Handtool Advise

[endgrain]

Hi guys,

Just found this forum as I was searching for some new tools and was hoping you could give me some advise, I'm a time served Joiner looking to upgrade my tools to a better quality and demote my current set to my site bag. The tools I am using at the moment are standard Marples chisels and Stanley planes not the old versions though and after reading this forum the last few days it looks like the Ashley Isles chisels and Quangsheng Planes are a good bang for buck so before I purchase a few bits I would just like to ask a few questions.

How hard can I hit the Ashley Isles chisels with a mallet without snapping them or breaking the handle?

Do Quangsheng do a four and a half size?

I all so used to have 3 DMT stones when they first come out a Blue, Red and Green but they all lost there edge eventually and had to dispose of them are they any better these days? What about Trends offerings are they better?

I have a old Record 077A Bullnose plane which is missing the blade asjustment anyone know where to get spare parts?


Thanks for the help.

 

[GazPal]

Hi and welcome to the forum.

PM sent regarding the parts you need.

 

[matthewwh]

Hi Endgrain,

Welcome to the forum.

You won't break an Ashley Iles chisel by hitting it with a mallet. The danger is getting it stuck too far into the wood (they go in very easily) and then breaking it whilst levering back and forth trying to extricate it. If used correctly for the type of work they are designed for, 90% of the time you will be pushing them and the other 10% will be very light accurate taps. If you feel the need to raise the mallet above your head then either they need sharpening or you are trying to take too big a bite.

We do have some new goodies from Quangsheng on the way, but unfortunately a 4-1/2 isn't among them this time.

Diamond stones do feel as though they have lost their 'bite' once you have broken them in, although it doesn't feel as though they are doing anything anymore, they will still cut just as much. It's a bit like driving a big wallowy American car with cruise control, automatic gearbox and power steering. You still get from A to B but aside from the change in location the whole experience has been devoid of any kind of sensory stimulation or feeling of control. I find the same thing with air hardening steels, so sharpening air hardening steel on a well broken in diamond stone you may as well be wearing gloves and a blindfold.

Hopefully Gaz will be able to help you out with the adjuster, if not give me a call and I'll try and get hold of one for you.

 

[Cheshirechappie]

Hi Endgrain - welcome to the forum!

The Ashley Isles chisels are superb, but they are really intended for cabinetmaking work (the very fine grinding on the sides, leaving a minimal land on the bevel edge, makes them excellent for cleaning dovetails). They pare beautifully. If you do any really delicate work, they make a 1/16" dovetail chisel, which is a real star.

For heavier chopping, how about some registered firmers (the double-hooped handle ones), or the older style socket chisels? Both are available new (at a price!) but also crop up quite regularly on Ebay. Allowing for postage, you can get some top quality pre-WW2 Sheffield chisels for about a tenner or less each.

For planes, much the same. Lie-Nielsen, Clifton and Veritas are most unlikely to disappoint, but the investment is not inconsiderable. A watch kept on Ebay for a fortnight or so should secure a good pre-war (rosewood handled) Stanley or Record for about £30 or less if you're lucky.

Alternatively, try the secondhand dealers - Alf's website (The Cornish Workshop) has a list of good dealers. They'll be a bit pricier than Ebay, but at least you can return goods for a refund if not satisfied.

 

[endgrain]

Cheers for the Pm Gaz I cant send you a reply at the moment must be because I'm a new member I put a bid in anyway.

Thanks for the replies guys,

@Matt I know the stones lose there bite but these had big bald spots. I was wandering if they have improved over the years as mine must of been 10 years old. Shame about the 4 1/2 I all ways loved that size.

@ Cheshirechappie I have taken a look at the Reg firmers and they look far to heavy for me I need a all rounder tbh think i will give the AI ago and if I need to do some heavy chopping I will have to use my old Marples.

Now I have been looking at the Diamond stones and come across this Trend Classic Pro stone fine/coarse 8" x 3" inch double sided which is 300 grit one side 1000 grit the other plus its guaranteed for 5 years anyone used one before will the the 1000 grit be fine enough to get a good edge?

 

[GazPal]

Trend's diamond plates have gotten a few good write-up's recently. Although I can't speak of Trend's diamond plates from experience, I can vouch for Eze Lap diamond plates (8"x3" Course, medium, fine and extra fine) and - potentially more recent - DMT diamond plates (Course, medium. fine and extra fine combination plates), as I've put quite a lot of trouble free mileage in on them in the past and currently float between either brand depending on my mood.

 

[Fromey]

We do have some new goodies from Quangsheng on the way, but unfortunately a 4-1/2 isn't among them this time.

Do tell!

 

[endgrain]

Cheers for the help,

I have sourced the 077a parts cheers Gaz and have ordered the AI chisels and the trend stone, just need to order a DMT ex ex fine stone and a few planes from WH but will wait till next weeks wages clear.

 

[Benchwayze]

Why would you want to 'belt' a chisel? Even a mortice chisel, (which generally receives the most 'mallet' work) doesn't need to be 'belted', so long as it's sharpened properly. The same goes for any other kind of chisel. Firmers and bevel edged chisels aren't used with a mallet all that often, (At least mine aren't.) and when they are, the tasks are such that lusty 'belting' is unnecessary, and normally undesirable.

I think it's safe to assume any decent chisel will withstand sensible use with a mallet; esp. Isles et al. Just make sure you DON'T use a hammer. Not even on plastic handles!

HTH

 

[Jacob]

Why would you want to 'belt' a chisel? Even a mortice chisel, (which generally receives the most 'mallet' work) doesn't need to be 'belted', so long as it's sharpened properly......

The whole point of the heavy OBM mortice chisel design is to permit it to be belted as hard and fast as you can with the biggest mallet you can handle. This is in order to get the job done quickly - which is the answer to "why would you want to 'belt' a chisel?" .
Doing it myself today in fact - bashing a 3/4" chisel with a 30 oz hammer (I couldn't find my lump hammer) to cut out a bit of wood which I couldn't get at with a saw or anything else. The chisel was an Axminster cheapy and it survived quite well and kept an edge.

Firmers and bevel edged chisels aren't used with a mallet all that often,

Really? What do you hit them with - your forehead?

 

[Benchwayze]

:roll: You do it your way Owdman; I'll do it my way.

The only chisels in my shop with split handles are the ones I picked up from eBay. I don't make Lock-Gates and other such large jobs, so I don't need to belt chisels unmercifully.

I don't care how a mortice chisel is designed. I've still seen enough of them with split handles. But as I said. Not the ones owned by me since new. I won't say you're talking rubbish Jacob. I'll just let you go on your own sweet way. And if your forehead is solid enough to use on a chisel, you carry on. I'll just use a mallet when necessary, but with just enough force to get the job done. In my normal work I don't ever see any need to belt a chisel to within an inch of its life. If I am having that much trouble to remove waste, there are other methods.

Mallets come in varying weights btw, so you can let the weight of the mallet do the work. Or didn't they teach you that at school? It helps of course if your chisels are sharp. Perhaps now you see the cons of the 'rounded bevel'!

On yer bike Jacob. :mrgreen:

 

[Jacob]

Been bashing a chisel recently - one of those Axminster cheapies with a 2 tone plastic handle and a metal button. If you hit the button with a wooden mallet it eventually spoils the face of the mallet. If you hit it with a hammer it spoils the button and it starts breaking up.
Just thought I'd mention it. They are crap chisels anyway, thought the steel is fine, they take and hold an edge etc.
Perhaps I need a nylon faced mallet wotsitcalled.

 

[endgrain]

I have all ways hit my marples chisels with a claw hammer and they have never split or chipped and I hit the chisel hard to speed things up the harder you hit them the less times you have to swing the hammer, I cant spend all day taking small pairings of.

 

[Roughcut]

Im probably showing myself up but............I tend to use a rubber headed mallet to strike the chisel.
I've got a Beech mallet but it never gets used as I find it too light.
I don't use a claw hammer for fear of damaging the chisel handle.
But I find the rubber mallet has enough weight behind it to do the job without having to swing it about like Captain Caveman.

 

[GazPal]

Been bashing a chisel recently - one of those Axminster cheapies with a 2 tone plastic handle and a metal button. If you hit the button with a wooden mallet it eventually spoils the face of the mallet. If you hit it with a hammer it spoils the button and it starts breaking up.
Just thought I'd mention it. They are rubbish chisels anyway, thought the steel is fine, they take and hold an edge etc.
Perhaps I need a nylon faced mallet wotsitcalled.

Ye olde worlde Thor hammer may be what you need to use on those metal button hafted chisels and if they were good enough for Thor, then .......... :wink:

I think knocky and hitty thingies need to be down to personal choice and what the user is comfortable with. House bashing (1st & 2nd Fix) tends mostly toward striking the chisel using the flat side of the hammer head, as it's easier to carry a well balanced claw hammer in your belt than a mallet and it can tend to be a bit off putting if a mallet head splits part way through a shift while you're an hour or so from spare kit at home. Traditonal joiner's boxes can only carry so much kit, unless you're van based.