Exprience making five-bar gates anyone?

[Benchwayze]

Hi Folks,

I've been asked to make a six-foot wide, five-bar gate for a friend's patio. Whilst he wants it smaller than a genuine gate, he does want a 'proper-job'.

Because metrication is ‘scant’ compared to imperial, I want to use 75mm square timber for the stiles, and 75mm x 25mm for top and bottom rails; using a filler piece for the straps/bands. For the three horizontal bars I thought of using 50mmx 25 mm. Does this sound about right please?

I don't have a problem with which joints to use, other than am I correct to use wedged, through mortices for both the frame and the bars, or would I use blind mortices for the bars?

From memory of gates I’ve seen, the diagonal braces are usually fitted to either side of the bars, to form an X and are bolted to each bar. (Customer wants only one diagonal brace so the remaining problem is how is the brace fitted to the stiles? Or should I just whack in a length of galvanised conduit, with a good thread at each end and make it an adjustable brace.

Any thoughts please?
My thanks in anticipation.

Regards
John

 

[Steve Maskery]

Hi John
The diagonals of a 5BG work in the opposite way to the bracing of a ledged and braced door. In the latter the brace props up the top ledge, stopping it from drooping, whilst on a 5BG the diagonal allows the bottom rail to hang from the stile.

So your diagonal should be bolted from the top end of the hinged stile down to the leading edge of the gate. The triangulation gives you a very robust structure.

I can't help you with the dimensions, I've only ever made one and it was a very long time ago, but my advice would be to get your hardware before you start buying wood.

Cheers
Steve

 

[PAC1]

The 5BG also has a beefy top rail mine have 100 x 75 tapering down to 75x 75 so that everything can hang of the top rail.

 

[Benchwayze]

Thanks Steve and PAC,

So I would better to have the rails and stiles of a uniform thickness..
In which case I can see how it works.

Many thanks fellas. I am off to Screwfix for the bits and bobs!

Have a good weekend.
Regards
John

 

[Steve Maskery]

It was a long time ago, but I'm pretty sure that my rails and stile were NOT the same thickness.

The brace is housed (lapped) into the stiles and bolted to the rails on the way.. In that way you can have stiles that are nominally 3" and rails that are nominally 1", with a nominally 1" brace and it will all work fine.

The brace is housed into the stiles and bolted onto the surface of the rails, IIRC.

S

 

[Benchwayze]

Cheers Steve.

That was originally how I envisaged the set-up. My main concern was fitting the straps. If the rails were thinner than than the hanging-stile there would need to be a small filler-piece along the rails, next to the hanging-stile, to take the ironmongery.

Regards

John

 

[Steve Maskery]

Which is why you need to get your ironmongery first and make your stiles to suit.
S

 

[mailee]

Well Johen I have made two five bar gates well sort of...They were actually four bar and in a ranch style. I am not sure about the metric but mine were 4x2 for the stiles and 1.5 x 6 for the rails. A 4x2 diagonal brace was half lapped into the the lot which gives the gate much more support. Not to everyones taste but it lloked the part and worked well. first one I made lasted over eight years! not bad for softwood. :wink:

 

[Benchwayze]

Aye Steve,

As it happens I have a pair of galvanised straps under my bench already! So all I need is a bag of nuts'n-bolts and som Cascamite... Or whatever they call it now!

Thanks again Steve. I am obliged.
John

 

[OPJ]

I used to work for a company (not long ago) where I was endlessly making five-bar gates...

The top (head) rails were finished at 85x72mm with stopped mortice and tenons either end. The advantage to this is that it's less work for your mortiser and the end-grain of the tenons aren't permanently exposed to the elements. We then added large dowels to secure the joint. Gluing would help as well but, we never had the time...! :roll:

The hanging end was 120x72mm, I really don't think 3"x3" will be enough, tough it will do for the closing end.

Rails were finished at 24mm thick (which denotes the 72mm thickness of the frames where braces from either side overlap the rail). Wherever rails and braces overlap we would add a coach bolt.

If you're gonna use softwood then it would also pay to have the timber treated after the machining but before you assemble the gate together.

Hope this helps.

 

[Benchwayze]

Thanks for that OPJ.

I could always draw-bore the tenons I suppose, or even use gloss-paint as a glue, as used in the 1920's!
Thanks gents for the feedback. Much appeciated.
John

 

[CWatters]

On the 12 foot gate we have the stiles and top rail are the same thickness but the other rails and brace are thinner.

For stuff like this I use google images for ideas..

http://images.google.co.uk/images?hl=en ... a=N&tab=wi

These look nice..

 

[gatesmr2]

Not sure if this will help but i am also looking at making some farm style gates for myself.
I have seen farmers round my way use what i assume is a caravan jockey wheel to make the gate easier to move as well as giving support. Ok this is on the aluminium style but i thought it was a good idea and was looking at ways to use this as well as hide it in the construction.

Being an amateur probably a daft idea

Martin

 

[Benchwayze]

I wouldn't say it's daft! A wheel makes the gate easier to swing and it takes some of the weight off the hangings too! Whether it's necessary is another matter. In the case of the one I am making, it won't be necessary. Thanks folks for the feedback. It's appreciated

Regards
John