Japanese Samurai Laminated Plane Blades

[scooby]

I really need a replacement iron for my Bailey 5 1/2. The original Stanley iron won't hold an edge at all and is chipping VERY easily.

I was going to get a Clifton iron and 2 piece chipbreaker but upon reading the fitting requirements I don't think it will fit my plane (it's an old one, which I've read have narrower throats).

As an alternative I saw Japanese Samurai Laminated Plane Blades listen on the Axminster site. I'm thinking of trying one of these with the stanley chipbreaker. Are these irons any good?

Or would a clifton iron with the original stanley chipbreaker work?

thanks

 

[jasonB]

Not tried the Japanese blades but I did get a Lie-Nielson replacement blade for my old style stanley 601/2 block plane and am very pleased with it. Took about a week to arrive and the exchange rate is quite good at the moment

http://www.lie-nielsen.com/catalog.php?cat=512

Jason

 

[Paul Chapman]

Hi Scooby,

I fitted a Clifton blade and two-piece cap iron to my Record planes. Because of the extra thickness of both the blade and the cap iron I needed an exra-long screw and a longer 'Y' lever, both of which Clifton supplied (free of charge ). I also needed to file the mouth of the planes. There was a marked improvement in performance.

Subsequently I bought three Clifton planes (nos. 4.5, 6 & 7), which, in my view, are head and shoulders above Record and Stanley. In particular, I really like the bedrock style frog which enables you to increase and decrease the width of the mouth without faffing about dismantling the plane.

However, to answer your question, yes the Stanley chipbreaker should fit a Clifton blade. You might get away with the original screw and 'Y' lever, but if not, longer ones are available.

Hope this helps :wink:

Paul

 

[MIGNAL]

I have had one of the replacement Japanese blades from Axminster, can't say I'm a fan. The steel is hard and the edge lasts but it's the same thickness as the standard blade and I prefer the slightly thicker blades offered by others - especially as I sharpen without a guide. Hock? Lie Nielsen, Clifton and Ashley Iles all offer alternatives.

 

[Colin C]

I use one and am very happy with it
Its in my No6

 

[Alf]

Scooby, you could look into a L-N or Hock improved cap iron (chip breaker). I incline to the heresy that the cap iron gives better value for money in plane performance improvement than the iron. The latter is more an edge retention improvement, although thicker irons do help PP to a certain extent of course.

Cheers, Alf

 

[Paul Chapman]

Scooby,

I think there is certainly some merit in Alf's suggestion about improved performance with a better cap iron. When I started modifying my planes I began by replacing the cap irons and that certainly resulted in some significant improvement. If you don't want to go down the road of filing the mouth of your plane, from my experience you could fit a Clifton cap iron (I've not tried other makes) to a normal thickness blade without having to touch the mouth. One advantage I find of the Clifton two-piece cap iron is that because the fixed part bolts to the blade, it has the effect of making a quite significant improvement to the ridigity of the blade so would tend to give you some of the benefit of a thicker blade without having to fit one. An important point about the cap iron, of course, is to ensure that there is a good fit between it and the blade and it sometimes helps to polish the top surface with something like Solvol Autosol so that the shavings glide off nicely :wink:

Paul

 

[Derek Cohen (Perth Oz)]

I have used the combination of a Smoothcut blade plus Clifton stayset in my Stanley #7 (Type 11) for a few years now. It performs very well.

The Smoothcut I believe is the same blade as the Samurai.

I am not a fan of the Clifton stayset. I find it too finicky - too many times the bloody toe piece has dropped off when I removed the blade for sharpening. Luckily, I was able to prevent it hitting the floor by catching it on my foot. :shock: I prefer the one piece LN chipbreaker, which is beautifully made.

I did write a review of the LN chipbreaker a few years back, comparing the results with-and without one. It appeared to made a significant difference to the performance and it would be a cheap upgrade, as Alf suggests. I am, nevertheless, sceptical whether a thicker chipbreaker can emulate a thicker blade. A thick blade would still be my preferred choice (however, the mouth of my #7 is too small to fit one, hence the thinner Smoothcut).

Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[scooby]

Thanks for all the help.

I'm not sure if the samurai iron is thicker than the stock Stanley iron (the Axminster site doesn't give any info on thickness.

Think I'll try for a Samuria iron and a Lie Nielsen chipbreaker. Is it likely these will fit my Bailey 5 1/2 or will I need to file the throat opening?

If so, how hard is it to file the throat? Do I just a normal file for filing metal or is there a better way?

Please keep the advice coming and thanks again

 

[Paul Chapman]

how hard is it to file the throat? Do I just a normal file for filing metal or is there a better way?

I don't know anything about the combination you are going for, but with a bit of luck you won't need to file the mouth. However, if you need to it's not difficult - the metal isn't that hard. Just a normal metalworking file. Take it slowly and keep checking frequently - it's easy to remove the metal but difficult to put it back :wink:

Paul

 

[Frank D.]

Think I'll try for a Samuria iron and a Lie Nielsen chipbreaker. Is it likely these will fit my Bailey 5 1/2 or will I need to file the throat opening?

With the Japanese iron you probably won't have to file the throat, but the screw for the lever cap might not be long enough (because of the thicker chipbreaker). Ask for a longer screw when you buy the chipbreaker. They might not have one (LN gave me one for free, but you might be buying from someone else) and you might not need it, but then again it might save you some hassle if you can pick one up at the same time.
Just a thought.
Please let us know how it goes when you've tried out the Samurai blade on some tough woods!

 

[MikeW]

The Samurai blades are 2 mm, which is 0.0787, about 5/64. Plenty thin enough for the original chip breaker and or bolt.

As well, I cannot imagine that thin of blade would fill the mouth so much it would need filed.

Strikes me BB has used them or ??? on the forum.

Take care, Mike

 

[Alf]

Yeah, BB's your man for these, but being the weekend he'lll probably not pick this up 'til Monday.

Cheers, Alf

 

[MIGNAL]

You won't need to file the mouth of the plane. As Mike states the Japanese blade is 2 mm thick which happens to be the same as the Sanley or Record
originals. Personally I'd go with a thicker blade rather than a thicker chip breaker but that's just my opinion, some people even advocate no chipbreaker at all!

 

[David C]

Samurai has good hard carbon steel but is thin.

If you can sharpen them, (preferably waterstones), Hock and L-N A2 cryo blades keep you working significantly longer.

They both make 2.4mm replacement blades which are designed to fit, usually without throat filing, or problems of screw or Y lever length. This job is not difficult if you are used to filing, anyway.

Thicker blades, like L-N 3.6 mm may require replacement Y lever.

Hock or L-N A2 with L-N improved chipbreaker, is what we generally fit on my summer, plane and chisel tuning, 5 day short courses. There are some notes on my website, short courses page, with some new short video clips. www.davidcharlesworth.co.uk

David Charlesworth

 

[woodbloke]

Paul Chapman wrote:

it's easy to remove the metal but difficult to put it back

I tried to fit a LN replacement blade to a very old Record T5 jack plane which included some fettling and filing of the mouth. The thickness of the blade and the position of the rectangular hole for the Y lever adjustment meant that the new blade would not, could not ever fit, so I had to revert back to the original skinny Record blade. Problem was that I now had a mouth in the sole of the plane that you could sail the Titanic through :roll: :roll: . Got round it tho' by epoxy gluing a small piece of 'Tufnol' in place and then carefully filing back to the original profile and flushing off the sole, works as good as new now - Rob

 

[Paul Chapman]

Neat solution, Rob - doubt if many people would have thought of that :wink:

Paul

 

[scooby]

Out of curiousity is there anywhere else (in the UK) that sells the Japanese laminted irons (in 2 3/8" width)?

To compare prices, etc

thanks

Cracking advice by the way

 

[jasonB]

Not sure of the UK but Dickdo them, usually deliver in a few days to the UK.

Jason

 

[Colin C]

I think Tilgear do them too but iw ill have a look to make sure