Le tonkinois

[johnnyb]

Just brought a litre of this gloop. I've used it on some mahogany bench seats and it's actually a really nice product. It gives a really yachty finish. I've seen it at Harrogate demonstrated by the same old chap for the many years I've gone to this traditional show.
His demo pieces seemed very toffee apple as i guess he'd put many many coats on. But with fewer coats it's a nice bright finish.
It's an interesting product really. Based on Tung oil and linseed oil heated and mixed with pure resin(?) I'm guessing it's unlike any vernis available today. It's a harmless product with no nasty petroleum distillates. It's available in 2 forms classic which is the original formula from Indo China. And Marine vernis no1 which is slightly modified.
I've only used the latter. It's what would be termed a long oil varnish. Brush strokes just don't happen as it takes ages to tack quality brushes aren't really necessary. It builds very quickly as it has no solvents so doesn't really shrink back. If you could apply this in a totally dust free place it would be really shiny.
It's made by a small manufacturer in France to an old recipe.
The finish after 24 hrs is sandable(vernis no1) but after 48hrs is better.
I'm going to experiment by mixing it with oils to make a wiping varnish next.
The finish it gives is unique really almost like Chinese lacquer. The colour it imparts on mahogany is lovely I'm guessing it would be not so nice on pale woods.
It's supposed to be very very durable and not crack.

 

[marcros]

I would be interested to see a picture of your seats. I have seen it at the show, but like you say it is like a toffee apple and doesn't look nice on the items that I inspected there. On paper, it looked useful.

 

[johnnyb]

I think to promote a product you really need an understanding of how your market thinks.for instance i know just using the word varnish will send woodworkers off. Take polyx it's certainly not an oil in fact some of osmos products are more like le tonk (uv oil). But because of the manner of it's promotion ( no mention of varnish) it attracts people. Le tonk is actually a finishing oil. Certainly very bright (shiny) surfaces are frowned on these days. But I've seen osmo put on a bit heavily and it's like a varnish. I think it's real attraction is as a mixer in wipe on oil finishes. It will add body and strength.

 

[johnnyb]

People are gravitating towards paints made with linseed oil as a green product that actually performs better than there low voc brand equivalents. It's promoted by an older chap whose main market has been yachts but flip around how it's sold ( although the tin and all the french stuff and it's old fashioned feel appeals to me) remove all trigger words ( varnish linseed Tung Marine etc) work on it's green cred. Allow the user to wipe on and wipe off. Add gelomat to tone down the brightness. Produce it in at least one penetrating finish giving the option of a built up film. For instance deks olje no1 and no2. ( Already done btw)
Osmo despite being an oil varnish( and being very slow drying) has taken the market.

 

[ED65]

It's an interesting product really. Based on Tung oil and linseed oil heated and mixed with pure resin(?) I'm guessing it's unlike any vernis available today.

That's the basic way all varnishes were made, the resin being 'run' into the oil using heat.

I'm going to experiment by mixing it with oils to make a wiping varnish next.

Generally you only dilute varnishes to turn them into wiping varnish. You add oil and dilute if you want to make something akin to Danish oil, i.e. a "penetrating oil finish" like the original formula for Tung Oil Finish developed by Formby, which rather surprisingly has never contained any tung oil.

Spar varnishes are already very heavy in oil, with much higher oil levels than any typical (modern) indoor varnish, hence the difference in colour. So adding more oil doesn't seem like it would be beneficial.

If I might suggest, you'll get a better wiping varnish by starting with oil-based polyurethane. Lighter in colour, more resistant to scratches and harder/tougher so stronger in thin coats.

 

[johnnyb]

I think tonk is more like stand oil. I've also got a product called Chinese wood oil which is very similar to le tonk but very penetrating( made by auson) i use it 1/3oil 1/3 pine tar1/3 white spirit. But usually add more double boiled linseed to make up the oil part.i use it on exterior oak which it stains a gorgeous colour. Different colour pine tars are available btw. (Lighter and darker) it isn't light fast which at first seems a pain but actually it leads to a nice toning down

 

[ED65]

Well "China wood oil" is one of the commercial names for tung, so maybe that Auson product is just tung oil. If so no surprise it's very penetrating

 

[Newbie_Neil]

I've used Le tonkinois on a garden shed and it gave me a beautiful mellow colour. I bought five litres at the last show so that I will be ready to re-coat this summer.

Neil

 

[johnnyb]

Strangely i did a job for a chap who had a timber garage with oak cladding and every year he would Danish oil it! This building was quite big as well. He was very persnickety and i imagine whomever put it up 15 years ago off handedly saying oh treat it yearly with danish. Of course 15 coats later it's really shiny.

 

[AndyT]

I agree that it's really good stuff.
My post here has some pictures of it in use:

found-a-good-finish-for-outdoor-oak-t107328.html

 

[johnnyb]

I've found it gives quite a nice finish on darker red coloured woods with good clarity. Dust free for 8hrs is the key though! Then it's got a slightly shimmering finish. Bit like the coach paint finish but clear. Also 48hrs before denibbing.

 

[Doingupthehouse]

We used Tonk on our last boat renovation. Fantastic stuff, I’d never personally use it on any furniture, but on a boat, marvellous.

I think we applied 8 coats to the cockpit of our boat with no sign of any peeling or flaking a few years later - unlike some of the areas we did with International varnish. Very easy to apply - we found foam rubber ‘Jenny’ brushes the best.

Will definitely be using it for the exterior woodwork of our current boat restoration project.

Simon

 

[johnbb99]

That looks excellent Simon. Why not on furniture - is it just that you don't go for the high gloss look?

 

[Doingupthehouse]

That looks excellent Simon. Why not on furniture - is it just that you don't go for the high gloss look?

It’s not so much the gloss -although I’m not a fan on furniture. It’s more the thickness of the film, as has been mentioned, it can be a bit toffee apple like.

Simon

 

[ED65]

Any film finish can be applied thick or thin, regardless of how it's normally intended to be used. Varnishes, two-pack polyurethane, polyester, epoxy, lacquers of most types, all can be applied as barely-there finishes by diluting heavily. Clear finishes are all-binder, there's no risk of weakening the product as you can with paints so you can dilute to any level, just as with a 'spitcoat' of shellac where what goes on is mostly methylated spirits.

And any finish that's glossier than desired can have the shine knocked back, there are multiple methods.

 

[johnnyb]

I think with careful application on the right wood i think tonk could be used. Maybe in a mixed application. For example many years ago i had a load of mouseman furniture that was lightly damaged in a fire. We contacted mouseman and explained the situation and asked them what finish they used. They said ronseal varnish on table tops and I'll have to be honest i can't remember exactly but it was wax or oil and wax on everything else.