,

Lee.

Ah, now of course if she'd bought some of our insulating safety tea light holders that wouldn't have happened

Miles

 

[Bodrighy]

Basically it's the same principle as selling standard lamps. I have seen them all wired up at craft fairs but it is, I think, correct me if I am wrong, actually illegal to sell something like that wired up if you haven't got the right qualifications. You need to get it verified by someone who is for H&S reasons. Once you start selling your work you need to be aware of these things. No yew or laburnum goblets, no matter how pretty they are (need to check the yew as I have been told by an RPT member that it is safe to drink from) food safe finishes, fire hazards. Protect your back because against Mark points out we now live in a litigious society and you will get slammed if you aren't either protected or haven't put safety warnings on certain things. Common sense should apply but often doesn't. The drinking goblets I sell, I warn people that immersing them in hot water or a dishwasher may cause them to split. Common sense? Maybe but a lot of people are unaware.

pete

 

[Lightweeder]

I must admit, I've often wondered what the legal situation is, and it's nice to have a view on it. Thanks Mark.

 

[Jonzjob]

Mark, you have pointed out a very valid point and thank you for the time you have put into it!

I have had a small amount of contact wit trading standards and they are as bad as they who solicite. They try to be one jump ahead of the money grabbers and so appear to be lunatic in their zest in finding things wrong with what we do.

I asked Gloucester Trad Standards what the best way was with the rattles I was making and he asked how they were finished. I told him that they were covered with sunflower oil. He asked if they would burn? They are wood with oil on them, of course they will bloody well burn! His reply was to put a match under them for 5 seconds and if they didn't catch fire then I could certify them as fire safe. I only had to do that with a sample, i.e. not all of the rattles I was selling.

It raelly is a mad world and when you can get a HUGE settlement for drying you dog and killing it in a microwave because it didn't tell you that you couldn't then we all have to watch our backs me-thinks?