A quick question on skew chisels

[Jacob]

I think I recall a C&G multi guess question
What is the preferred angle for Dovetails in deciduous timber?

1. 1:5
2. 1:8
3. 1:2
4. Whatever

So where is your 1/6? What's wrong with 1/4? Answer: nothing at all.

 

[MMUK]

I think I recall a C&G multi guess question
What is the preferred angle for Dovetails in deciduous timber?

1. 1:5
2. 1:8
3. 1:2
4. Whatever

So where is your 1/6? What's wrong with 1/4? Answer: nothing at all.

In that case my little baboon, you select #4 as your answer :wink:

 

[Jacob]

I think I recall a C&G multi guess question
What is the preferred angle for Dovetails in deciduous timber?

1. 1:5
2. 1:8
3. 1:2
4. Whatever

So where is your 1/6? What's wrong with 1/4? Answer: nothing at all.

In that case my little baboon, you select #4 as your answer :wink:

In fact the question doesn't make any mention of by whom preferred and is unanswerable. But "whatever" wouldn't really do. And baboon yourself!

 

[MMUK]

In fact the question doesn't make any mention of by whom preferred and is unanswerable. But "whatever" wouldn't really do. And baboon yourself!

Maybe you should be contacting the City & Guilds to complain to them then? :mrgreen:

 

[bugbear]

In fact the question doesn't make any mention of by whom preferred and is unanswerable. But "whatever" wouldn't really do. And baboon yourself!

Maybe you should be contacting the City & Guilds to complain to them then? :mrgreen:

One does feel sympathy for the tutors who tried to teach Jacob at college.

BugBear

 

[Jacob]

In fact the question doesn't make any mention of by whom preferred and is unanswerable. But "whatever" wouldn't really do. And baboon yourself!

Maybe you should be contacting the City & Guilds to complain to them then? :mrgreen:

One does feel sympathy for the tutors who tried to teach Jacob at college.

BugBear

We were taught to freehand cut at anything less than 30º to the perpendicular (1/2) but to keep it as neat and regular as poss - which I think was very good advice. I have seen them done at higher angles approaching 45º but there is the danger of corners chipping off if you make a habit of it.

 

[Peter Sefton]

It is good when you have a group of students of mixed ages and abilities, they asked searching questions and the whole group benefits exploring the reasons that we reached general conclusions over the centuries. But what you don't need within the group is a four year old that keeps asking WHY? When the rest of the group has moved on.

I take on board your comments
"Your "customer base" is what you choose it to be. It seems that a lot of our cautious arts n crafts followers end up having to teach, or desperately sell people tools they don't really need."

What I need to do is let the students go through the long learning curve of self-discovery of what may be good or poor construction and advise them the will need to purchase a range of Dovetail templates to suit the various angle available and a set of different sized skew and Fishtail chisels. This may well be advantageous to both parties, or I may stick to my advice based on my past mistakes, experience and ill-advised tool purchases. :mrgreen:

 

[MMUK]

It is good when you have a group of students of mixed ages and abilities, they asked searching questions and the whole group benefits exploring the reasons that we reached general conclusions over the centuries. But what you don't need within the group is a four year old that keeps asking WHY? When the rest of the group has moved on.

I take on board your comments
"Your "customer base" is what you choose it to be. It seems that a lot of our cautious arts n crafts followers end up having to teach, or desperately sell people tools they don't really need."

What I need to do is let the students go through the long learning curve of self-discovery of what may be good or poor construction and advise them the will need to purchase a range of Dovetail templates to suit the various angle available and a set of different sized skew and Fishtail chisels. This may well be advantageous to both parties, or I may stick to my advice based on my past mistakes, experience and ill-advised tool purchases. :mrgreen:

Personally I think you should be maximising profits by advising your students to buy at least one of every item in your shop. Then they can go out into the big wide world with Jacob and take on every job without worrying that they don't have the right tools. Of course, they will then be under direction of the Dovetail Master himself :wink:

 

[John15]

MMUK,
A good number of your posts are offensive and distasteful. I would be more interested to read your personal experiences in cutting dovetails and your more precise views on the various angles that the experts are discussing.
Cheers,
John

 

[Jacob]

It is good when you have a group of students of mixed ages and abilities, they asked searching questions and the whole group benefits exploring the reasons that we reached general conclusions over the centuries. But what you don't need within the group is a four year old that keeps asking WHY? When the rest of the group has moved on.

I take on board your comments
"Your "customer base" is what you choose it to be. It seems that a lot of our cautious arts n crafts followers end up having to teach, or desperately sell people tools they don't really need."

What I need to do is let the students go through the long learning curve of self-discovery of what may be good or poor construction and advise them the will need to purchase a range of Dovetail templates to suit the various angle available and a set of different sized skew and Fishtail chisels. This may well be advantageous to both parties, or I may stick to my advice based on my past mistakes, experience and ill-advised tool purchases. :mrgreen:

Personally I think you should be maximising profits by advising your students to buy at least one of every item in your shop. Then they can go out into the big wide world with Jacob and take on every job without worrying that they don't have the right tools. Of course, they will then be under direction of the Dovetail Master himself :wink:

I tend to agree. Not sure abt the dovetail master bit, I don't want them all bothering me, they can all fff orf!

Anybody reading this - YOU DON'T NEED TO BUY A DOVETAIL JIG. You can freehand them very easily but if in doubt use a normal sliding bevel - and you only need one. Or just make a jig from a few scraps if you feel really inadequate and feeble minded.

 

[MMUK]

MMUK,
A good number of your posts are offensive and distasteful.

Would you care to elaborate with examples please?

 

[Peter Sefton]

You are right Jacob, you can cut them free hand by eye, this will be the quickest way but untidy, you can use a sliding bevel my students boxes all have Marples which I get them to use as they learn the process for setting the (1:8) ratio or 1:4 if they wish to replicate early furniture.
The sliding bevel is the traditional way but cumbersome to use and watch out you don't take your eye out on the sharp end :!:
The students also make a brass Dovetail templates but I personally use and promote the cheapest Veritas
http://www.brimarc.com/products/Veritas ... -22792.htm
It is not as designer as the more expensive ones out there but I think it the best to USE :!:
I won't send the students up for your Dovetail master class, just the sharpening :wink:
Cheers Peter

 

[Jacob]

http://www.brimarc.com/products/Veritas ... -22792.htm What a ludicrous expensive bit of tat! Would anybody be mad enough to buy one?

The sliding bevel is the traditional way but cumbersome to use and watch out you don't take your eye out on the sharp end

The sliding bevel is one of the easiest tools to use and it's adjustable to any angle. If you are seriously at risk from the sharp end (already blind?) you can turn it round to the blunt end.
I think it's appalling that people are discouraged from using these simple and elegant traditional tools in favour of expensive and less useful American novelties.
NB if you use a sliding bevel DO NOT BUY the Veritas bevel setting protractor - it is amongst the most useless of all the novelty tools. A plastic school protractor will do a better job.

you can cut them free hand by eye, this will be the quickest way but untidy,

A bit of practice will be required, on a few scrap pieces. In any case cutting to a line will be untidy at first for most beginners. It's important to not de-skill them right from the start - too many jigs and gadgets and they will never get the hang of it. It's also important to get them to buy wood rather than tools they don't need.

 

[Racers]

Here we go again! its all kicking off.

For Pete's sake any one can use any tool and angle WITHOUT being singled out.

Mods step in please.

Pete

 

[Jacob]

Here we go again! its all kicking off.

For Pete's sake any one can use any tool and angle WITHOUT being singled out.

Mods step in please.

Pete

You can do what you like Pete but this discussion is about what you should recommend/sell to beginners

 

[CHJ]

Thread locked at request of OP.

Once more the usual antagonists have done their level best to spoil things for the OP and everyone else.