Help saving an oak veneered front door.

[DC58]

Hi,

I was wondering if anyone has any advice regarding an oak veneered front door I bought two years back.

Basically I've had a lot of problems ever since I bought it, as as soon as it was installed I noticed it had a 12mm bow in it. It's engineered and has a softwood and MDF core with external oak veneer. The external side faces east and as such gets a lot of sun until the afternoon. Combined with the bowing (and the poor quality of the door) this has led to the veneer beginning to peel off the front. The door came prefinished but as the veneer is beginning to crack and I wondered if maybe I could add oil or do something to try to at least slow down the deterioration. The door cost £400.00 so wasn't cheap.

I've attached a few photos.

Just to note I complained to the manufacturers XL Joinery about the door as soon as I realised how bad the bow was but they were very unhelpful.

Thanks for any advice

 

[rogxwhit]

Dunno what to suggest right off but I'm appalled by the door being bowed that much as supplied - is the bow in the height or width, or both at once? Doesn't it affect the weathersealing of door & frame? And I feel that you should've pursued this harder immediately after installation.

Do you have any photo evidence from that time?

Since a couple of years have now elapsed, I suspect that the suppliers would claim that their door with that composite construction should've been protected by a porch, or that there's some other condition that you've violated. Unfortunately it looks as if the bond between facing & substrate is failing behind the cracks. You could try injecting waterproof glue and clamping the face down flat with cauls till that sets, but you might not have any clamps?? You'd have to fill / scrape / sand and re-finish afterwards. Desperate measures! :-(

 

[Jacob]

Hi,

I was wondering if anyone has any advice regarding an oak veneered front door I bought two years back.

Basically I've had a lot of problems ever since I bought it, as as soon as it was installed I noticed it had a 12mm bow in it. It's engineered and has a softwood and MDF core with external oak veneer. The external side faces east and as such gets a lot of sun until the afternoon. Combined with the bowing (and the poor quality of the door) this has led to the veneer beginning to peel off the front. The door came prefinished but as the veneer is beginning to crack and I wondered if maybe I could add oil or do something to try to at least slow down the deterioration. The door cost £400.00 so wasn't cheap.

I've attached a few photos.

Just to note I complained to the manufacturers XL Joinery about the door as soon as I realised how bad the bow was but they were very unhelpful.

Thanks for any advice

Veneered external door doomed to fail. Not to mention the softwood and MDF core - lucky it's lasted so long!
You've been ripped off basically.
If you could stick down the veneer a few coats of paint might help, but I'd look at getting a proper job done with a new door.

 

[Doug71]

I have an account with XL Joinery but don't use them anymore because of similar problems (I had 5 external Oak fail on just one job). They did replace some doors under guarantee but they don't cover the cost of me re hanging, staining etc which leaves me out of pocket.

I avoid all external off the peg doors these days as they are all veneered and fail quickly.

£400 is not cheap for a door that fails but for a joiner to make one out of solid wood it would be more than double that which is why the cheaper veneered ones are popular.

As to what to do with yours all I can suggest is getting some glue behind the veneer and sticking it down, you might need to use a stanley knife to cut the veneer and open it up in places. The only kind of clear external treatment that will seal it is an external varnish.

 

[Jameshow]

I'd put epoxy in the gap and clamp down as tightly as possible!

Then I'd epoxy the whole door before painting with yacht varnish.

That way the epoxy stabilizes the door whilst the varnish gives you a wearing coat (might need doing every 1-2 years) and protects the epoxy from UV light.

That's the yachtie technique!!

West are the posh brand for epoxy but others are available.

 

[DC58]

Dunno what to suggest right off but I'm appalled by the door being bowed that much as supplied - is the bow in the height or width, or both at once? Doesn't it affect the weathersealing of door & frame? And I feel that you should've pursued this harder immediately after installation.

Do you have any photo evidence from that time?

Since a couple of years have now elapsed, I suspect that the suppliers would claim that their door with that composite construction should've been protected by a porch, or that there's some other condition that you've violated. Unfortunately it looks as if the bond between facing & substrate is failing behind the cracks. You could try injecting waterproof glue and clamping the face down flat with cauls till that sets, but you might not have any clamps?? You'd have to fill / scrape / sand and re-finish afterwards. Desperate measures! :-(

 

[Jacob]

......I suspect that the suppliers would claim that their door with that composite construction should've been protected by a porch,.....

It's either an internal or an external door. There's no half way - it's an internal door. And poor quality.

 

[DC58]

Dunno what to suggest right off but I'm appalled by the door being bowed that much as supplied - is the bow in the height or width, or both at once? Doesn't it affect the weathersealing of door & frame? And I feel that you should've pursued this harder immediately after installation.

Do you have any photo evidence from that time?

Since a couple of years have now elapsed, I suspect that the suppliers would claim that their door with that composite construction should've been protected by a porch, or that there's some other condition that you've violated. Unfortunately it looks as if the bond between facing & substrate is failing behind the cracks. You could try injecting waterproof glue and clamping the face down flat with cauls till that sets, but you might not have any clamps?? You'd have to fill / scrape / sand and re-finish afterwards. Desperate measures! :-(

Thanks for responding. Yes so was I appalled. It's on the height. I realised there was a problem when I couldn't get it to close once the weather seal was in place. I had to adjust the hinges but of course the top and bottom don't sit tight in the frame. Over time/through the seasons it moves around like a jelly!
XL Joinery claimed I'd voided any warranty because I'd not varnished the letter plate cutout! This was after it had been in situ for about a week!
I do have some sash clamps I could use but I was also worried that maybe in the course of straightening (by clamping back in place) one bit of veneer it might end up breaking the sections near to it. That's why I wondered if maybe adding some moisture in the form of Danish oil or something similar might help. I accept though it's difficult on a prefinished door.
I've attached the original photo to show you the bow.
As I see others have said; in hindsight I think engineered doors for a front door are asking for trouble. I work with MDF a lot making fitted furniture and you've only got to leave it in the sun for a few minutes and it's bowed, so putting it in a front door with widely varying temperatures on either side seems daft to me.

 

[DC58]

Veneered external door doomed to fail. Not to mention the softwood and MDF core - lucky it's lasted so long!
You've been ripped off basically.
If you could stick down the veneer a few coats of paint might help, but I'd look at getting a proper job done with a new door.

Cheers I think you're probably right on all counts.

 

[DC58]

I have an account with XL Joinery but don't use them anymore because of similar problems (I had 5 external Oak fail on just one job). They did replace some doors under guarantee but they don't cover the cost of me re hanging, staining etc which leaves me out of pocket.

I avoid all external off the peg doors these days as they are all veneered and fail quickly.

£400 is not cheap for a door that fails but for a joiner to make one out of solid wood it would be more than double that which is why the cheaper veneered ones are popular.

As to what to do with yours all I can suggest is getting some glue behind the veneer and sticking it down, you might need to use a stanley knife to cut the veneer and open it up in places. The only kind of clear external treatment that will seal it is an external varnish.

Thanks. It doesn't surprise me. I absolutely wouldn't get another but as you say solid would be really dear and the house doesn't really justify it to be honest. Thanks for the advice though.

 

[DC58]

I'd put epoxy in the gap and clamp down as tightly as possible!

Then I'd epoxy the whole door before painting with yacht varnish.

That way the epoxy stabilizes the door whilst the varnish gives you a wearing coat (might need doing every 1-2 years) and protects the epoxy from UV light.

That's the yachtie technique!!

West are the posh brand for epoxy but others are available.

Ok thanks for the advice. I've never used epoxy resin before. But I see it seems to be paired with a hardener. Would I need this as well? Without getting too technical how would the epoxy stabilise the door?
The internal side of the door is perfect but might I still need to do this side as well to balance out the moisture content?

 

[Bingy man]

Tbh I think any time effort and money spent on this door is a waste of time .better to cut your losses and start afresh with as Jacob has said ( a new door ) I’d go with a solid door this time stained to your choice with a few coats of quality exterior varnish. Removing a manufacturer’s coating is not easy and the current damage is a major concern. Don’t turn a £400 door into a £550 door by spending more money on it ..

 

[DC58]

It's either an internal or an external door. There's no half way - it's an internal door. And poor quality.

It's marketed as an external door with a price tag to match!

 

[DC58]

Tbh I think any time effort and money spent on this door is a waste of time .better to cut your losses and start afresh with as Jacob has said ( a new door ) I’d go with a solid door this time stained to your choice with a few coats of quality exterior varnish. Removing a manufacturer’s coating is not easy and the current damage is a major concern. Don’t turn a £400 door into a £550 door by spending more money on it ..

Thanks, I know what you mean. No point flogging a dead horse. I think I'm in denial to be honest.

 

[Jameshow]

Ok thanks for the advice. I've never used epoxy resin before. But I see it seems to be paired with a hardener. Would I need this as well? Without getting too technical how would the epoxy stabilise the door?
The internal side of the door is perfect but might I still need to do this side as well to balance out the moisture content?

The epoxy is mixed one to one.

The epoxy will prevent moisture from permitating into the oak veneer and then the varnish stops UV yellowing the epoxy.

I'll look for some more information..

Lots of info here for and against!!!

https://forums.ybw.com/index.php?threads/varnish-over-epoxy.267281/

 

[baldkev]

Different epoxy brands have different mix ratios..... and the good epoxys are uv stable.
Id agree with the above that it isnt worth spending more on it.

 

[Bingy man]

Thanks, I know what you mean. No point flogging a dead horse. I think I'm in denial to be honest.

My old Ford c max died recently- £90 on a new battery and good to go , 2 days later and back to square one - my mechanic friend informed me that the alternator has gone - £140 +vat and £50 to fit - great I thought until he then says the turbo has blown oil onto alternator and will also need changing at £1,300 + vat + fitting so end of days and sold to breakers for £400 towards a new second hand car .

 

[mikej460]

I've been following this thread with interest as we have a similar problem. 5 years ago I bought a external door from a guy on eBay for £80. It was meant to be temporary until I built my new workshop, when I planned make a new one; however, Covid and life have delayed the build. Ours is an engineered door with laminated hardwood block frame with oak veneer and you guessed it, the veneer is peeling off on the outside face. The door is otherwise solid, no bowing and opens and shuts really well; it still looks great on the inside. My workshop build will be starting soon but I'm not expecting it to be complete until next next spring and there are several other woodworking projects on the list as well as the door, so I need to temporarily repair it.

What I would like to do is to epoxy the lifted veneer down, fill any missing veneer and paint the outside. I've never done anything like this before so any advice on how to apply the epoxy and clamp it all down would be very welcome.

 

[okeydokey]

The mikej460 door is still pretty solid and works well, for my money I would give it a good sand down then either stain then a good go with yacht varnish or simply coloured hatch varnish - should be a relatively quick economical repair that will keep the weather out of the door for several years to come. If there is a missing bit of timber then infill with Evostick external wood glue before the above
btw Sadolin Extra Durable Woodstain is pretty good as well

 

[Misterdog]

I bought an XL 'oak' door many years ago, what a piece of rubbish.
Failed visually within 8 weeks despite being treated as per recommendations, XL refused any warranty claim and said it needed to be protected by a porch.

From their website.

All doors are designed to exceptionally high standards our design team works hard to ensure our range of external doors meet current trends, building regulations and also perform to the desired standards.

GavinC-144
23 Nov 2019

XL Joinery, what a joke.​

Don't buy internal doors from XL Joinery, the quality is really poor and the aftercare service is even worse. I bought 21 internal doors and over a year 15 have warped, XL are not interested as the doors were not painted behind the hinges!
DO NOT BUY DOORS FROM XL JOINERY

20 - 1star reviws, no option for 0 stars.

https://www.yell.com/biz/x-l-joinery-batley-3315892/
Though many other review sites give glowing ratings (supplied by their workforce ?)