Wonky Axminster saw

[BarbaraT]

Hi All
I've just bought a second hand Axminster table saw MJ12-1600MK11. A little shocked as when I place a dial guage on the arbour
I have 0. 2mm total runout. This will get a lot worse when I put on a large blade.
It's the first time I've bought any Axminster tools, I can't see any damage to the arbour, is this how they are from new?

Has anyone fixed this?
Does anyone know if you can remove the shaft and arbour/pulley?
I was thinking of trying to find a machine shop and getting the face skimmed and squared up.

I've got a whole lot of cabinets to cut from birch plywood, so looking at getting everything square before I start.
Ideally I don't want to have to router all the edges.

Would it ever cut cleanly with this much blade wobble?

 

[Lefley]

Hi All
I've just bought a second hand Axminster table saw MJ12-1600MK11. A little shocked as when I place a dial guage on the arbour
I have 0. 2mm total runout. This will get a lot worse when I put on a large blade.
It's the first time I've bought any Axminster tools, I can't see any damage to the arbour, is this how they are from new?

Has anyone fixed this?
Does anyone know if you can remove the shaft and arbour/pulley?
I was thinking of trying to find a machine shop and getting the face skimmed and squared up.

I've got a whole lot of cabinets to cut from birch plywood, so looking at getting everything square before I start.
Ideally I don't want to have to router all the edges.

Would it ever cut cleanly with this much blade wobble?

.005 mm is acceptable runout on a 10" blade. You are 40 times that. I'm assuming a 10 inch blade. If your blade is less than that it's much more than 40 x. There are ways to fix arbor run out unless it's faulty bearings.

edit: that's a decent panel saw. Check to see if play in bearings, otherwise adjust arbour. Check Utube for how to do.

 

[ChaiLatte]

.005 mm is acceptable runout on a 10" blade. You are 4 times that.

Please could you review your maths. 0.005mm, 4 and 0.2mm (from the original post) have an order of magnitude difference in relationship to that which you suggest.

 

[BarbaraT]

.005 mm is acceptable runout on a 10" blade. You are 4 times that. I'm assuming a 10 inch blade. If your blade is less than that it's much more than 4 x. There are ways to fix arbor run out unless it's faulty bearings.

edit: that's a decent panel saw. Check to see if play in bearings, otherwise adjust arbour. Check Utube for how to do.

That's at the arbour.. I've just put a brand new 12" blade on and the runout is 0.7mm... So a long way out.
I can't seem to find anything on adjusting the arbour, plenty on adjusting the sliding fence.

Looking at the diagram courtesy of Axminster, looks like parts 5 and 7 need machining or replacing

 

[Lefley]

That's at the arbour.. I've just put a brand new 12" blade on and the runout is 0.7mm... So a long way out.
I can't seem to find anything on adjusting the arbour, plenty on adjusting the sliding fence.

Looking at the diagram courtesy of Axminster, looks like parts 5 and 7 need machining or replacing


View attachment 168288

If there is no play in the bearings or blade shall I say. Find Out where the table is attached to the base. Unscrew table top, rotate a hair and retighten. recheck alignment to blade from slot in table.

 

[BarbaraT]

Just spoken to Darren at Axminster uk, If I do need to replace parts C5, C6 and C7 they don't have them in stock and there on a 6 month leadtime. The Bearings C8 are in stock...

I used to work for Evolution Power Tools at least we kept spares...

 

[Lefley]

So your saw blade does have play in it?

 

[BarbaraT]

If there is no play in the bearings or blade shall I say. Find Out where the table is attached to the base. Unscrew table top, rotate a hair and retighten. recheck alignment to blade from slot in table.The `

The bearings feel fine.. I can't feel any movement in the blade, or in the arbour. The runout is also repeatable, eg 6 o clock is out by 0.4mm

 

[Lefley]

So I'd say your table top is not in line with the blade. If banged in moving can easily happen. The top should be bolted to the base somewhere.

 

[Mikebart]

The bearings feel fine.. I can't feel any movement in the blade, or in the arbour. The runout is also repeatable, eg 6 o clock is out by 0.4mm

Assume you have done this make sure all arbour mounting faces are clean check runout again do the same with new blade fit and check runout with blade fitted then loosen blade rotate blade on arbour retighten and check runout again.
Ask Axminster what their runout tolerance is.

 

[Ttrees]

Did you de-tension the belt to see if motor alignment might be at fault?

 

[BarbaraT]

Did you de-tension the belt to see if motor alignment might be at fault?

I'll check, I would expect to see some movement in the pulley if it was the belt pulling it to one side.

Assuming it's not the belt, I hope to take the top off today.

A local machine shop got back to me and they seem quite happy machining it flat, they suggested surface grinding it.. but I need to check that they understand that it needs to be at a right angle to the centre shaft and not just very flat..

I'll also change the bearings at the same time. I'll order some from NSK when I know what size they are.

 

[no idea]

Check the runout with a blade rather than at the arbor so you can see what it is under tension.

 

[HOJ]

Are you aware of its history? I would be inclined to at least try cutting with it, before you go down the rabbet hole of chasing tolerances, it may well give satisfactory results.

 

[Stevekane]

Im the lastperson to profess any knowledge of fancy table saws but it seems to me the the suggestain that the table top might be pineappled cannot be right, unless its floating around her Dial Gauge should give indentical readings at any point around the circumference of the blade,,if it doesnt then there is run out on the arbour? I think I would be tempted to take it apart and give it all a good clean before a reassemble and recheck.
Steve.

 

[Lefley]

Im the lastperson to profess any knowledge of fancy table saws but it seems to me the the suggestain that the table top might be pineappled cannot be right, unless its floating around her Dial Gauge should give indentical readings at any point around the circumference of the blade,,if it doesnt then there is run out on the arbour? I think I would be tempted to take it apart and give it all a good clean before a reassemble and recheck.
Steve.

I quess we need to know how you are checking for run out.if you are sliding a dial idicator along the table using the slot and blade and front of blade is different then the back of blade in relation to the table slot , then it is the table top if there is no play in the blade.

 

[Yojevol]

A local machine shop got back to me and they seem quite happy machining it flat, they suggested surface grinding it.. but I need to check that they understand that it needs to be at a right angle to the centre shaft and not just very flat..

I think you're heading in the right direction. Take the whole shaft/pulley/blade/washer/nut assembly to your machinist and he will discover where the problem lies and correct it.
Brian

 

[Mikebart]

I quess we need to know how you are checking for run out.if you are sliding a dial idicator along the table using the slot and blade and front of blade is different then the back of blade in relation to the table slot , then it is the table top if there is no play in the blade.

Looking at the pictures supplied if the arbour is still as dirty as in the pictures then I would start by cleaning the arbour thoroughly. Then check again.

 

[Deadeye]

I quess we need to know how you are checking for run out.if you are sliding a dial idicator along the table using the slot and blade and front of blade is different then the back of blade in relation to the table slot , then it is the table top if there is no play in the blade.

I don't think they mean that.

I think the run-out is in revolution of the arbor with the dial indicator static. Therefore nothing to do with table or motor alignment

 

[Ttrees]

I believe most of these arbor flanges are dished (if that's the right word)
i.e only contact the blade on the outer perimeter, and only make full/or lots more
contact with the blade when tightened up.
Unsure if it's the case here, but definitely worth a mention.

Good luck
Tom