The Gent's Saw

[Stanleymonkey]

I teach, and I'm lucky enough to teach DT on a woodwork basis 4-5 times a week to different classes. Kids tend to use hacksaws in primary schools to saw 6-10mm wood on a bench hook.

I tend to get them onto using a gent's saw / back saw as soon as they can cope. They revert back to the hacksaw for fiddly cuts with dowelling and hard to hold bits. But the gents saw can cope with larger wood, or 4 pieces of the small stuff taped together for 'gang' sawing. Some will manage to trim thin hardboard with it too.

Anyway - what I want to know is are there any rules of thumb for uses / limits of a gents saw? Should you attempt to cut only half the blade depth for example? Is it recommended for certain sizes of wood only? Does the round handle pose any extra challenges? Any tips with the grip - pointy finger along side or on the top?

Does anyone have any ideas on the name? What on earth was a gentleman's saw for? A couple of the girls ask for the ladies saw! :lol:

I'm not being a pedant or anything. Just want to know as much as I can about what I am doing. Don't want to push the limits of the tools and have to replace them and the fewer cut fingers the better!!

 

[Droogs]

As far as I know "Gents" anything was applied to tools made to be lighter and easier to handle than "industrial" tools during the 17thC for the well to do to use as they had weaker muscles and grips etc. I use mine as deep as it will go, just make sure to lube it with candle wax and keep it sharp.

 

[thetyreman]

as far as I know they were/are intended for finer cuts, I could be wrong but I think the kerf is slighly thinner on them, the ones I'm interested in would have to be finer than say 13 tpi, more like 18 tpi, they are useful on smaller tenons and very fine dovetailing where a larger tenon or dovetail saw is too big, there was a project recently I did making a coat rack and I noticed paul sellers uses a gents saw, now I've made my own with a small tenon saw I can fully understand why.

 

[MikeG.]

I use mine for cutting along-the-grain fine accurate cuts, such as when dovetailing. They are very good for this (they're rip-sharpened, but with fine teeth and a narrow kerf).......not so good across the grain. The downside is that the round handle is quite tiring/ sore after using it for 4 or 5 hours. I can't imagine why you'd limit the depth of cut. I regularly use mine to go as deep as the spine.

 

[Just4Fun]

Does the round handle pose any extra challenges? Any tips with the grip - pointy finger along side or on the top?

I don't use a gent's saw often but when I do I always try to get a finger on the side of the blade. That can be difficult as I don't have huge hands but it helps me to get a consistent alignment. With a pistol grip I find it easier to get the blade plumb but with a round handle I need to reference against the blade to get a "feel" for that and develop some sort of muscle memory. If you are teaching kids, who will have even smaller hands than I do, this could be a problem. You could try putting some strategically-placed tape on the handle to help the kids feel when they have the blade upright.

I use mine as deep as it will go, just make sure to lube it with candle wax

What? Oh sorry, my mind went off on a tangent there. Yes, I use the full depth sometimes. A couple of times I have made jigs that use the back of the saw as a depth stop to obtain consistent & accurate cuts, but maybe that is bad practise, I don't know.

 

[Stanleymonkey]

As far as I know "Gents" anything was applied to tools made to be lighter and easier to handle than "industrial" tools during the 17thC for the well to do to use as they had weaker muscles and grips etc. I use mine as deep as it will go, just make sure to lube it with candle wax and keep it sharp.

I like the history behind that. I seem to remember genuine attempts ten years ago or so to produce and market lighter-weight drills etc. for women DIYers and people new to the hobby

 

[Stanleymonkey]

I use mine for cutting along-the-grain fine accurate cuts, such as when dovetailing. They are very good for this (they're rip-sharpened, but with fine teeth and a narrow kerf).......not so good across the grain. The downside is that the round handle is quite tiring/ sore after using it for 4 or 5 hours. I can't imagine why you'd limit the depth of cut. I regularly use mine to go as deep as the spine.

The depth of cut thing was more when I'd pushed the saw and used it to cut large blocks of timber (because I didn't have a tenon saw!) It felt that it wanted to roll on my had and escape to the left or right as the cut progressed - probably just poor technique

 

[Stanleymonkey]

You could try putting some strategically-placed tape on the handle to help the kids feel when they have the blade upright.

Droogs - where would the tape go? Do you mean on top of the handle at the 12 o'clock position as a visual marker?

 

[Just4Fun]

You could try putting some strategically-placed tape on the handle to help the kids feel when they have the blade upright.

Droogs - where would the tape go? Do you mean on top of the handle at the 12 o'clock position as a visual marker?

It was me, not Droogs, who suggested that, so I'll answer your bonus question on the same subject.
I suggest you look at how the kids, with their small hands, grip the handle and where their digits are. Then put some tape so they can feel the edge of the tape with, for example, their thumbs. That would make it easier for them to feel that the saw is at the same angle each time, and to grip it in a consistent fashion. Aim for something they can feel rather than see.

 

[tony_s]

Not of much assistance to the OP maybe, but I recently purchased a thos finn pax gents saw as a bit of an experiment (for reasons I won't bore you with here) having spent over 25 years using only Japanese or, at least, pull saws. I have found the whole experience to be a revelation: my preconceptions and prejudices have been well and truly challenged. A very accurate saw imho

 

[Stanleymonkey]

Just4fun - I'll try the tip with the tape. I have a go myself and then experiment on my children. Good ideas

I've always found them to be a useful bit of kit.

 

[Honest John]

Damn! Now I need a Gents saw. I didn’t know that before I read this thread! (hammer)