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No skills

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Hello again folks, hope the xmas build up isnt getting everybody down :ho2

Whilst digging through a tool box I'd not been near for a long time I found a fairly un-molested (straight, mostly rust free!!)set of stanley dynagrip chisels. I think their the first version of the dynagrip's, as its the nearest thing I have to a complete set of chisels I thought I'll tidy them up, sharpen them and stick them in my new tool cabinet * when its done. However I dont seem to have a 50mm chisel, not essential I know but its bugging me now. I've had a mooch round on the internet and found that theres been a couple of handle revisions over the years, I've also noticed that none of the new ones are marked as sheffield steel :?:

Has anybody had the old and new ones and noticed a difference in the quality of the steel? not saying mine are great but I'd rather not get a new one and have it be complete tat :)

Cheers all...

* new year project
 

Mike Wingate

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Forget about creating a set and use what you have. I only have 6 Stanley 5001's anything larger than a 1" out there. My blue 5002 1 1/2" spoils the aesthetics of the tool rack! Not joking. I should have been kept away from catalogues as a child. Dinky military. Camera equipment, tools, Bike parts, bike clothing, clothing. The internet is just one big catalogue and I want it all, as long as it comes in matching sets!
 

No skills

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I try not to be a shopper... lucky enough I cant afford to be one anyway :)

Anyhow the handles wont bother me much... possably... I had planned to make some handles in the future (project #2743-b) so that would sort it - just wondering about the bit that counts really. Play doh cutting edges are annoying even for a complete butcher like me :(
 

Jacob

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Paul Chapman":hndwllln said:
Forget about new Stanley chisels - the steel is rubbish. ,,,,,,

Paul
How do you know that Paul?
NB We all know you've got a bit of a thing about Stanley! :shock:
 

bugbear

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No skills":94ph63s4 said:
Hello again folks, hope the xmas build up isnt getting everybody down :ho2

Whilst digging through a tool box I'd not been near for a long time I found a fairly un-molested (straight, mostly rust free!!)set of stanley dynagrip chisels. I think their the first version of the dynagrip's, as its the nearest thing I have to a complete set of chisels I thought I'll tidy them up, sharpen them and stick them in my new tool cabinet * when its done. However I dont seem to have a 50mm chisel, not essential I know but its bugging me now. I've had a mooch round on the internet and found that theres been a couple of handle revisions over the years, I've also noticed that none of the new ones are marked as sheffield steel :?:

Has anybody had the old and new ones and noticed a difference in the quality of the steel? not saying mine are great but I'd rather not get a new one and have it be complete tat :)

Cheers all...

* new year project
Since you've got them, it costs you little to give 'em a go. They wouldn't have been my recommendation though.

Bugbear
 

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[/quote]

They wouldn't have been my recommendation though.

Bugbear[/quote]


Mine neither! :D

But their here, cost me very little (bout a fiver if I recall) and dont need that much work to sort, what is annoying tho I thought I had a complete set of older marples split proof's hanging round but I can only find two or three :evil:

Getting something like a narex or AI to finish the set seems like putting alloy wheels on trabant #-o
 

Pete Maddex

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Hi,

I have a set of Stanley Dynagrip and Marples as my going out chisels and they are fine, they where my main set at one point and they aren't bad, flatten the backs and sharpen them and they will seve you well enough.
Old Cast Steel chisels are nicer to use and will hold a sharper edge for longer.

Pete
 

woodbloke

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I did a chisel test a couple of years ago for F&C using a range of inexpensive Stanley's and the like as well as more esoteric offerings from LN, Blue Spruce and Veritas. Paul C is right, without exception, the cheapo Stanley's and similar (Irwin etc) were made of steel only a little harder than decent cheddar. At the lower end of the market, I found the Marples with the yellow splinterproof handles very good (they might have been Sheffield made though) Footprint (no longer available) and Bahco's to be good. 'Two Cherries', Pfeil and LV chisels were also excellent in the sort of mid-price range...top on test in all respects were A2 LN's - Rob
 

andy king

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woodbloke":3r2yjjzz said:
I did a chisel test a couple of years ago for F&C using a range of inexpensive Stanley's and the like as well as more esoteric offerings from LN, Blue Spruce and Veritas. Paul C is right, without exception, the cheapo Stanley's and similar (Irwin etc) were made of steel only a little harder than decent cheddar. At the lower end of the market, I found the Marples with the yellow splinterproof handles very good (they might have been Sheffield made though) Footprint (no longer available) and Bahco's to be good. 'Two Cherries', Pfeil and LV chisels were also excellent in the sort of mid-price range...top on test in all respects were A2 LN's - Rob
Aside from the actual structure of the steel itself which may throw up issues, this seems at odds with tests I had done for Good Woodworking a couple of years back.
I had 18 different chisels independently tested for Rockwell C hardness and although I didn't have a Stanley Dynagrip in there, I did have a FatMax, (Sheffield made version) an Irwin 'Splitproof' which is the replacement of the original Marples one (no indication of origin, but likely outside of the UK) as well as a set from Axminster and S&J on the lower end side. A few older cast steel type, (Preston etc) as well as higher end chisels from LN, AI, Sorby plus Two Cherries, MHG, older Stanleys etc.
In that test, the results showed that the Irwins were 61C, Stanley FatMax 59.5C.
The Two Cherries was 60C, while an old Mawhood came in at 59.5C. AI was 60C, Sorby 60.5C, so the 'hardness' factor isn't the issue from those figures.
Across the board they averaged around 60C, with the Preston the hardest at 63C, the Footprint close behind at 62C.
Worse were the S&J, only 56C, and noticible both at the prep stage, and for durability.

cheers,
Andy
 

Newbie_Neil

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Hi Andy,

andy king":34uzxy77 said:
Aside from the actual structure of the steel itself which may throw up issues, this seems at odds with tests I had done for Good Woodworking a couple of years back.
Do you remember which issue your test was in?

Thanks,
Neil
 

bobbybirds

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I had the opportunity to test drive some of the new Stanley Sweetheart chisels for an afternoon chopping and paring some DT's a few months ago. I have to admit I REALLY had a predisposition to disliking these and had the mindset that they would be a waste of money, but they very much surprised me. I don't want to say that they are the most amazing chisels going, but they they felt good in hand, really held an edge quite well and did their job admirably. I think you could do a lots worse than the new ones...
 

andy king

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Newbie_Neil":1msdotmd said:
Hi Andy,

andy king":1msdotmd said:
Aside from the actual structure of the steel itself which may throw up issues, this seems at odds with tests I had done for Good Woodworking a couple of years back.
Do you remember which issue your test was in?

Thanks,
Neil
Hi Neil,

I have it down as issue 218.

cheers,
Andy
 

bugbear

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bobbybirds":2piipaxc said:
I had the opportunity to test drive some of the new Stanley Sweetheart chisels for an afternoon chopping and paring some DT's a few months ago. I have to admit I REALLY had a predisposition to disliking these and had the mindset that they would be a waste of money, but they very much surprised me. I don't want to say that they are the most amazing chisels going, but they they felt good in hand, really held an edge quite well and did their job admirably. I think you could do a lots worse than the new ones...
I think the OP was talking about the "normal" Stanley chisels, but I may be wrong.

I would certainly hope there's a performance difference between the Sweetheart and the others (note - googling reveals that Stanley make an amazing number of chisel models, including fatmax, Bailey, 16-150 series, 16-324, 16-180 series, ).

Amazon (USA) has $31.50 for a 1" 750 Sweetheart, but $12.99 gets you a 3 piece set of 16-150's.

BugBear
 

Jacob

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Are these the ones with flavoured handles? Make mine Dandelion & Burdock!
 

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Nice to see this thread has run on a bit.

In random order..

Is the absolute hardness of the steel the be all and end all of what makes a good cutting edge? or are there other traits of the metal that needs to be considered?

Yes I have been refering to the standard off the shelf stanleys rather than anything considered 'top end' by them, does any body know when the 'lower' models stopped using 'sheffield steel' - the ones I have here are around the 10 year or slightly older mark.

From the browsing I have done so far the only chisels I saw from the big manufacturers that claimed to have better quality steel were the marples blue chip, forgot to bookmark the page tho #-o

More tommorrow, cant type any more :oops:
 

bugbear

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No skills":2cjjcnxl said:
Is the absolute hardness of the steel the be all and end all of what makes a good cutting edge?
No - but it's the simplest proxy. The "real" situation is so complex you need to be a metallurgist to understand it all.

Assuming the maker has integrity and hasn't gone for hardness "regardless", harder very-much-tends-to-be better.

The most obvious difficulty is that a fine, thin, light, hard cabinet makers chisel can be too much of a racing thoroughbred if you want some on-site prying out of old putty. That doesn't make it a bad chisel, any more than a Ferrari is a bad car. But if you want to transport a family of 8, it's the wrong car.

BugBear
 

Jacob

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No skills":1xvt8t38 said:
...

Is the absolute hardness of the steel the be all and end all of what makes a good cutting edge?
No certainly not. Basically nearly all chisels, hard or soft, are perfectly usable. Though there will be some at both ends of the spectrum approaching uselessness. Harder means slower sharpening and risk of brittleness, and vice versa, so it's always a trade off.
Some uses would particularly benefit from hardness e.g. thin carving gouges , but this would be a disadvantage with other uses, due to the brittleness.
 

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So, rockwell hardness figures arent the be all and end all - unless one particular result is significantly different (higher or lower) then alarm bells should be ringing. Not knocking the work that people have put into the testing or anything like that, but its obviously part of the whole picture.

Having been following the other current chisel thread it seems apparent that anybody wanting advice on what to buy really needs to be very precise on what work the tool needs to do. Just saying 'bit of everything' can be answered simply by saying go buy some main stream bevel edge chisels, where as 'take the sharpest edge possible for paring' (for example) can then be answered specificly.

Amusingly I've decided to leave my own purchase for now, having priced up some new good quality 2" chisels and then had a laugh at what the ebay dealers want for an old one its just not worth it to complete a set thats not needed at the moment. Hell, if I get stuck for one I'll weld two 1" ones together :twisted:

Thanks all for chipping in :ho2
 
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