RobinBHM
Established Member
Neither did the UK
Social distancing, .. what's that?
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Neither did the UK
Selwyn
Established Member
Sars and Mers came and went by the way, no second wave. Coronavirus don't tend to mutate like influenza virus.
Lots of speculation that Spanish flu was in fact two virus or at least a mutated virus. But that was 100 years ago so we don't know enough. Covid is not flu we know that much anyway. Stick to the science and it may sink in with you soon!
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Selwyn
Established Member
As i say non existent in the great scheme of things. 10 deaths a day in a country of 70 odd million may as well be zero.
Anyway I thought you'd flounced out of the debate because you didn't like being accused of what you accuse others of?
RobinBHM
Established Member
Please could you back that up with some evidence.
I'm not sure how just saying it makes it true, I would hesitate to suggest your track record (as somebody who's claims Covid is not worse than flu) doesn't give much confidence.
RobinBHM
Established Member
I'm not sure what your point is.
Whilst I have no personal interest in ad hominem attacks, as they merely serve to highlight your need to use them as a means to deflect from the weakness of your argument, I would appreciate it if you would try your best to avoid them in the interests of keeping the thread open.
Unfortunately for you, you haven't been able to provide any evidence that backs up your claim that Covid is not much worse than flu.
For example, you still haven't provided any valid explanation why so many healthcare workers have died as a result of Covid. When do you think you might be able to do that?
Selwyn
Established Member
Selwyn
Established Member
I don't think you've understood the posts the other people have explained to you so I don't think there's any need to explain to you again. If the virus is as bad as you think then why haven't more health workers died would be my question, are health workers not allowed to die like the rest of us?
Can you produce any evidence it is worse than flu?
If you take out the number of deaths from the nursing homes and the numbers of true covid deaths, defined by covid 19 being the only cause listed on the death then I suspect the number is the evidence you seek from Rorschach
doctor Bob
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how many times will people be willing to lock down or reduce their wages?
I'm guessing that if you are already on the breadline, not too many times.
I think it's very easy to call for more restrictions if your doing OK, WFH, retired, etc not so easy when lifes tough.
My parents are 87, dad is chair bound due parkinsons, no help offered due covid restrictions, my 87 year old mum is his carer, again housebound, I will break travel rules to help them and did during last lockdown.
As a business I have received no personel help as a director, yet know plenty who have done very well due fraud and are rubbing their hands together looking forward to extra income if more handouts are made readily available. My outlook is keep my nose out of others business lest you get involved but it really boils my phish.
I'm guessing that if you are already on the breadline, not too many times.
I think it's very easy to call for more restrictions if your doing OK, WFH, retired, etc not so easy when lifes tough.
My parents are 87, dad is chair bound due parkinsons, no help offered due covid restrictions, my 87 year old mum is his carer, again housebound, I will break travel rules to help them and did during last lockdown.
As a business I have received no personel help as a director, yet know plenty who have done very well due fraud and are rubbing their hands together looking forward to extra income if more handouts are made readily available. My outlook is keep my nose out of others business lest you get involved but it really boils my phish.
I heard on the radio that HMRC has identified £10 billion of fraud through furlough etc and that is just in their first investigation.
Selwyn
Established Member
The thing is hospitals don't really test for flu at death if the patient had other issues even if that or another resipiratory disease did the final blow. But they do do this for Covid. So it is skewing the figures somewhat.
artie
Sawdust manufacturer.
Could say the same for you, you ignore questions or points that you can't/won't answer and fail to back up your claims. when asked.
Repeating the same stuff even when your error has been pointed out.
Have you ever thought of standing for parliament?
Trainee neophyte
Established Member
@RobinBHM
I wrote a long, involved reply, but having watched the BBC this evening, I realise that it is completely irrelevant, so I deleted it. No matter which of us is is right, no matter how benign or destructive the virus is, they are still going to intentionally wreck the economy. From what I can make out Boris and chums have decided not to have a lockdown for three weeks now, because they want a lockdown next month for much, much longer. A better way to be spending our energies is to try and work out why.
It may be time to enter into the realm of conspiracy theories, so perhaps first of all we should look at some conspiracy facts. There is a very weird group of people who want to "reset" the world economy. The Green New Deal and sundry associated climate change policies have been part of their attempt to rework the world economy, but they are openly moving now to just have their "reset" and be done. In case you don't know who these people are, it is the Davos crowd, also known as the World Economic Forum. There are endless books, videos, websites etc that they have produced explaining their intentions, so it is hardly a theory. In essence, they want to stop any pretense at free market economics, and go planned economy. In other words, communism, although it won't be sold as such. I'm sure it will be sold as benefiting the working man, but I guarantee we will all be poorer, and the billionaires will all be richer at the end of it.
https://www.weforum.org/great-resethttps://thehill.com/opinion/energy-...the-great-reset-world-leaders-radical-plan-tohttps://duckduckgo.com/?q=world+economic+forum+great+reset&t=ofa&ia=web
Anyway, the entire point of this tin foil hat diatribe is to ask if Boris is on board, and therefore is Boris trying to disassemble the current system, in order to bring on the new. Or is Boris just misled? Or am I seeing things? Turns out I'm not having an original thought here - the scary Russians have beaten me to it: As Boris Johnson announces Britain’s ‘great reset’, were the Covid ‘conspiracy theorists’ right all along?
There's nothing we can do to stop it, but it will be interesting to watch from the sidelines as a dystopian planned world economy emerges. Think of it as the eu on steroids. What could possibly go wrong?
I wrote a long, involved reply, but having watched the BBC this evening, I realise that it is completely irrelevant, so I deleted it. No matter which of us is is right, no matter how benign or destructive the virus is, they are still going to intentionally wreck the economy. From what I can make out Boris and chums have decided not to have a lockdown for three weeks now, because they want a lockdown next month for much, much longer. A better way to be spending our energies is to try and work out why.
It may be time to enter into the realm of conspiracy theories, so perhaps first of all we should look at some conspiracy facts. There is a very weird group of people who want to "reset" the world economy. The Green New Deal and sundry associated climate change policies have been part of their attempt to rework the world economy, but they are openly moving now to just have their "reset" and be done. In case you don't know who these people are, it is the Davos crowd, also known as the World Economic Forum. There are endless books, videos, websites etc that they have produced explaining their intentions, so it is hardly a theory. In essence, they want to stop any pretense at free market economics, and go planned economy. In other words, communism, although it won't be sold as such. I'm sure it will be sold as benefiting the working man, but I guarantee we will all be poorer, and the billionaires will all be richer at the end of it.
https://www.weforum.org/great-resethttps://thehill.com/opinion/energy-...the-great-reset-world-leaders-radical-plan-tohttps://duckduckgo.com/?q=world+economic+forum+great+reset&t=ofa&ia=web
Anyway, the entire point of this tin foil hat diatribe is to ask if Boris is on board, and therefore is Boris trying to disassemble the current system, in order to bring on the new. Or is Boris just misled? Or am I seeing things? Turns out I'm not having an original thought here - the scary Russians have beaten me to it: As Boris Johnson announces Britain’s ‘great reset’, were the Covid ‘conspiracy theorists’ right all along?
There's nothing we can do to stop it, but it will be interesting to watch from the sidelines as a dystopian planned world economy emerges. Think of it as the eu on steroids. What could possibly go wrong?
I was ridiculed months ago as being conspiracy theorist after mentioning 'lizard man) David Icke (no moderator stepped in to my defence) but I'm thick skinned as well as thick I'm told. He set out exactly what was going to happen many many months ago. He also pointed how those who speak out are slurred and discredited as a means of making them out to be liars. Judy Mickovic. Is a case in point. David Martin is amazing he has put together proof of the agenda and followed the money. Anyone with half a brain can see this is isn't right on so many levels if it stinks then something is rotten. There are huge issues at stake right now. If biden wins then China is on our doorstep.
RobinBHM
Established Member
Please you kindly point precisely what I have ignored.
Please can you point to "errors" you claim I have made. I have made no errors in response to your posts.
As I have mentioned, ad hominem attacks do not further the debate at all, It is a commonly used method used to disguise a lack of a counter argument.
Please can you refrain from further ad hominems as some of us would like to continue the debate rather than have the thread locked.
RobinBHM
Established Member
Thank you for your response.
You claim that Covid is not much worse than flu but you can't answer why 6000 healthcare staff have died as a result of Covid but none from flu.
Also many hospitals in Italy, Spain and America were overwhelmed by Covid, which has never happened with flu.
You can't provide an answer to that either.
Thank you for confirming that Covid is far worse than flu, we got there eventually.
Selwyn
Established Member
You ignored the explanation of the 600 healthcare workers for a start.
Selwyn
Established Member
Because if you have flu and covid it gets all called "covid". If you had motor neurone disease, terminal cancer dementia and were aged 105 and had been in a care home for 25 years you would be called a covid death if you happened to test postive for covid. However that wouldn't have been the case if it was flu - they wouldn' have tested for it. I know you are struggling with this but it is really important in the context of understanding how impactful the virus would be.
This is why it is misleading to claim that Covid is worse than flu - not least because coronavirus' don't tend to mutate like flu virus do. So I would say by and large I would always see a flu virus as more dangerous than covid virus' - it certainly tends to kill more year in year out. Coronavirus' appear to tend to rock up quickly then follow the gompertz curve.
Italys outbreak was relatively concentrated that's why the hospitals were busy. As was USA's ie New york. And of course hospitals have got overwhelmed with flu in the past. But very often we choose not to keep octogenarians alive in ICU with flu because the therapy is too intrusive. Everyone will have some immunity to flu virus as it has been around for longer but now that covid 19 is endemic only a silly old fool would claim that covid is worse than flu, flu has the potential for a lot of damage.
You think no health staff have ever died from influenza?? Now I know you are pulling my chain!
RobinBHM
Established Member
Thank you for posting that.
The results of that study don't prove what Rorsach is claiming.
It says:
"This paper does not prove that the peak in fatal infections in England and Wales preceded lockdown by several days"
Also the public, hospitals and care homes were putting social distancing in place well before lockdown
and
There never was a full lockdown
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