Side Gates

[John15]

I made two 6' x 3' gates for the sides of my bungalow last Autumn. The frames are Oak and the vertical boarding is treated t and g Northern Redwood. I was concerned I hadn't left a sufficient gap between each board but so far there is no sign of a problem.

I'm tempted to put spikes along the top in an effort to keep the cats out but that's probably illegal.

John

 

[Roughcut]

Looks like a nice sturdy gate John.

 

[Student]

Nice work. A darn sight better than the Wickes kit that I used for my daughter's side gate.

 

[ED65]

The gates look great. Did you use stainless or galvanised fasteners?

Re. putting spikes along the top, there was a thread on security recently and members mentioned installing Prikka Strips on their gates or fences. As they're sold on Amazon, link, I'm sure they're legal

 

[mseries]

Don't put anything up that might harm a cat. They won't know it's there until they jump up and hurt themselves. If they are lucky they'll make it home and have a saddened owner and a trip to the vets with associated cost. If they are unlucky their wound will get infected and they have a more serius vet visit or they'll bleed to death. No animal deserves that, they are probably some childs pet.

 

[John15]

Ed,
From memory they are epoxy painted or something expensive like that. I considered galvanizing but the finish was quite rough.
Mseries,
Have you any idea how annoying other peoples cats can be? Cr****ing everywhere and killing garden birds really makes me angry.

John

 

[AJB Temple]

It is entirely legal to use spikes. They are readily available for both commercial and domestic purposes and are even sold (as flexible but quite fearsome plastic spikes) in garden centres.

 

[JakeS]

Have you any idea how annoying other peoples cats can be? Cr****ing everywhere and killing garden birds really makes me angry.

The best way to avoid cat mess in your garden is to get a cat.

If you don't want a cat, you can get solar-powered ultrasonic scare devices which keep a lot of cats away, or reflective cat-silhouette things which can sometimes work, and apparently tiger dung pellets, which work on the principle of convincing the cat that your garden is the territory of a bigger, scarier cat.

What you can't do is injure the cat - the cat's right to roam - even in your garden - is actually protected by law, believe it or not. And the owner would be quite within their rights to recover their vets fees from you if you did anything. Not to mention the general hate you will get from your neighbours if anyone ever finds out what you've done.

Also, spikes on the top of your gate will do bugger all - the cat will come around the sides of that gate, or through the hedge, or in some cases even under the gate. Same for foxes, which also leave (worse IMO) messes in people's gardens and murder small creatures.



Personally, in my area, I have a problem with schoolkids littering my garden with sweet wrappers - it turns out they're protected by law as well.

If our cat was injured maliciously it would destroy my partner and seriously upset me - if I ever found out who did it I would have no qualms at all about suing the balls off of them for vet fees, making sure they got prosecuted for animal abuse and ensuring that every last person on the street knew exactly what they had done. I would want them to suffer for what they did.

 

[Mark A]

Redressing the bias:

Have you any idea how annoying other peoples dogs can be? Cr****ing everywhere and killing livestock and kids really makes me angry.

 

[John15]

Jake,

Thanks for the info on deterring cats. I'll look into the options.

John

 

[Wizard9999]

Well, they say you are either a cat person or a dog person, guessing that this is a predominantly cat person forum.

Out of genuine curiosity I am interested in the whole legal right to roam, is that legislation specific to cats? Have seen similar threads to this on other forums and have not heard that mentioned, hence my curiosity. I presume it is covered under a more general point of law, or is there some legislation specific to cats?

Terry.

 

[mseries]

I don't believe their is specific legislation for cats, generally in law they are not considered such a threat, to life or property, that they need to be legislated against, but I am not a lawyer. Also note that cat owners are liable for the damage that their cats cause.

 

[Wizard9999]

Couldn't resist a quick online search on cat law.

It appears cats' right to roam is not a result of a specific law to protect them, but stems from the fact that they are not included in the list of livestock in animal related legislation and therefore are not restricted in the same way as dogs. By excluding cats from the list the law appears to recognise that cats naturally roam and further that this behaviour is less likely to cause an issue and / or they are less likely to pose a threat to humans by attacking them.

Further, cats are defined as property under the law (so notwithstaning any moral argument), and in addition to being protected under the Animal Welfare Act they are also protected under the Criminal Damage Act. So intentionally harming them or stealing them is an offence. I am sure lawyers would argue over intentional, if a measure somebody took to deter a burglar injured a cat then you could presumably argue it was not your intention to harm the cat, but as John has now said the spikes are for cats and not burglars I don' think that defence would be open to him.

However, there are two sides to the coin and a cat owner cannot use the 'right to roam' as the basis for taking no responsibility for what the cat does whilst roaming. The cat owner has a common law duty of care to take reasonable steps to prevent their cat from causing damage to other people's property or injuring somebody.

There is even some discussion as to whether having a cat use your garden as a toilet repeatedly constitutes a breach of Article 8 of the Human Rights Act, which protects everyone's right to to privacy and respect for their family life.

So, surprisingly complicated. But it seems in summary you can't harm a cat using your garden as a toilet, but nor can the owner deny any responsibility for the cat's actions by just saying "it's a cat, it's in their nature".

Terry.

PS I am not a lawyer, this is not legal advice!

 

[Wizard9999]

Duplicate post - can a mod please delete.

 

[Graham Orm]

Back to topic. Lovely gate. ;-)

We have a cat poop problem even with 2 dogs in the house! I read that male human urine does the trick. I will try it sooner or later.

 

[John15]

Thanks Graham. It's the first 'proper' gate I've made. Oddly the most difficult thing was getting the spacings even to the boarding. I realised when I'd almost finished that I should have eased the edges to the tongues. We live and learn!

John

 

[Billy Flitch]

Well done John I really like it, Every thing right and where it should be.
I particularly like the radius at the top of the door would you like to tell us how you worked that out

 

[John15]

Billy,

Thanks for the compliment. I enjoyed making them very much and was pleased with the result.
The top radius was quite simple really. It was trial and error by working down the centre board until the radius coincided with the outer edges of the outer boards.
The tenons were 14mm - bought a Narex mortice chisel from Workshop Heaven which did the job well.

John

 

[Student]

If you wish to avoid the trial and error, you can calculate the radius by working out

((W/2)squared + H squared)/2H

where W is the full width of the gate and H is the height of the curved bit e.g.

if John's gate was 100 cms wide and he wanted to have the top 10 cms higher than the sides, the calculation is

((100/2)squared + 10squared) / 20

(50squared + 100)/20

Sorry - can't work out how to do superscripts

2,600/20 = 130 cms radius

 

[blackrodd]

If you wish to avoid the trial and error, you can calculate the radius by working out

((W/2)squared + H squared)/2H

where W is the full width of the gate and H is the height of the curved bit e.g.

if John's gate was 100 cms wide and he wanted to have the top 10 cms higher than the sides, the calculation is

((100/2)squared + 10squared) / 20

(50squared + 100)/20

Sorry - can't work out how to do superscripts

2,600/20 = 130 cms radius

Or a piece of string and a nail!
Rodders

PS I hope you remembered to bevel off the top edges of the rails and gate to "throw" water off.