External T&G Door

[Quadie]

This month (if the monsoon season passes) I will be recladding a small extension at the back of the house. It will be done in Western Red Cedar shiplap and I want to make a new door to match. I have looked through all the archives here and couldn't quite find the answer to my question so I was wondering if anyone could help.

The attached pic shows roughly what I want to achieve. All pretty straight forward with the panels being nailed to the rebate and mullion (the rest of the extension will be nailed the same way so this will match).

What I can't get my head around is how you ensure it is water tight. This is a tried and tested approach to door design - with a tweak here and there - but surely water can come in around the sides of the panels where they sit in the rebate?

Q1: Am I missing something obvious here? Should I use silicone in between the panels and where they meet the rebate or is there another method? The door gets more than it's fair share of direct wind and rain so I need to make sure I do this properly.

Q2: Also, I was considering making the frame from laminating three layers of matching cedar (the company that supplies the cladding do normal boards 19mm thick) I think it will work ok but it would be good to hear from the experts.

Thanks in advance,

Keith.

 

[Quadie]

Come on guys. 107 views and no one is weighing in. You'll only have yourself to blame when this door leaks and I'm getting it from SWIMBO! :wink:

 

[MattRoberts]

Hi, shiplap boards are water tight by nature of the overlapping boards, so assuming they're not immersed in water you should be good!

 

[Quadie]

Cheers, Matt.

Although it's the outer edges of the boards I'm worried about, where they sit in the rebate. Could water work it's way in around the side without sealing it in some way?

 

[Jacob]

......
What I can't get my head around is how you ensure it is water tight. This is a tried and tested approach to door design

Is it? Can't say I've ever seen a door with ship-lap panel set in.
You won't get it water tight; the target is to make it shed water with no water traps. The obvious solution is to cover the whole door in ship lap and not set it in, which is pointless and problematic.
PS or put the ship lap into slots like a normal panel door. You'd have to think about the detail on the bottom rail.

...
Q2: Also, I was considering making the frame from laminating three layers of matching cedar (the company that supplies the cladding do normal boards 19mm thick) I think it will work ok but it would be good to hear from the experts.....

Sounds unnecessarily difficult. I'd just plant the ship-lap on to a redwood frame.
If you really want a board door I'd forget ship lap and do vertical T&G - tongued into top rail and stiles but covering middle and bottom rails.

 

[Quadie]

The reason for the shiplap is so that it matches the cladding and I can buy it without having to size it myself, tbh. From what you're saying, if I still want to use the matching cladding for the T&G I'd be best re-thinking my door design.

I like the look of the door but I've probably based it on a commercially available door that may be constructed in a way that I can't achieve. Oh well, might have to go back to the drawing board on this one.

Cheers,

K.

 

[MattRoberts]

How wide is the rebate? The issues with water tend to be much more vertical than horizontal due to gravity, so it's more important to control vertical leakage (which the shiplap does) than worry about water coming around the side of the edges. That said, a bit of sealant in the rebate before fitting wouldn't do any harm!

The only problem area might be at the bottom of the last board - you may want to include a sill / sweep.

I must confess that I'm no door expert though - other guys on here are much more knowledgeable than me on the subject!

 

[Quadie]

Or maybe allow the boards to go all the way to the bottom of the door instead of rebated into the bottom rail? I was worried that the sealant would restrict movement but if there was only a small amount used...

Worth a thought.

 

[Beau]

Really like the look of your drawing. Cant see why it should be any less watertight than any other T&G door. Made T&G doors for our place with it running vertically and had no water creep in around the rebates. You could but a spline in down the sides set back behind the lap should add I have never tried this. One problem we do get is due to T&G being relatively thin it gets cold on the inside and we get a lot of condensation on the inside which has caused a lot of mould. We do live in a very soggy part of the world though. For the bottom just put an angle of say 15 degrees on the bottom board and reciprocating one on the rebate of the bottom rail.

 

[MattRoberts]

Or maybe allow the boards to go all the way to the bottom of the door instead of rebated into the bottom rail? I was worried that the sealant would restrict movement but if there was only a small amount used...

Worth a thought.

Yes, that would be good. With regards to movement, the sealant is quite flexible, so should be able to handle it. Even if the sealant breaks, it will still sit there as a bead.

You could also knock up a quick prototype and test!

 

[No skills]

Maybe use a solid exterior rated fire door and do all the cladding as a plant on affair. You could then try and design the plant on timber to drain off water.

 

[Quadie]

Thanks for the help everyone. I'll be modifying the design I think but a quick prototype could be in order. I'll let you know how I get on.

K.

 

[Bradshaw Joinery]

I would make a Ply Core and double board it. Pin the shiplap to the ply. the back of shiplap viewed from the inside isnt going to be overly pleasant?