Home made threadless vice

[JohnPW]

I'm interested in making a wooden vice, threadless if possible, for the work bench I'm going to build.

I found this drawing of sort of leg vice that seem to use a wedge and a cam:

It's from http://benchnotes.com/Wedge%20Clamps/wedge_clamps.htm

It said the weighted wedge is operated by a string through the bench top, but I can't work out how this vice works. Any ideas?

 

[marcros]

It works the same as a leg vice- well the physics do. The wedge locks in place the chop at a minimal distance from the workpiece. The lower parallel guide prevents racking and allows the top clamp or screw to apply force.

Why are you trying to avoid a screw? This looks like a solution to a problem that doesn't exist! I would be concerned that your wedge couldn't lock the chop where you wanted it to- there must be a blind spot along the travel.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

I think for the wedge to work the angle of the wedge would have to be so low that the opening of the vice could only be an inch or two - if the angle were higher the wedge would move when the cam was operated.

 

[AndyT]

Agreeing with the posts above and spelling out the steps in use:

If the gap is just right, flip the cam to hold the work.
If the gap is too small, pull the jaw out allowing the wedge to drop down in its matching slot. At the bottom, swap the pin over to the hole nearest the back. Flip the cam.
If the gap is too big, lift the wedge up on its string, remove the pin, slide the jaw in, replace pin in appropriate hole nearest the back, flip cam.

 

[Cheshirechappie]

In thirty years of woodworking I've never come across any device like this illustrated in use, and I think there's good reason for that. The world is littered with Nice Ideas that won't work. I think this is one such.

Applying any force with the cam will cause the wedge to move upwards, unless it's very firmly restrained. Restraining it means loosening, adjusting and retightening something every time the vice opening needs changing, which would be a faff. Additional minor disadvantages are having a piece of string (for lifting the wedge) lying around and getting in the way on the benchtop, and the handle of the cam-clamp when in the locked position sticking out at an awkward and potentially painful height and location.

Please forgive me for being Mr Negative, but I think you'd be much better off with finding a Record or similar face vice, or building a leg vice with a conventional screw. Both methods are extensively tried and tested, and are known to work.

 

[AndyT]

I agree with Cheshirechappie.

Although I find the old Popular Mechanics magazines a fascinating read, they are peppered with ideas that I'm sure were never more than drawings. For instance, here's another impractical home made vice from the same source and same period:

I really can't believe that standing on the foot pedal would grip well enough to be any use at all.

If you really want to avoid making or paying for something with a screw thread on, you could try a 'crochet' on the front and a simple stop (or thin wedged slot) on the top surface.

 

[Sheffield Tony]

I really can't believe that standing on the foot pedal would grip well enough to be any use at all.

Hang on a minute while I go and chop up my shave horse for firewood.

Agreed though, can't imagine it being an effective system - and how do you adjust it for the requred opening ? Tie knots in the string ? Anyway, making a wooden vice looks like a perfect excuse for a play with screw thread cutting !

 

[Phil Pascoe]

A shave horse isn't designed to hold anything vertically, though, is it?

 

[AndyT]

A shave horse is beautifully designed to suit the position of the worker and grip tighter if the pull (accompanied by an equal push on the feet) is stronger. But I don't fancy the idea of planing a long piece of timber while keeping all your weight on one foot on the vice pedal. Let the pressure up for a moment and the work would be released to fly forward or drop on the floor, while your plane crash lands on the bench.

Another thought for the OP - you can improvise a lot with a few screws as stops to push against. Or if you need a firm fixing, cramp a scrap block to the bench and use second cramp to hold the work onto the same block.

 

[marcros]

slightly removed from the way that the discussion is going, but i do like the leg vice that i used for my bench. I think that they have become more popular once again through some of the popular bloggers, but if i was to re-make my bench, I would certainly include a leg vie on it.

 

[swb58]

I agree with Cheshirechappie.

Although I find the old Popular Mechanics magazines a fascinating read, they are peppered with ideas that I'm sure were never more than drawings. For instance, here's another impractical home made vice from the same source and same period:

I really can't believe that standing on the foot pedal would grip well enough to be any use at all.

If you really want to avoid making or paying for something with a screw thread on, you could try a 'crochet' on the front and a simple stop (or thin wedged slot) on the top surface.

In it's defence, there is a ratchet system at part E and the leg, don't know how much force can be applied at the jaws though.

 

[AndyT]

In it's defence, there is a ratchet system at part E and the leg, don't know how much force can be applied at the jaws though.

Fair point - I'd missed that. I think I'll stick with my Record 52½ for now though. :wink;

 

[dh7892]

I've had a look at threadless vices before. Here's a home-made one:

http://www.instructables.com/id/Leg-Vise-Threadless/step7/Jaws

This one looks really good but expensive.

http://www.hovartercustomvise.com/

 

[lanemaux]

It occurs to me that if the wedge were to be "stepped" and the recieving surface were notched accordingly then the idea might work surprisingly well. Probably not as practical as made by Wilton (my own favorite) but a reasonable clamping pressure could be achieved without an overly long wedge, that being the biggest drawback I see in the design. With say 4 or 5 steps you could use the shown 45 degrees or so and get a useful jaw opening and still apply cam without slipping upwards. A batton at the rear of the wedge to very near the floor would provide the final bearing stop and a more convienient adjustment method as well. Just poke your toe under and lift to readjust. Might just be fun to give it a fiddle to see if it would work as scrap wood and time are the major expences.

 

[matmac]

why not have the piece of leather or what ever thats attached to the vice head also attached to a weight so ineffect the weight always pulls against the workpiece. Then use the foot pedel as a way of releasing the pressure? not fully thought out but might work?

 

[James C]

I feel that I should share this having pondering this question myself recently.

It could be adapted for Traditional Vertical Leg Vice

I first saw it on LostArtPress

http://www.kapeldesigns.blogspot.co.uk/2014/08/the-nicholson-bench-with-holdfast-vice.html

 

[AndyT]

Now that is a good design!
And no bits of string needed...

 

[J_SAMa]

EDIT: nevermind, James got here first

 

[JohnPW]

The reason for a threadless vice is lighter weight. I want to make a work bench that quickly knocks down, using wedges. It would taken apart after every session or at least at the end of the day. The top would be a separate piece and I though having an extra lump of 10 to 20 kg of metal sticking out at one end of the top would making it awkward to handle, even though it would have the advantage of making the work bench heavier.

But I actually do have several metal vices; a Record 52 1/2, 52*, and also smaller one, can't remember the number off hand. So I'm just looking at other possiblities.

The idea of using a holdfast horizontally, against the leg or bench front of course is not a new one, you could add guide rails and a wooden cheek to make it more convenient to use, in effect you'd have a vice and the holdfast is just supply the clamping pressure.

Eg:

How about a vice that works like a F cramp? You would have slightly loose fitting rails that go into the bence and the final locking could be done with cam.

A wooden screw would be nice but from what I've seen they and the tool for making them are very expensive, I've got a large old and rusty C cramp that could provide a metal screw to try out for making a vice.


*I had to stuff the Record 52 1/2 and 52 together in a suitcase and bring them home on the bus, never again!

 

[bridger]

I'm interested in making a wooden vice, threadless if possible, for the work bench I'm going to build.

I found this drawing of sort of leg vice that seem to use a wedge and a cam:


It's from http://benchnotes.com/Wedge%20Clamps/wedge_clamps.htm

It said the weighted wedge is operated by a string through the bench top, but I can't work out how this vice works. Any ideas?

my biggest issue with this design is that it uses two different mechanisms for the upper and lower bars. replace the pin on the lower bar with a wedge, gang it to the upper wedge, work out the slip issue and you'll be getting somewhere.