Porsche

[sploo]

If they truly were “worse in every measurable way” why do they sell so well? The Tesla Model Y was the best selling car in both Europe and America last year. I’ve had modest size SUV’s for nearly 20 years now. After test driving the first one I knew there was no going back to a saloon or hatchback. Far more comfortable and a better driving position. Also a darn sight easier to get in and out of many of them. They also seem to fare better in crash tests.

Why do people vote Tory? Why to people vote for Trump? Why do people buy manufactured pop music? Don't work under the illusion that the public are competent in making rational decisions

Having ended up with an god-awful SUV as a loan vehicle once I will concede that they are indeed a lot easier to get in and out of; especially when your knees make noises like an old modem connecting to the Internet.

(EDIT: my knees are like an old modem; I wasn't making a jibe about the infirm)

As to why folks buy big fugly SUV, look no further;

Arms race to the bottom

There was another study from Uni
Michigan looking at purchasing rationales, which I can't find now.

Where a consumer can choose between a regular vehicle or an SUV-type vehicle (i.e. excluding professional or locality, eg builders and folks living off road etc) basically the high driving position and bulk make women feel faster, and allow men to project masculinity.

The Detroit car industry tried to suppress that study because it found essentially that men who scored high in perceived masculine attributes (income, sports involvement, # children, self-esteem etc.) generally drove station wagons, mpvs, and other types of family- and group- oriented vehicles, whereas men who scored lower on the self-esteem scale drove SUVs.

The controversial conclusion was the men who were having lots of kids (i.e sex) and were involved in tonnes of sports (physically active, social group leadership) needed roomy vehicles to move a their kids, their teams, and their gear.

On the other side, men who lacked self confidence and felt oppressed drove SUV and light trucks to project masculinity and virility.

In short, guys with big 'richards' drive mini vans.

As an owner of a station wagon (estate) I fully approve of this message

 

[MikeJhn]

As to why folks buy big fugly SUV, look no further;

Arms race to the bottom

There was another study from Uni
Michigan looking at purchasing rationales, which I can't find now.

What an utter load of rubbish, trying to compare the US road infrastructure too the UK must be the most ridiculous facile argument on vehicle choice from the whole of this thread and lets face it the Americans don't have any taste when it comes to vehicles or Presidents.

 

[Terry - Somerset]

Considering changing the family size hatch I currently drive.

Sadly I have reached the age where a car seat at roughly the same level as my rear (when standing) makes entry and exit far less of a trial of increasingly defective knee joints. SUV here I come!

Over the years I have owned several (non-premium) sports cars - the joys of hood down performance is now an inadequate reward for the effort of levering myself in and out every time I go somewhere.

 

[sploo]

What an utter load of rubbish, trying to compare the US road infrastructure too the UK must be the most ridiculous facile argument on vehicle choice from the whole of this thread and lets face it the Americans don't have any taste when it comes to vehicles or Presidents.

Considering the last decade of the UK's voting decisions I don't think we're in a great position to throw stones.

Fair point about the roads though; the US has basically had a (size) automotive arms race for decades, so they're well advanced on the slide towards driving tanks.

 

[Yorkieguy]

Porsche basically invented the premium SUV segment with the cayenne. They were the first of the sports car brands to jump on board and everybody laughed their socks off. 20 years later and they all have egg in their face as they follow suit: Aston, Bentley, jaguar, Lamborghini, Ferrari even have one on the way too.

As a car nut and driving purist I have found the concept fairly abhorrent but I have also discovered over the years the best way to deal with it... These brands are making 50% of their profits making SUVs now, that gives them more cash to spend on developing proper sports cars, and it isn't actually compromising the quality of their core products.

So if you want a sporty SUV, buy one.
If you want to continue enjoying their purist driving cars, buy one.

But either way there is no point getting offended by what other people are buying, and the sports car brands are simply feeding the demand in the market in order to make money and not get left behind. They are a business after all.

Ultimately, nobody loses, we can all continue to have what we want

Martin

The Cayenne was launched in 2003. Below is a clip from an article written around 2007, reflecting on the success of the Cayenne:

Quote:

On motoring websites at the time, the Cayenne got a far from unanimous thumbs-up on launch. And a more serious car magazine article stated: “Porsche has no more business making an SUV than McDonalds has selling hamburgers by candlelight”.

But Porsche was smart in the way they communicated the Cayenne.

They had a pre-launch campaign about the Cayenne targeted at existing Porsche owners. This cleverly drew on Porsche’s history in building off-road cars that competed in rallies. In this way, they were able to explain in detail the rationale behind the Cayenne. Porsche 911 drivers still might not have loved the Cayenne, but they could be made to feel neutral.

the engine and body shape of the Cayenne was authentically Porsche, creating a distinctive and premium priced value proposition. If you had a Porsche 911 but then had a family, here was a Porsche your family could fit in.

As a result, the Cayenne was a big hit in sales terms. The UK sales figures for Porsche showed that that the Cayenne, launched in 2003, fuelled growth of 60% over 3 years. Globally, the Cayenne made up 50% of Porsche’s volume.

End quote.

Regardless of what sceptics might think, the Cayenne was a shrewd move and a huge success for Porsche - they even got the name right.

Source: https://thebrandgym.com/the-porsche-cayenne-successful-stretch/

 

[Blackswanwood]

The Cayenne was launched in 2023. Below is a clip from an article written around 2007, reflecting on the success of the Cayenne:

I thought only DeLoreans did time travel

 

[Lons]

the US has basically had a (size) automotive arms race for decades, so they're well advanced on the slide towards driving tanks.

Every US car I've driven has been a tank, even some of the muscle cars are about as responsive as a barge on a canal. OK for wide straight roads over the pond where you can stick it in cruise and wallow for miles on end. Come a cropper a bit in places like San Francisco as I discovered.

 

[sploo]

Every US car I've driven has been a tank, even some of the muscle cars are about as responsive as a barge on a canal. OK for wide straight roads over the pond where you can stick it in cruise and wallow for miles on end. Come a cropper a bit in places like San Francisco as I discovered.

I have "fond" memories of a rental Chevrolet Impala, complete with the sleepiest 3 speed auto slush box I've ever encountered. The suspension was so bad the car would roll around, and sometimes skip sideways, if put under any kind of cornering force. As I was driving it near/around Yosemite national park at the time (with some very big drops to the side of the roads) it made for an interesting journey.

 

[Lons]

I have "fond" memories of a rental Chevrolet Impala, complete with the sleepiest 3 speed auto slush box I've ever encountered. The suspension was so bad the car would roll around, and sometimes skip sideways, if put under any kind of cornering force. As I was driving it near/around Yosemite national park at the time (with some very big drops to the side of the roads) it made for an interesting journey.

Our last trip was a 5 week, several canyons, Lake Powell, Monument Valley, Vegas, Death Valley, Mamoth Lakes, Yosemites, Carmell and San Francisco. In a Crysler 300 which tbh wasn't as bad as some other experiences - except for San Francisco.

 

[Yorkieguy]

I thought only DeLoreans did time travel

Ooops - thanks for spotting that 'intellectual interlude' (formerly known as a 'senior moment'), which I I've corrected.

 

[MikeJhn]

"Intellectual interlude" love it, must use is somewhere, probably in the pub next Tuesday, only go once a week now days.

 

[SammyQ]

In my time, I've driven a reasonable number of cars; owned and short-term leased The average sports car - particularly Lotus's - seems (ergonomically) to be catering for people under 5'3". Compensating for...? At 6', there is no way I can get into a frog-eye Sprite, Midget, Spitfire etc. The 'low slung bum' models leave me utterly unmoved too. The road vision is awful,the predictably hard suspension is totally uncomfortable and getting out (at 68yrs old) is now, realistically, a job for a hoist. And, don't get more started on Alpha's and their endemic rust. A colleague bought one new at £18k. Three years later it was worth £3k!
I have a simple Golf SV. Roomy, high seat height, great road view, good storage and luggage space, repairs and parts reasonable. Performance is surprising, and in keeping with my reaction speed these days.
Just sayin'...sometimes a car is just that, a car. A tool for A to B. Admiring smooth lines is one thing, elevating said aerodynamic exercises to the point of idolatry is, well, disproportionate??

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Who needs cars?

 

[selectortone]

Who needs cars?

Me (73, 5'11")

Note: no hairdressing tools left in this vehicle overnight

 

[SammyQ]

Phil? I have to say, petrol-head-phobic as I am, that bike is just plumb gorgeous...wannit!!
Sam

 

[Phil Pascoe]

I had to sell it when I had the first leg amputated 10 years ago. It's out in the Czech Republic now. 1900cc V twin.