Rubbish Joinery

[doctor Bob]

I love these types of thread which pop up from time to time.
Everybody jumps on the band wagon slagging it off.

Yet when someone posts up a hand made item which looks terrible, not a peep.................. I did it many years ago, crikey never again.

 

[Benchwayze]

I love these types of thread which pop up from time to time.
Everybody jumps on the band wagon slagging it off.

Yet when someone posts up a hand made item which looks terrible, not a peep.................. I did it many years ago, crikey never again.

I'll have a look after breakfast Bob. See if I can find anything I can slag off! :lol:

 

[doctor Bob]

My comments were aimed at a box made for someones girlfriend, it looked like a 3 year old had made it. The complimentry comments were so sycophantic it was ridiculous, I told a few truths, went down like a lead ballooon. To be honest there is a lot of rubbish posted up here which gets drooled over. Yet a perfectly well made chair made from finger jointed material is the devils work.
I agree it's not my cup of tea, neither is a £30 door from howdens but everybody has a budget.

Is a laminated curve the devils work, or should it be from solid. Lot of people on here talk the talk but don't walk the walk....................

 

[ColeyS1]

No one's first piece of woodwork was spot on though doctor bob. My first piece I was told by a neighbour "it's functional but will look better with a table cloth" I was about 10 at the time and my parents comments were it was dung ! I listened to my neighbour who saw the positives. I still do woodwork and just this week found out joints don't really have to fit- mix up 2pac hard filler and spread them on the joints (wet obviously) and voila- scrape off the excess! A comment can provide encourage or put someone off for life.

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[Benchwayze]

I follow you Bob. However in my case I am a little 'senior' to need something really expensive. I will consider myself fortunate to get another ten years. I needed something that wasn't exactly dire, but which looked as if it would last me out, and looked reasonable. What I bought fits the bill. My pet hate is seeing pallet wood used to make 'character' pieces!!! I agree with recycling, but some of that stuff I woudn't use for a picket fence!

John

 

[ColeyS1]

Just need to clarify, the hard filler comment was a joke lol- though I did see someone do it on site when they made a right hash up getting two pieces of moulding to fit.

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[Armagh]

In relation to the initial post. I'd have to start by saying that I don't think I've ever fitted a solid hardwood liner in my 16 year career so far. If aiming for an oak finish a rebated whitewood frame is installed. The frame is made up an inch wider than the door. A 45mm by 12.5mm solid oak slip is pinned into the rebate before the door is hung. A full width door stop then covers the rest of the frame and indeed this is made up of number smaller offcuts that are wrapped in a thin Oak veneer on three sides. You'll also get "solid oak" skirting made up in exactly the same manner. Hope that all makes sense.

 

[doctor Bob]

No one's first piece of woodwork was spot on though doctor bob.

Quite agree, this was not the chaps first bit of woodwork. I think he did it for a living in some form or other.

 

[Jacob]

....
Taking any of those Howden doors as an example, what would it cost to have a decent door and frame made "properly"?

I'd guess 5 to 10 times as much for one off's, assuming a given design, no surveying required and you have the materials and all the right kit. If not then even more.
Less for a big run perhaps?
The thing about cheap stuff is it's really bloody cheap! Value for money is another issue.

 

[ColeyS1]

No one's first piece of woodwork was spot on though doctor bob.

Quite agree, this was not the chaps first bit of woodwork. I think he did it for a living in some form or other.

Ah....I think I know who you mean now.

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[ScaredyCat]

No one's first piece of woodwork was spot on though doctor bob.

Quite agree, this was not the chaps first bit of woodwork. I think he did it for a living in some form or other.

Presumably if he did it for a living, and hadn't starved to death, then people were buying it, which makes it acceptable to them. ie People buying aren't over critical woodworkers.

OFL make a tidy sum from their stuff. Not everyone can afford had crafted stuff that costs a fortune to buy and not everyone can wait 3 months for the thing they need. I'm sure if everyone could afford, in price and time, master craftsman made furniture we'd have shops on every street doing it. They can't and we don't.




.

 

[doctor Bob]

No one's first piece of woodwork was spot on though doctor bob.

Quite agree, this was not the chaps first bit of woodwork. I think he did it for a living in some form or other.

Presumably if he did it for a living, and hadn't starved to death, then people were buying it, which makes it acceptable to them. ie People buying aren't over critical woodworkers.

OFL make a tidy sum from their stuff. Not everyone can afford had crafted stuff that costs a fortune to buy and not everyone can wait 3 months for the thing they need. I'm sure if everyone could afford, in price and time, master craftsman made furniture we'd have shops on every street doing it. They can't and we don't.
.

I think you have missed the whole point of my posts, I agree with everything you say. All I said was people seem very keen to slag of cheap end joinery but if someone posts up a bit of handmade tut on the forum no one is prepared to say it's shi.te

 

[Lons]

Howdens does have it's place.

My daughter a single girl, hardworking nurse has not a lot spare cash and her own house which is a little old 2 up 2 down. She wanted to replace the existing knackered flush hardboard doors and I haven't time to make from scratch so for the grand sum of £90 she has 6 pressed panel no nonsense doors - not yet fitted of course. #-o

 

[Sheffield Tony]

I think you have missed the whole point of my posts, I agree with everything you say. All I said was people seem very keen to slag of cheap end joinery but if someone posts up a bit of handmade tut on the forum no one is prepared to say it's shi.te

When anyone posts up a project on an internet forum, they ought to be prepared to receive some constructive criticism, query about their design choices etc. I am happy to take on board constructive criticism of my particular brand of "handmade tut".

But saying someones work is "shi.te" is not constructive , just unhelpful, demotivating and arrogant IMHO.

There is also a world of difference between criticising OFL's far east made basic commodity furniture, and criticising an individual forum contributor's best efforts. I assume it was their best efforts; I doubt they'd share it if they knew it was c**p.

 

[doctor Bob]

This is why I don't do it anymore.
I employ guys and take on apprentices most years, all have stayed with me at the end of the 3 year course. I know how to offer constructive critisism. I also know when a piece of work is appaulingly executed by someone who professes to have years of experience. I was prepared to tell them that at the time (not any more as mentioned).
I do not feel I have an exaggerated sense of my own importance or abilities, quite the opposite, to be called arrogant upsets me, you know nothing about my background, you have no knowledge of what I've paid back to many many people, all because people were prepared to do the same for me many years ago.
I'm entitled to my opinion, people don't like it at times and I stopped doing it, this was explained in my posts. I am still entitled to "think" some work is pretty poor, compared to mass produced stuff.

 

[Jacob]

I must say I tend to think that some of the aspirational 'high-end' stuff is not really as good as they think it is. :lol: They are playing a game of their own and it's a pity that many amateurs/beginners feel that they should to join it.
I'm in the middle ground here - I particularly like and admire "ordinary" stuff which is neither as cheap as possible nor over the top.
Difficult to put a finger on it but most 'country' furniture fits (n.b. nothing country about it they made it mostly in and for towns). But they really went to town with tools of the trade - wagons, farm appliances etc often beautifully designed and made, practical and utilitarian but no compromises. Bit of a leap, and a different product, but Ikea is nearer the mark than Howdens. Maybe Ikea should make joinery?

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Maybe they should - they use 1% of the world's timber.

 

[doctor Bob]

Ikea is a typical retail outlet people turn their noses up at because "it's not made properly".
Yet it's functional, invariably stylish, often inovative and incredible value.
I don't see why this makes it rubbish. Disposable possibly but at £6 for a coffee table why not.

 

[Jacob]

Ikea is a typical retail outlet people turn their noses up at because "it's not made properly".
Yet it's functional, invariably stylish, often inovative and incredible value.
I don't see why this makes it rubbish. Disposable possibly but at £6 for a coffee table why not.

Some of the big names made cheap sh.te too, but got 'designer' prices.
I found a Gordon Russel coffee table with the thin veneer lifting off the chipboard and scrapped it. It wasn't superior in any way to a typical Ikea equivalent.
I should have sold it on ebay as for restoration. I saved the stylish label and keep intending to make something to fix it to. Perhaps just swap the label on an Ikea thing and 10x the price at a stroke

 

[Lons]

Ikea is a typical retail outlet people turn their noses up at because "it's not made properly".
Yet it's functional, invariably stylish, often inovative and incredible value.
I don't see why this makes it rubbish. Disposable possibly but at £6 for a coffee table why not.

And can't fault their way of getting footfall into the stores. Free coffee and a bacon bun for £1