Sharpening

[D_W]

Camber roller just allows you to soften the corners of your plane irons so if for eg your flattering a wide board it reduces the chances of you leaving tram tracks in your work ,, skew jigs for angled blades but it’s an optional extra that I don’t need. Eotd it’s whatever your comfortable using and what gets you consistent results in as short at time as possible- I’ve tried sharpening by eye with an oilstone but it just didn’t work for me.

If you want to try freehanding, grind at a lower angle, make yourself a block a little above 30 degrees to see what it feels like and work the tip of the iron with a single stone at the steeper angle, do a couple of alternating front and back (not going steeper) and then strop the edge.

The trouble with jacob and paul's fallacy is the idea that the average person gets a good edge with it - or even mediocre. Most don't. Separating the grinding and edge work drastically improves both your control of the shape of the edge and the finish of the edge. In less time.

 

[Jacob]

What about my cask strength Laphroaig? Will that make me a better cook if I use it on my knife-sharpening stone?

Drinking it doesn't - just wondered if I've been using it wrong.

Well it'll taste a lot better than honing fluid and it's just about the same price here, specially reduced! Laphroaig 10 Year Old Cask Strength - Batch 014

 

[D_W]

I like that @Jacob nice straight advice and " just a quick hone at 30º on a fine stone, turn it over flat and remove the burr, and you are off." sounds great to me without all the other stuff that makes it sound like a black art.

it's a simple concept and doable. I've never seen anyone doing it, rounded or flat, send me a tool that's sharp without clearance problems. I've only had one with clearance problems that was sharpened to the edge. Every single part of the process goes subpar (condition of the edge, geometry of the edge, time between sharpenings).

If you have a guide, grind at 25, hone at 32 (it could be 30 or 34, whatever it is), then gradually move to doing that by hand. You grind most of the steel away and control the camber or lack of at the edge with a medium stone and then finish with a fine stone at about the same angle. when the second bevel gets too large to hone easily, you regrind.

if two stones is hard at first, grind nearly to the edge and find something like a washita arkansas stone, raise a burr, work the back, lighten strokes for the last couple of rubs to reduce the strength of the burr and then strop with moderate pressure to remove the burr.

you'll execute that fine every time as long as you grind enough to make it reasonably easy to create a burr without needing a super fast or coarse stone.

 

[Jacob]

I like that @Jacob nice straight advice and " just a quick hone at 30º on a fine stone, turn it over flat and remove the burr, and you are off." sounds great to me without all the other stuff that makes it sound like a black art.

All the new chisels I've ever bought have been slightly hollow on the face. Not sure if this is just a by product of manufacture or deliberate. But either way it makes them really easy to sharpen.
Grinding marks etc on cheaper chisels don't matter either (within reason) - they lose their "sharpness" and become low friction very quickly. They may still show years later but not a prob as the high points get polished by use.

 

[Scruples]

Wouldn't have thought it much of a challenge really

That's because you're not an angler. To catch a fish in it's own environment, you have to understand its environment and the weather, including temperature and the wind direction, it feeding habits at the time you're angling and if the fish is feeding (catchable) or spawning (less catchable) or just not in the mood.

It's no more of a challenge than any sport, but a challenge it definitely is. With knowledge and experience it is likely you'll have a good session. Without the knowledge and experience, it's likely you'll have a quiet day.

Where there is less of a challenge is sea boat fishing where the experience and knowledge belongs to the skipper. The angler is just working from his instructions.

 

[Jacob]

....

Where there is less of a challenge is sea boat fishing where the experience and knowledge belongs to the skipper. The angler is just working from his instructions.

Have caught loads of mackerel from the back of sailing boats.
Drop one hook in, catch one. Drop 5, catch 5!
It is a challenge; eating them, all.
Very tasty and speeds up the frying if you just slice off fillets.
You can get through a lot if you have a bottle of whisky to wash them down with. Cheaper than honing fluid!
We sat in Armadale Harbour some years ago frying our way though the catch and dropping scraps over side. We realised we'd slowly created a large oil slick and attracted lots of birds and seals.

 

[Scruples]

Have caught loads of mackerel from the back of sailing boats.
Drop one hook in, catch one. Drop 5, catch 5!
It is a challenge; eating them, all.
Very tasty and speeds up the frying if you just slice off fillets.
You can get through a lot if you have a bottle of whisky to wash them down with. Cheaper than honing fluid!
We sat in Armadale Harbour some years ago frying our way though the catch and dropping scraps over side. We realised we'd slowly created a large oil slick and attracted lots of birds and seals.

Like I said. The only skill in sea fishing from a boat is where to put the boat. Mackerel are a shoal fish and, like you say, catching them requires no skill so it's called fishing rather than the more skilful angling.

 

[mikej460]

Don't you just love tangents

 

[Jacob]

Like I said. The only skill in sea fishing from a boat is where to put the boat. Mackerel are a shoal fish and, like you say, catching them requires no skill so it's called fishing rather than the more skilful angling.

I guess OCDC modern sharpening is more like angling then, whereas we humble woodworkers can only manage fishing (and more fish to eat!!)......er, praps not, stretching it too far!

 

[Bingy man]

That's because you're not an angler. To catch a fish in it's own environment, you have to understand its environment and the weather, including temperature and the wind direction, it feeding habits at the time you're angling and if the fish is feeding (catchable) or spawning (less catchable) or just not in the mood.

It's no more of a challenge than any sport, but a challenge it definitely is. With knowledge and experience it is likely you'll have a good session. Without the knowledge and experience, it's likely you'll have a quiet day.

Where there is less of a challenge is sea boat fishing where the experience and knowledge belongs to the skipper. The angler is just working from his instructions.

Well didn’t want to start a sharpening thread as my original post was just to enquire why it seems such a taboo subject-query answered lol - however certainly didn’t expect to be discussing fishing either but yes like a lot of hobbies etc it is indeed a challenge as everything you say is correct . The reward for all the efforts carp fishing is when the alarm screams and eventually if you do everything correctly is a decent 20lb +carp in your net , not to fire up the b b q and eat it -that’s what chip shops are for . Fishing is just another of my passions and just like woodwork the more effort you put in the greater the reward even if the reward comes a lot later .wonder how many members have made a really beautiful piece of furniture and a year later it’s still sitting in the workshop unsold- once it does sell and someone else is admiring it the maker is now rewarded ( job satisfaction and a few quid in his or her pocket) such is life as we are all different but the same too.

 

[Adam W.]

Don't you just love tangents

I prefer satsumas.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

I hate oysters.

 

[mikej460]

Oh lord there's another one forming....

 

[mark w]

It's more a case of jigs don't allow you to camber an iron, unless you buy another expensive jig with a cambered roller etc. And so it goes on!

That's not correct Jacob, you can successfully camber a blade with a honing guide without buying any additional rollers, I do it and David Charlesworth demonstrates this in his articles and videos.

 

[Jacob]

What are the cambered rollers for then?

 

[MikeK]

That's not correct Jacob, you can successfully camber a blade with a honing guide without buying any additional rollers, I do it and David Charlesworth demonstrates this in his articles and videos.

Be careful, lest you let facts get in the way of a humorous story.

I had the pleasure of spending four weeks with the late David Charlesworth and learned how to quickly, accurately, and consistently sharpen my tools. This included easily establishing a camber on my plane irons with the LN honing jig. In those four weeks, I never saw David free hand sharpen a chisel or plane iron. He always used the Tormek to establish the 25-degree primary bevel and then switched to the LN honing jig and water stones for the other bevels. This is how I learned, and I am comfortable with it.

 

[MikeK]

What are the cambered rollers for then?

The cambered rollers are another method to accomplish the same thing. There are many paths to the destination.

 

[Jacob]

I always think it's a pity that Charlesworth never got to grips with freehand sharpening.
With his meticulous attention to detail he had just the right mindset for it.

 

[MikeK]

I always think it's a pity that Charlesworth never got to grips with freehand sharpening.
With his meticulous attention to detail he had just the right mindset for it.

I asked David why he used the honing jigs instead of freehand sharpening. He told me it was for the same reason he had a P/T, table saw, router table, and bandsaw in his shop. Some aspects of woodworking have progressed with technology and just because a process worked great for centuries is no reason to hang onto them when there is a better way.

If you are comfortable with freehand, then please continue, but please don't try to force it down the throats of others.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Likewise oilstones.