Startrite 352E or Hammer N3800

[Random Orbital Bob]

I couldn't agree more.....with bandsaws you sort of pass a threshold of quality once you reach about £900 and upwards and all your shortlist are gems in their own right.

 

[orchard]

Hahaha, I sense curious admixture of negative psychology and good old fashioned guilt, lol !
My noggin's fairly fried now, next step's to see how close sales want to get to the Record !

Thanks again !

I'm not helping am I

You sooooooo remind me of me when I was making this decision and your shortlist (minus the minimax) is almost identical to mine. You know the reason I posted this was because I didn't want people to have to suffer the decision making agony I went through

The BS does have soft start like the Startrite. No idea about the heat override (but don't forget that lovely 5 year warranty!.........know I'm not helping......Hi Mrs Orchard by the way, imagine how many holidays that price difference could buy....sheesh ). On chassis size, that was also a biggy for me because it is all related to beam strength. You cant cut straight if your beam strength is poor and the three most direct contributors to it are the tension forces in the chassis, the tension on the blade via the tensioning assembly and the blade itself. I personally eyeballed and closely inspected all the saws on my shortlist and was comfortable that every one of them had enough mass in their design to withstand the forces on the blade. Startrite even make some claim in their collateral that if I recall correctly, their tensioning spring is tested to 20,000 lb's per sq inch.

I know you want one of the European machines....and if you feel comfortable denying your good lady wife, who has shown you nothing but devotion and love throughout your marriage, then you should get one

 

[orchard]

-oh, and if anyone's looking for a used Hammer:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Hammer-band-s ... 418900aeaa

 

[Wizard9999]

My noggin's fairly fried now, next step's to see how close sales want to get to the Record !

Orchard

If I understand your comment correctly I think you are saying you are going to see what the best price is you can get Hammer to go to, so you can better take a view on the cost gap between the RP BS400 and the Hammer N3800. If that is the case thought I would mention I ordered my BS400 at teh recent D&M tool show and whilst Record Power show them on their website at £999, they were selling them at the show for £799 incl. free delivery. If they were doing that deal then I'd be surprised if they don't do the same at the Tewkesbury Saw show on 28th / 29th October. So I think any comparison of the Hammer should be versus the BS400 at that price.

Terry.

 

[orchard]

My noggin's fairly fried now, next step's to see how close sales want to get to the Record !

Orchard

If I understand your comment correctly I think you are saying you are going to see what the best price is you can get Hammer to go to, so you can better take a view on the cost gap between the RP BS400 and the Hammer N3800. If that is the case thought I would mention I ordered my BS400 at teh recent D&M tool show and whilst Record Power show them on their website at £999, they were selling them at the show for £799 incl. free delivery. If they were doing that deal then I'd be surprised if they don't do the same at the Tewkesbury Saw show on 28th / 29th October. So I think any comparison of the Hammer should be versus the BS400 at that price.

Terry.

What is this, The Terry and Bob tag-team ?

Fair point Terry, and if that's the case, they'll be half the reduced price and delivery Felder offered, once i've factored in £150 quid for a sparky and 2m spur to accommodate 20Amps.......

Thanks a bunch lads!

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

always like to help Orchard....how is Mrs Orchard by the way? Packing yet

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

we're saving you from yourself really....

 

[orchard]

always like to help Orchard....how is Mrs Orchard by the way? Packing yet

Hahaha, not quite yet thanks, she may yet have to sell her car to pay for a Hammer

 

[orchard]

we're saving you from yourself really....

I know. Thank you

Btw, what's the longest period you've resawn >9 inches hardwood for please, and how did the motor react ?

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

Orchard....have you actually read my review (wagging finger in ticking off a naughty child kind of way)?

OK, I'll assume you've just forgotten the bit where it clearly states that when I was resawing 12" Ash WET logs that the motor didn't even emit any change in tone denoting it was even under any load let alone slow down. This was in truth one of the things that really surprised me as I firstly thought it wouldn't even cut a 12" green log, then when it did I thought it would struggle. When it went through it like a knife through butter I was genuinely flabbergasted. I just didn't expect it to be so easy and effortless.

That session wasn't very long....only 10 minutes or so. I've done it many times since for up to an hour a time and its never blinked.

 

[orchard]

Haha, I always read you posts first Bob, however, in the light of our recent discussion, I think I ought to re-read both threads. Besides, it was quite late when I got onto the RP specific thread, not that I can excuse myself from being a whopper, although our cat ate the notes I made
Right, back to your thread

Orchard....have you actually read my review (wagging finger in ticking off a naughty child kind of way)?

OK, I'll assume you've just forgotten the bit where it clearly states that when I was resawing 12" Ash WET logs that the motor didn't even emit any change in tone denoting it was even under any load let alone slow down. This was in truth one of the things that really surprised me as I firstly thought it wouldn't even cut a 12" green log, then when it did I thought it would struggle. When it went through it like a knife through butter I was genuinely flabbergasted. I just didn't expect it to be so easy and effortless.

That session wasn't very long....only 10 minutes or so. I've done it many times since for up to an hour a time and its never blinked.

 

[no idea]

Just to throw in that I considered similar bandsaws (for hobby use) and went for the Record Power BS400. Why? A few reasons:

1) Good price (D&M show last year)
2) A good long chat with the Record guys at the show and a demonstration on the smaller BS350 convinced me that a BS400 would be more then I would ever need.
3) The realisation that the savings I'd make with this over a Startrite/Jet/Hammer could be used to fund other toys.

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

ah....the old "cat ate my homework" chestnut eh? I've heard it all before old son

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

actually noidea (& Terry) raise a good point which is that the way RP work is they attend a bunch of shows throughout the country. At each of these shows they offer a "show special" price which is always about a £100 less then their other deal which is usually a seasonal offer. They also pretty much always throw in free delivery. This means that if you buy from a show you get the retail down from £1000 to £800 (seasonal £100 plus show £100) and free delivery so its really about £300 less than a regular dealer.

I had a personal quotation from Hammer for the N3800 and it made blood ooze out of my eyes! Nothing was free (except he did eventually offer delivery after being brutalised by my negotiating). What really bugged me was the mitre fence was an extra £55....that's just mean. Delivery time was enormous, many weeks. It was all just so arrogant and the attitude was "why on earth wouldn't you want a Hammer" that that alone put me off them. If they had really fought for the business I might have coughed up the extra £600 they wanted. On the other hand, that's a Domino :shock:

 

[orchard]

actually noidea (& Terry) raise a good point which is that the way RP work is they attend a bunch of shows throughout the country. At each of these shows they offer a "show special" price which is always about a £100 less then their other deal which is usually a seasonal offer. They also pretty much always throw in free delivery. This means that if you buy from a show you get the retail down from £1000 to £800 (seasonal £100 plus show £100) and free delivery so its really about £300 less than a regular dealer.

I had a personal quotation from Hammer for the N3800 and it made blood ooze out of my eyes! Nothing was free (except he did eventually offer delivery after being brutalised by my negotiating). What really bugged me was the mitre fence was an extra £55....that's just mean. Delivery time was enormous, many weeks. It was all just so arrogant and the attitude was "why on earth wouldn't you want a Hammer" that that alone put me off them. If they had really fought for the business I might have coughed up the extra £600 they wanted. On the other hand, that's a Domino :shock:

I'm with you Bob, £600 is a lot of money for me, although so's $800-1k, and I don't want to spend that and end up with a Silverline-like door-stop, hence my caution/scepticism.
5 year guarantee rather than a one year though.....

 

[Hickorystick]

Hi Orchard
I'm taking a similar view to you. (see my thread in the Tools Review board - New Workshop choices)
I have been pretty well set on the N440 since I went to the Tool show in Newark back in April. I saw the Hammers there and was impressed with the quality of build however I do think that Bob et al have strong arguments, not least the price one.
I once did speak to a fairly arrogant salesman there who was very kindly going to offer me a huge 3% discount on a N4400. I tried to sound grateful and hung up. Having said that I had Felder on the phone today chasing business so I know they are keen. This guy was much better today and is preparing some big discounts at the Harrogate Show in November. Terry gave me the nudge about this thread and suggested that we might get a even better deal if buying 2 which is true enough and might be worth a call to test their reaction. If your interested let me know and we could test the water...
And if it works don't blame me for any marital issues !!

 

[dickm]

How about an ex-school 352 for £150? No chance, I got there first........................

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

That was my alternative solution ie the 2nd hand market for the industrial rated machines. I observed the 2nd hand channels for some months and in the end gave up. There was one Hammer that came up and it was still very expensive so no real advantage. Tons of really old Startrite 352's are always on e bay but they don't have the bigger capacities I wanted.

 

[orchard]

Hi Orchard
I'm taking a similar view to you. (see my thread in the Tools Review board - New Workshop choices)
I have been pretty well set on the N440 since I went to the Tool show in Newark back in April. I saw the Hammers there and was impressed with the quality of build however I do think that Bob et al have strong arguments, not least the price one.
I once did speak to a fairly arrogant salesman there who was very kindly going to offer me a huge 3% discount on a N4400. I tried to sound grateful and hung up. Having said that I had Felder on the phone today chasing business so I know they are keen. This guy was much better today and is preparing some big discounts at the Harrogate Show in November. Terry gave me the nudge about this thread and suggested that we might get a even better deal if buying 2 which is true enough and might be worth a call to test their reaction. If your interested let me know and we could test the water...
And if it works don't blame me for any marital issues !!

Thanks for the heads-up mate, although i'm still not sure where i'm going with this yet, and we'd have to factor in extra for one extra delivery too
Everyone was great(ish) that i've spoken with today, especially Hammer, who promptly phoned me back with an offer - btw their lead-times can be relatively short at the moment because they've pre-ordered a certain amount in stages over the coming months apparently

 

[orchard]

...still none the wiser here, as the Mrs. agrees that we don't ever need to go on vacation together again ever (and that if we're spending £800-1k, we may as well spend more if we need to to ensure the engineering's exactly what's needed and future-proof) i'm torn between:

Startrite 502E : like the table size, build's reputed to be solid, soft-start single-phase, so no sparky investment when we'll be moving in a year or two, put off by 'agricultural guides' -should I be ?

MINIMAX S45N : Think it may be a little light for max re-saw depth, cost+sparky could send me too far over budget.

Hammer N4400: Seems very good, although small-ish table, relatively

Felder FB510: Part of me's saying step-up from a Hammer, get an improved machine, extraction design, table, and over-spec for my future resawing needs.

RP BS400: Don't know much about this machine, anyone know of any decent reviews please ?




*Seriously though, the BS400's still in the mix, and would save a lot of cash........................