HSE and chip limiting tooling defined

[tool613]

Was at the HSE site and noted what they call this

Illegal cutting irons (no chip limitation)

http://www.hse.gov.uk/woodworking/crosscut.htm



clearly the body of these trenching heads are chip limiting. I can see other reasons for it being Illegal but not because of its lack of chip limiting.

am I missing something here?

jack
English machines

 

[blackrodd]

From what little i know of HSE's requirements I would guess and say for starters the large gaps in the cutter area are likely to pull you're hand, or extremities in to the cutterblock.
The square block was banned in spindle moulder or overhand planer/jointer for the same reason, unless it was a well guarded thicknesser only machine.
Regards Rodders

 

[heimlaga]

Personally I would avoid that kind of tooling because if the bolted on knives whose bolts may get fatigued over time. Not because of it's ability to pull stuff in.

I have had a bit of a fight with some safety inspectors and insurance company employees lately over my machines. They claimed that it is illegal tu use machines or tooling that aren't CE approved. They said that I must scrap everything and buy new.
I told that the home made guards on my machines are made to modern standard and the electrical system is updated so everythin is as safe as on a new machine. I also told them that I am unable to afford new machinery without going bankrupt and ending up on the dole and I am not going to do that whatever government says unless they pay for it.

After a lot of quarreling back and forth it became clear that the higher up in their hierarchy the case got the less rigid were the rules and in the end I was told that if an old machine is updated to modern standards it is okay according to Finnish law. The low ranking inspectors were much more rigid than the law. Probably in order to promote their own career.

Maybe this is a similar case?

 

[Peter Sefton]

The HSE web site is much improved but still misleading in places including your example. Info sheet 37 covers tooling in more detail
http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/wis37.pdf

 

[tool613]

The HSE web site is much improved but still misleading in places including your example. Info sheet 37 covers tooling in more detail
http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/wis37.pdf

so if this cutter is set to no more than 3 mm projection is it legal if the if does indeed have the location pins for stacking blocks?

jack
English machines

 

[Peter Sefton]

I would say the technical points of the English HSE are not going to be a problem for you but I would suggest this block does not comply to BS EN 847-1: 1997 as set out in info sheet 37.

 

[tool613]

thank you peter . do you have that link?
jack
English machines

 

[Peter Sefton]

I would try goggle and prepare yourself for a long read. I have never read the documents but went on a HSE training course back in the late 90s. I refer and teach from the HSE sheets which I have rewritten and made into a training aid as used in my wood machining course running this week. We also have to use risk assessments and safe systems of work to comply with the ACOP 's.
http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/books/l114.htm

 

[tool613]

Peter very interesting reading. While i did not find anything on the bolt on knifes being illegible there use is unclear on machine types. machines other than a note that square blocks are not to be used in spindle mouldes or hand feed machines. Machine type and use may be were this is not suited to the RAS are my thoughts as far a HSE.

I Have begun to run this type head and a tell you in the right hands can be made safe IMO . but I am in Canada not the UK.

jack
English machines

 

[riclepp]

I would say the technical points of the English HSE are not going to be a problem for you but I would suggest this block does not comply to BS EN 847-1: 1997 as set out in info sheet 37.

Hi Peter and Jack

The BS Standard has been updated to this BS EN 847-1:2013. So I would imagine that the safety sheet will also be updated soon'ish.

Hope this helps