Which One to Buy

[Blucher]

One burning question I have at the moment, concerns wood lathes. I am in the market for a wood lathe, and I would welcome any opinions, "stay away froms..." etc. I am currently looking out for a reasonably priced wood lathe. Did some turning back at school, but in those days we had a candle on the headstock to see what we were doing. :roll:
After endless nights of flipping from manufacturer to supplier to forum to ...... well I think you all know the trail, I have settled on one type in particular the Record CL 3/4. I want a lathe that will outlast me, that I will not have to think about upgrading in two or three years because I have out grown the one I have. Record Lathes seem to have a very good write up except....... I see so many of them up for sale.. Now another model I have considered is the Charnwood W813, but I am left a little uneasy because there are so many reports of the 10 step speed change wearing drive belts very quickly, and the fact that the cones over which the belts run are rather fragile. I have queried this with Charnwood and they say (as expected) that this is just bad press thrown out by people who didn't go about the job of changing belts properly. Strangely I have not come across one Charnwood W813 for sale second hand. I ask myself is this because nobody is buying them in the first place (which I tend to doubt) or is it because W813 owners are that satisfied with their machine that once they have purchased it they are not wanting to sell it.
Looking once again at the Record CL3/4 Lathes (I know we are talking chalk and cheese to some degree) but I ask myself here, are there so many Record Lathes up for grabs because there are so many purchased in the first place. are the owners dissatisfied with their record machine. I am in a real dilemma now. I have already considered how much I am likely to use the machine (Hobby v Trade Lathe) and my intentions presently will take me up into the trade use in hours. I've saved up the money over a long time to purchase either, but I don't want to be purchasing one, then thinking I should have got the other. Charnwood add ons are much less expensive than most equivalent Record ones, and are available it would seem in greater abundance. With my criteria for shopping, what opinions do people have,. should it be a brand new and Warranted Charnwood, or a decent second hand Record Power CL. At the moment I am tending to go for the Record, then I watch the Charnwood video and think "that would probably do me, then I am back to the record. Someone for goodness sake straighten me out on this.

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

I was you a year ago and I bought the CL4. I've never looked back because its bullet proof. The one piece of advice I would say is for goodness sake get one with electronic variable speed (like the CL4) because the control it gives you versus the faff avoided changing belts is worth its weight. Also I really like the ability to swing the headstock away from the bed when hollowing deep stock.
The cost of Record accessories shouldn't worry you...loads of other manufacturers make kit that fits the record lathes. Finally, that 5 year warranty is another big peace of mind swayer....so if it does go wrong...who cares? RP after sales service is superb. I've had a dust extractor and bandsaw motors go over the years....both replaced next post with no quibble free of charge. They didn't even ask me how long I'd owned them for. I'm sure they cant say it for legal reasons but really Record stand by their products for life.

 

[Woodmonkey]

I have a similar lathe to that charnwood one, in 5 years I have had to change the belt twice, it cost about 8 pounds and takes about 1 minute so that's not really an issue. Never had a RP lathe but if you can get a cl4 variable speed one that would be a superior machine for sure although probably double the price.
Rich

 

[Spindle]

Hi

See this thread - the OP asked a similar question with regard to a CL4 and an Axi AWVS 900 which is similar to the Charnwood.

new-axminster-awvsl900-or-second-hand-record-power-cl4-lathe-t76071.html

The build quality of the Record may account for there being a good number for sale - they will probably outlast their owners :wink:

Regards Mick

 

[Jethro]

Hi there Blucher
My mate has a record cl4 good lath, but would not be my choice.
I am on my second lath which is a hegner, I just can't fault it,it's like a Rolls Royce after the first lath I had.
They are not cheap,but I have seen second hand ones around at a fair price.
Whatever you go for pick the best one you can afford.
It might pay you to join a club [if you can] before you buy one,that way you may get the chance to try some, and
you will get loads of advice


Geoff :wink:

 

[KimG]

If you want something really solid, the Jet 1642 is a sound bit of kit, you will not need to replace it. It does all come down to budget in the end, I mean, a Oneway would be fantastic, but the price is worth a sharp intake of breath.

 

[Woodmonkey]

You can pick up a clone of the charnwood on fleabay for not much money, often including a chuck and some chisels....

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/draper-wtl90- ... 20deb9bdcc
or
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SIP-900m-SWIV ... 4d1811fd6e

this might be a good way to start off without a big outlay, once you have got a feel for it you can then upgrade later when you know more what you want from the hobby

 

[RogerP]

If you want something really solid, the Jet 1642 is a sound bit of kit, you will not need to replace it. It does all come down to budget in the end, I mean, a Oneway would be fantastic, but the price is worth a sharp intake of breath.

I've got a Oneway chuck ... on my Record

 

[Spindle]

Hi

It's 'horses for courses' really - you need to decide what you want your lathe to be capable of, (size and type of work).

Large bowls and platters will require an outboard turning facility / swivelling headstock and suitable toolpost.

A bed length capacity of at least 24" can be required to produce spindles for furniture.

A massive lathe is advantageous when turning large out of balance work, (natural edged bowls)

A hollow tailstock is required if long hole boring, (table and standard lamps etc), is to be undertaken

Small diameter work is best turned at high spindle speeds - large out of balance work requires slow speeds

Regards Mick

 

[Terry - Somerset]

I bought an Axminster version of the Charnwood about a year ago. Excellent specification and value for money but I now want to upgrade (finances permitting!!). CL4 would be close to the top of the list with variable speed and seemingly better build quality.

Rgds

Terry

 

[chipmunk]

I've held off commenting but ... Really, don't do it!

If you can wait, save your money and buy once - buy an Axminster 1628 or one of the EVS Jets like the 1642.

The CL4 is not a patch on these lathes IMO.

You've only got to think about oiling the headstock bearings (sooo 1940's), the poor tailstock handwheel, those saggy bed bars and that fiddly banjo on the bowl turning outrigger. There's just no comparison.

.....ducks and takes cover, ready for the comments from the Record fans.

Jon

 

[Grahamshed]

I've held off commenting but ... Really, don't do it!

If you can wait, save your money and buy once - buy an Axminster 1628 or one of the EVS Jets like the 1642.

The CL4 is not a patch on these lathes IMO.

You've only got to think about oiling the headstock bearings (sooo 1940's), the poor tailstock handwheel, those saggy bed bars and that fiddly banjo on the bowl turning outrigger. There's just no comparison.

.....ducks and takes cover, ready for the comments from the Record fans.

Jon

I was going out of my way NOT to say that. The way things are going by the time I have persuaded SWMBO that I need one ( Axi 1628 that is ) they will be out of stock.

 

[Spindle]

Hi

The Axi 1628 may have the edge over the CL4, at £500 more expensive it should have!

I think I've owned my CL4 for 14 years now and I've never come across a shortcoming. Oiling the spindle bearing takes a second and is a small price to pay for an adjustable, rather than fixed, bearing. I prefer the tailstock wheel without a handle and the tailstock works in the expected sense, (my previous lathe's tailstock wheel was rotated anti-clockwise to extend the tailstock spindle). The banjo on the more modern CLs is a camlock as per the Axi, the bowl turning outrigger is an accessory which I have used extensively for large platters and spinning wheel rims to 26", I not sure what the 1628 offers in this respect. I've not noticed my bed bars sagging but if they did it's a quick job to rotate them.

As I said earlier, it's horses for courses, the Axi has an extra 4" capacity over the bed and will be more suited to large out of balanced turning, if the OP needs these facilities then I'd say go for the Axi, otherwise save himself £500 and get the CL4.

Oh! and don't forget if you need a stand for the lathe the Axi is an additional £200 over the one for the Record.

All of the above IMO of course

Regards Mick

A Record fan ......... Does it show?

 

[chipmunk]

Hi Mick,
I knew it'd not be popular so I'm sorry but the Record twin bedbar lathes are just getting too long in the tooth IMHO. Why else would Record have invested in the Nova and Woodfast (Maxi) lathes?

Just to add to the list of gripes I think that the 1MT tooling is IMHO inadequate for anything more than 3/4" diameter drilling.

FYI, the Axi 1624 has a brilliant outboard turning attachment...

...all in cast iron.

...but as you say it all does cost more.

However, IMHO you can really see where your money is going and you don't need to buy it all at once.

At the end of the day though it's the OP that pays his money and makes his choice :wink:

Jon

 

[Spindle]

Hi Jon

No apology necessary - hopefully our discussing the respective merits of different lathes may help someone make a better informed decision regarding a future lathe purchase.

Regarding drilling, I have used a 1 3/4" saw tooth bit into end grain with no issue.

Thanks for drawing my attention to the OB attachment - how did I miss that #-o

At the end of the day are we really comparing like with like? Lathe, stand, outboard turning attachment:

CL4 package £1140,

Axi 1628 package £1920, (plus the extended tool post).

And is the Axi that much better??

Regards Mick

 

[Grahamshed]

if the OP needs these facilities then I'd say go for the Axi, otherwise save himself £500 and get the CL4.

Hr doesn't. He doesn't. And £500 is soooo much money. :twisted: :twisted:

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

I have to stand up for Mick. Does it show I also have a CL4 Every time I hear the so-called criticisms of the CL4 I keep expecting them to turn up on mine. I'm still waiting. Lets examine them:

- oiling the bearings. I had a 500ml bottle of gear oil spare (is it sae30???) when I bought my lathe. Still not through that bottle at 1 drip per session. The oil nipple is right on top of the headstock, right in front of you. Boom...dealt with.
- The poor tailstock handwheel. It has no handle to snag your fingers or your back on...its designed perfectly for the job. Boom. No 2.
- saggy bed bars. Had mine 18 months, straight edge today...perfectly level. Also....amazingly portable with a couple tweeks of a spanner so it can be easily transported if necessary. Plus of course that's 36 or 48" between centres. Whammo.
- fiddly banjo...what Mick said. Kachow.

The CL4 is a classic, it is without question the most flexible lathe in its class. Horses for courses of course but to decry this functional design elegance (its as ugly as sin I'll concede that) of a machine is to simply mis-represent it. Which other lathe for this price offers both variable electronic speed control AND 30" rim bowl capacity. The revolving head alone is worth its weight when you're hollowing out bowls. While you Jet fans are scraping your genitals on yer poncy tailstock handles, I'm hollowing my bowls at right angles to the lathe axis

I wont even mention the Record 5 yr warranty......I'm sure the Axy chinese clone will be a pile of iron oxide in the garage corner by then (Possibly due to it not being covered in oil that spattered out of the bearings)

 

[Grahamshed]

Holy turnings Batman. That told um.

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

well....you know......rassam grassam dick dastardley etc

 

[Spindle]

The way things are going by the time I have persuaded SWMBO that I need one ( Axi 1628 that is ) they will be out of stock.

Bet you don't tell her that the CL4 package would be £800 cheaper :twisted: :twisted: