Apples&Oranges: Laguna Fusion3 or iTECH 01332?

[Val]

I'm thinking of buying a 10" table saw and I've eyed these two models. I know they are a bit different, and I know that the iTECH 01332 is just a rebranded Chinese machine like the SIP, but I wonder if the actual difference is worth the £1,400 price difference between the two. In particular, I think about these differences:
- Laguna has cabinet mounted trunnions, iTECH has motor attached to cast iron top
- Laguna has a 2:1 gearbox ratio for the arbor wheels, iTECH has 1:1 (I assume less precision)
- Fence seems to better on the Laguna, but I don't see anyone screaming miracle here on the forum

What I plan to do with the table saw is:
- precisely ripping long and thick timber (usually around 70mm)
- cross cutting with a sled smaller pieces (my mitre saw is not precise enough and I can't be bothered doing it by hand)
- I don't plan to cut sheets of anything as I have a track saw
- I don't plan to use a dado set, as I prefer the router table

I'm going to use my workbench as the outfeed table, so I'm not interested in the saw having one. The same for the built-in wheels, as I don't plan to move it (I'd rather move the workbench). I may or may not incorporate a router table (currently have a stand alone table) in the future. I also like the fact that the iTECH has a more compact footprint compared to the Fusion3, as space comes at a premium in my workshop. I've read many reviews complaining about the "fiddliness" of the iTECH in terms of set up, is it true and is it more fiddly than the Laguna? More or less fiddly than properly setting up a band saw?

Do you think I would regret buying the iTECH given that I probably could afford the Laguna? Any thoughts?
As usual thanks everyone in advance for your help!

P.S.: I forgot to say that I don’t plan to buy a second hand Sedgwick or similar as here in NI there’s little choice for s/h stuff and usually are more expensive than a brand new Laguna

 

[Bojam]

Since no one else has stepped up, I'll throw in my 2p's worth. Disclaimer, I have never used either of these table saws so my comments are general.

If this is for hobby or light pro (artisanal) work then I'm pretty confident that the iTech machine will do everything you need. I have a PT and bandsaw manufactured in the Far East (by Holzprofi) and they have been great. I can't fault the build quality nor the accuracy and reliability of performance. If I was running a production shop then I'd probably want machines that were heavier duty. I use the machines pretty much daily and they've never let me down but they don't run 8 hours a day 5 days a week.

The Laguna might have more bells and whistles but ultimately what you need is a capable saw with a powerful enough motor, precision ground flat top and a solid fence that is easy to adjust and stays in place once locked. I'd be very surprised if the iTech didn't deliver these features. You mention reviews that say the iTech is fiddly to set up. Is this just initial calibration or every time you need to adjust the fence or blade? If it's the latter then I can see that might be annoying. How much fiddling is required - 30 seconds, a minute...much more?

The Laguna Fusion saws look real nice. So do the Harvey saws. Incidentally both Laguna and Harvey are manufactured in the Far East but obviously to high QC standards. The iTech machines imo look very good too and if I was in the UK my PT and bandsaw would probably be iTech. Talk to the guys at @ScottandSargeant as I'm sure they will be able to give you the lowdown on the iTech range.

 

[Val]

Since no one else has stepped up, I'll throw in my 2p's worth. Disclaimer, I have never used either of these table saws so my comments are general.

If this is for hobby or light pro (artisanal) work then I'm pretty confident that the iTech machine will do everything you need. I have a PT and bandsaw manufactured in the Far East (by Holzprofi) and they have been great. I can't fault the build quality nor the accuracy and reliability of performance. If I was running a production shop then I'd probably want machines that were heavier duty. I use the machines pretty much daily and they've never let me down but they don't run 8 hours a day 5 days a week.

The Laguna might have more bells and whistles but ultimately what you need is a capable saw with a powerful enough motor, precision ground flat top and a solid fence that is easy to adjust and stays in place once locked. I'd be very surprised if the iTech didn't deliver these features. You mention reviews that say the iTech is fiddly to set up. Is this just initial calibration or every time you need to adjust the fence or blade? If it's the latter then I can see that might be annoying. How much fiddling is required - 30 seconds, a minute...much more?

The Laguna Fusion saws look real nice. So do the Harvey saws. Incidentally both Laguna and Harvey are manufactured in the Far East but obviously to high QC standards. The iTech machines imo look very good too and if I was in the UK my PT and bandsaw would probably be iTech. Talk to the guys at @ScottandSargeant as I'm sure they will be able to give you the lowdown on the iTech range.

Thank you very much for your reply, Bojam! It would be for "light pro" usage, so they're surely not going to run 8h a day! I've seen some topics of people with issues with the worm gear (but it could've been some older machines) and other complaining about the fence, but since I cannot see these machines live I'm not able to make my own mind - that's why it would be great if anyone with a recent iTECH/SIP 01332 would give me a bit of advice!
Incidentally, on the iTECH it seems like a sliding carriage can be mounted and I would be curious to know more about it and if it's of an acceptable level of quality.
On the Laguna of course there's plenty of reviews online so I'm sure of its quality (I also have a Laguna 12BX bandsaw and it's really good).

 

[Yojevol]

I agree with @Bojam . I get the impression that Laguna are improving old designs, making them look nice and presentable and selling them at a premium price. I was looking at their drum sander, a tasty bit of kit, but essentially it will do the same job as my 30 year old Jet.
I also agree that Scott+Sergeant are a good company, You won't go for wrong with them
Brian

 

[Val]

I agree with @Bojam . I get the impression that Laguna are improving old designs, making them look nice and presentable and selling them at a premium price. I was looking at their drum sander, a tasty bit of kit, but essentially it will do the same job as my 30 year old Jet.
I also agree that Scott+Sergeant are a good company, You won't go for wrong with them
Brian

I have to say I also have a Laguna 16/36 Supermax and it's really good, but to be fair it looks like a straight rebranding - I don't know if the 14BX is a rebranding too, though!
Glad to hear @ScottandSargeant are a reputable company, as I was planning to buy from them their iTECH 260SS planer/thicknesser as well

 

[sawdustandwax]

you may find both a little underpowered, for 70mm rips you need grunt, particularly in hardwood or if you want to do many. Given the lack of s/h machines there another to consider is the scheppach precisa 6 without the extension tables etc.

 

[Bojam]

Glad to hear @ScottandSargeant are a reputable company, as I was planning to buy from them their iTECH 260SS planer/thicknesser as well

All my dealings with @ScottandSargeant have been great. Friendly and knowledgeable. One order that went slightly awry was corrected promptly with no fuss.

I ordered my machines from Holzprofi only because I'm based in French Guiana and their French office could offer me the best service on delivery and I found their customer service to be first class. If I had been elsewhere then Scosarg would likely have been my first port of call.

 

[Val]

you may find both a little underpowered, for 70mm rips you need grunt, particularly in hardwood or if you want to do many. Given the lack of s/h machines there another to consider is the scheppach precisa 6 without the extension tables etc.

I have checked that model, as I had never heard of it, but I see it's well over the £3K mark... a bit too much for my pockets unfortunately.

So a 10" 3hp saw would struggle ripping 70mm thick hardwood? I'm not talking about hundreds of cuts a month, and nothing harder than sapele or oak.

 

[Bojam]

I have checked that model, as I had never heard of it, but I see it's well over the £3K mark... a bit too much for my pockets unfortunately.

So a 10" 3hp saw would struggle ripping 70mm thick hardwood? I'm not talking about hundreds of cuts a month, and nothing harder than sapele or oak.

I'm surprised to hear that a 3hp 10" bench saw might struggle with 70mm rips in hardwood. But I'll defer to folk who know more. I use the bandsaw or a tracksaw on a homemade MFT bench for ripping tropical hardwoods. Neither is particularly powerful but both get the job done. Tracksaw can cut stock up to 50mm thick and copes fine with Purpleheart, Marblewood, etc.

Out of interest what are you making that requires 70mm deep rips in hardwoods? Seems dimensionally large for furniture. Can you make those cuts on the bandsaw and then use a PT to clean up the edges? That's my go to solution.

 

[sawdustandwax]

'Struggle' is a wrong take, both would cut 70mm hardwood, just wouldn't want to personally cut 10 or 20 long lengths in a row on one.
It causes less fatigue on you, using a more powerful saw, which is the point I was making and clearly should have said. The scheppach I've seen advertised at around the same price as the laguna, which why I mentioned it, though don't know what extra is charged to ship to N.I.

 

[Spectric]

If you are ripping large timbers then why a 10 inch saw, a 12 inch saw would be capable of cutting what you may not yet thought of and the Itech has a 3 Kw motor so plenty of power ! Unless you are going to make money from woodworking then the Laguna saws are a lot more money for something that you may nor fully benefit from.

 

[Bojam]

'Struggle' is a wrong take, both would cut 70mm hardwood, just wouldn't want to personally cut 10 or 20 long lengths in a row on one.
It causes less fatigue on you, using a more powerful saw, which is the point I was making and clearly should have said. The scheppach I've seen advertised at around the same price as the laguna, which why I mentioned it, though don't know what extra is charged to ship to N.I.

Good point. I guess it depends what kind of work the OP is planning and how often he’ll need to make this sort of deep rip?

What would be the advantage of doing this on a table saw over a bandsaw? Just the cleanness of the cut? Speed as well? I like the relative safety of ripping on a bandsaw, as long as it is well set up with a good sharp blade. But then I’m never rushing (as in a couple of extra minutes to make the cut and clean it up isn’t a deal breaker).

 

[Bojam]

If you are ripping large timbers then why a 10 inch saw, a 12 inch saw would be capable of cutting what you may not yet thought of and the Itech has a 3 Kw motor so plenty of power ! Unless you are going to make money from woodworking then the Laguna saws are a lot more money for something that you may nor fully benefit from.

I’d generally agree Roy though there is something satisfying about using high end tools. That said, I stand by my original suggestion that the iTech should be more than enough to do the job in the context the OP has in mind.

 

[Val]

'Struggle' is a wrong take, both would cut 70mm hardwood, just wouldn't want to personally cut 10 or 20 long lengths in a row on one.
It causes less fatigue on you, using a more powerful saw, which is the point I was making and clearly should have said. The scheppach I've seen advertised at around the same price as the laguna, which why I mentioned it, though don't know what extra is charged to ship to N.I.

I now understand what you meant, thank you. I would say I would very rarely need to do more than 10 of those big cuts in a single session, so it shouldn’t be a problem.

I’ve googled that saw a bit, I’ve only found prices around the £3,300 mark, whereas a Laguna can be bought for £2,600, so it’s a huge (for me) difference.

 

[niall Y]

Using a narrow kerf ripping blade, helps if you are cutting at maximum depth, and will make the cut a lot easier. You do, however, need a riving knife to match, otherwise the timber will get jammed on the thicker knife.

 

[Daniel.l]

I had the SIP 12" table saw bought second hand and I now own the Laguna fusion 3 for over 2 years and I can honestly say there is a night and day difference. It things like the quick removal insert plate, quick riving knife swap and the easy blade change that make such a difference. If these things take time, you are less likely to do them. All these things on the sip took a lot more effort such as removing a load of screws in the insert plate every time you wanted to change the blade or riving knife. Also making an insert plate for them out of wood was impossible. The Laguna also has a blade brake which my sip didn't. Now my sip saw had problems such as blade wobble and the rise and fall of the blade would skip but I think these were caused my previous owner abuse.

Regarding ripping hardwood on the Laguna I have never had a problem. I use a thin kerf CMT ripping blade and I have cut oak sycamore iroko sapele etc with ease. I may have stalled it once cutting long lengths of larch that was pinching as I cut.

Do bear in mind with the Laguna a C-Type breaker must be installed on your 16amp socket so this will be extra cost for an electrician.

Now maybe the itech saw has had some upgrades recently so you'll have to do a full comparison. In my research I concluded on the Laguna and haven't looked back since.
Have a look at IGM Tools & machinery that's where I purchased mine for 2k euro at the time.

 

[Sideways]

I paid a quick visit to the Laguna stand at Harrogate last weekend. Had a chat with Nick and looked at the Laguna Fusion tablesaw on display. I don't recall which model it was.

First impressions were good.
It had a number of nice features and the rise/fall and tilt actions were smooth.
It is clearly better than the Harvey tablesaws sold through Axminster as the Harvey saw is better than the Axminster Trade range.

Fence sliding action is smooth with UHMWPE low friction pads against a decent aluminium box section bolted hard to a mschined cast iron table edge. Lever lock and adjustment for square in the fence. The T at the front of the fence is welded so the whole fence assembly is rigid.

Spindle lock (orange) engages with a flat on the flange. This seems better than the usual pin engaging a hole which always wear.

Tool free release for the riving knife is very good

Insert plate in a trespa type material is very tidy and machined on the reverse for a good fit. It locks in place.

A plastic tray below the blade is piped to the cabinet dust extraction outlet to concentrate airflow where it matters.

Overall. This wasn't a teardown, just a few minutes play but it looked nice.

The bandsaw was interesting too with ceramic guides and a mechanical disc brake. Laguna are making an effort to innovate.

 

[Val]

I had the SIP 12" table saw bought second hand and I now own the Laguna fusion 3 for over 2 years and I can honestly say there is a night and day difference. It things like the quick removal insert plate, quick riving knife swap and the easy blade change that make such a difference. If these things take time, you are less likely to do them. All these things on the sip took a lot more effort such as removing a load of screws in the insert plate every time you wanted to change the blade or riving knife. Also making an insert plate for them out of wood was impossible. The Laguna also has a blade brake which my sip didn't. Now my sip saw had problems such as blade wobble and the rise and fall of the blade would skip but I think these were caused my previous owner abuse.
[…]
Now maybe the itech saw has had some upgrades recently so you'll have to do a full comparison. In my research I concluded on the Laguna and haven't looked back since.
Have a look at IGM Tools & machinery that's where I purchased mine for 2k euro at the time.

That’s some great feedback, thank you!

Yes, in the past I bought a lot of machinery from IGM tools (even after brexit), but last time I tried to place an order at the end of 2021 they told me that they were not shipping to NI anymore with these words:

unfortunately we have to cancel this offer since we do not provide our products into your location due to BREXIT.​

S přátelským pozdravem | Yours sincerely

That’s unfortunate as their prices were very competitive - with the fall of the pound a bit less so, now the price is basically the same (€2825 against £2600).

 

[Daniel.l]

That's unfortunate. I wonder is there a delivery hub in Ireland? I use spacehub in Derry for UK deliveries rather than paying extortionate import taxes. If you do go for the Laguna there is a newer model out now with a digital angle guage and what looks like a beefier mitre guage so make sure the company that is selling one is not selling you an older model for the same price. Whraitt in Donegal sell the Laguna table saw but there prices are higher

 

[Val]

Yes, the model IGM is selling is the new one, same is for the other shop I’ve found that is willing to ship here to NI. Just to give you an idea, not even Axminster does pallet delivery to NI! I don’t want this thread to get political so I’ll leave it there.

It’s a hard decision, I have to say! To buy the cheaper and “fiddlier” but still valid iTECH, or to buy the really good but expensive Laguna? Who knows.

I’ll also probably wait to see if Laguna/Scosarg do any discount for these machines around Black Friday