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Hand plane blade problem

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Jacob

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I bought this from ITS: Vaunt Honing Guide - it has a stamp on the side telling me lengths to use for 25c and 30c angles

I'm not so concerned right now about blade sharpness, just want the thing to protrude level from the sole.



Apologies, I'm a bit unclear. You're saying repositioning the frog will solve the issue? I have moved the frog forwards and backwards and each time I get the same result. But when I put a washer underneath the frog it made the blade 99% level. Is grinding the blade skew the opposite way also going to help with levelling?
I'm saying that there is only one position for the frog (co-planar with the back of the mouth etc see above). Then alter the skew on the blade to suit - basically by putting more pressure towards the side you need to remove most from as you grind at 25º with your jig..
 

worker

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Ok thanks, I think I'm in a good place for next steps, much appreciated!
 

Limey Lurker

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I think, that before you go any further, you should test your honing guide by (1) coating the bevel end of the blade with marker ink (2) fitting the blade into the guide with the clamping nut on the LEFT (3) taking a couple of strokes on the hone (4) noting from where ink has been removed from the blade (5) removing the blade from the guide (6) refitting the blade to the guide with the clamping nut on the RIGHT (7) repeating (3) and (4).. This should show some of the possible inaccuracies in the Honing Guide. If the roller of the guide is not at right angles to the bed of the guide, or the two parts of the bed are not co-planer, the result will be an out-of-square bevel. There is more likelihood of the imported guide being faulty than your Stanley plane. I cannot comment on the quality of Hilka tools, as I have no experience of them.
 

Jacob

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I think, that before you go any further, you should test your honing guide by (1) coating the bevel end of the blade with marker ink (2) fitting the blade into the guide with the clamping nut on the LEFT (3) taking a couple of strokes on the hone (4) noting from where ink has been removed from the blade (5) removing the blade from the guide (6) refitting the blade to the guide with the clamping nut on the RIGHT (7) repeating (3) and (4).. This should show some of the possible inaccuracies in the Honing Guide. If the roller of the guide is not at right angles to the bed of the guide, or the two parts of the bed are not co-planer, the result will be an out-of-square bevel. There is more likelihood of the imported guide being faulty than your Stanley plane. I cannot comment on the quality of Hilka tools, as I have no experience of them.
Not "faulty" it's just a simple cheap guide with a central wheel and basically will reproduce the skew on any blade you put in. But that's OK you just have to work against it and press down to skew it the other way.
Honing guides promise much but don't deliver - you still have to work at it and keep your eyes on what's going on.
 

Jacob

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Just had a dodgy looking 4 1/2 arrive from Ebay. Quite interesting little things wrong with it:
1 Stiff tilt lever. Turned out to be an old laminated Record blade (excellent - worth more than I paid for the whole plane) but sitting in a Stanley body and the slot in the blade is narrow and tight fit. 2 minutes with a file in the slot and it fits perfectly.
2 Blade looks sharp but won't cut - shavings jammed under the cap iron. Turned out to have jagged edge and a bad fit against the blade. 1 minute on my lathe sanding disc to tidy it up.
3 Cuts better but not perfect - no obvious reason, frog looks aligned with mouth OK but take it off for a look.
4 Frog has washers under it!! Not just one per bolt, but two! Closer look shows grease under the front mating surface of frog so it must have been clear of the machined bit of the sole and the whole thing pivoting on the stack of washers. No wonder it would't cut it - the most necessarily solid bit of the plane was effectively a loose fit just sitting on washers!
5 Replace frog without washers - carefully align with back of mouth to make them flat and "co planar". Worrying bit here - there might be an issue which the washers were supposed to solve - but no:
6 Cuts perfectly! That's all it took 10 minutes or so. Doesn't even need sharpening. Could do with a clean up it looks like junk.

I posted this here to show our OP worker why he shouldn't fiddle with his frogs, least of all put washers under. Just get them aligned and well bolted down in the right position. Swapping frogs between planes not good idea either - they'd likely both fit badly. They must be firmly seated, machined surface to machined surface with no washers or anything underneath.

PS Cuts perfectly! was slight exaggeration - it cut OK but this was on the 25º recently ground bevel it came with, which also had a nice gentle camber. Cuts perfectly now I've honed at about 30º freehand on an oil stone.- one more minute of my life gone!
 
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cowtown_eric

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figure this out and yer on yer way to becoming a rhikenologist

.Suggest you put the square across the face of the blade and grind it square and make it sharp as others have said before me.

Further I would suggest putting a straight-edge along the sole to ensure it is reasonably flat!. I had a plane that I couldn't get to cut until I realized that the sole was concave by about a 16th of an inch. It hit the trash bucket.

Eric
 

Jacob

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Vids from Paul Sellers. thought it might help our O.P. worker
He explains that the frog should be set in line with the mouth as a default position, but is adjustable forwards (but not back).
It's obvious that the machined parts of the frog should meet the machined parts of the sole for this to be possible and for a firm seating.
 

Jacob

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Vids from Paul Sellers. thought it might help our O.P. worker
He explains that the frog should be set in line with the mouth as a default position, but is adjustable forwards (but not back).
It's obvious that the machined parts of the frog should meet the machined parts of the sole for this to be possible and for a firm seating.
I've never bothered with adjusting the gap and have always set frog to mouth co-planar.
Thought I'd have a go with Paul's bedrock style mouth adjuster suggestion but have to say it doesn't work, for me at least.
It takes only a tiny movement of the frog screws to loosen it enough to make it adjustable without having it rocking about, but the set didn't stay the same, which means the machining isn't that perfect. But anyway after planing a bit the whole frog became loose as the screws eased themselves out.
Maybe it works for Sellers but I think he may be winging it with a "good idea" not tested enough! He's normally pretty reliable and sensible though.
 

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