anyone run their own design and manuf furniture co.

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navypaul

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I am thinking about starting a small furniture co. designing and making my own range as an online business i have the outline of a business plan and many original designs (used to design for a company up north years ago, went to college and all that) the thing i have made seen to be well received so i am trying to give it ago

has anyone gone down the same route, im looking for some advice and potential pitfalls

regards

paul
 
I'm a full time, independent furniture maker. Not much I can say though without knowing a bit more about your plans, feel free to PM me if you'd prefer.

Good luck!
 
There have beeen several similar threads in the same vein in the past month have a little search

the general message i got was that it was possible to make a small fortune in this business \:D/



But only if you started with a large fortune :roll:
 
Sounds interesting. Thats my ultimate goal as well.
I know another recent thread was full of doom and gloom about making a good living from furniture making, but I believe it is possible.
Either as you say selling good design online, or being lucky enough to have a workshop/gallery/shop where you can work and still have the possibilty of customers walking through the door. Rather than working by yourself in a cold damp agricultural rural slum like most furniture makers seem to..
 
Not wanting to put a dampener on proceedings, but I have gotten the impression that to make a fortune out of anything furniture related is nigh on impossible unless you have a large workforce and serious automation. A quick search on Made.com makes for depressing viewing, unless you have an army of employees paid < £10/hr and cnc machines churning out components OR outsource your manufacturing to Eastern Europe.

There are some cracking pieces on there for £300 which would take most skilled people 3-4 days to manufacture with general workshop machinery.
 
flanajb":33veadhs said:
Not wanting to put a dampener on proceedings, but I have gotten the impression that to make a fortune out of anything furniture related is nigh on impossible unless you have a large workforce and serious automation. A quick search on Made.com makes for depressing viewing, unless you have an army of employees paid < £10/hr and cnc machines churning out components OR outsource your manufacturing to Eastern Europe.

There are some cracking pieces on there for £300 which would take most skilled people 3-4 days to manufacture with general workshop machinery.


out sourcing is a popular way to do it but then your looking at high volume, i understand what your saying there are many retailers selling dung furniture poorly made like most of the high street shops and that rubbish from OFW but i dont need to sell much to at least equal my income now. i know there is a market for good design higher end furniture as i used to buy it before i started to make it, so it is there. im not aiming my products as the oak furniture world £200 a table and 4 chair market but the people who want status type furniture well thought out and well made.
 
davin":3gylxyeu said:
Sounds interesting. Thats my ultimate goal as well.
I know another recent thread was full of doom and gloom about making a good living from furniture making, but I believe it is possible.
Either as you say selling good design online, or being lucky enough to have a workshop/gallery/shop where you can work and still have the possibilty of customers walking through the door. Rather than working by yourself in a cold damp agricultural rural slum like most furniture makers seem to..

thats the plan i have a range already designed, well most of it and intend to use social media to advertise i have very few overheads at the moment and a income from my current job so im in a good place unless things pick up then it gets complicated but that's in the future
 
It's interesting every time this comes up, I think many have the aspiration but not necessary all the skills (business and manufacturing and design).
I think most of the guys on here that sound like they're preaching doom are actually just trying to give people some sage advice and more importantly a reality check about what they're getting into.
If you can start a business part time then it's low risk so no real worry if it doesn't work out but some recently have said they were thinking of giving up well paid jobs to start out in furniture, obviously this is very risky so people try to warn them of the difficulties they will face.
It's a lovely dream though and life's too short not to pursue your dreams.... Good luck
 
I don't think you want to be selling just furniture as mentioned there is lots of good functional furniture out there going for peanuts. You need to make art that works as furniture then money seems immaterial to those that want it. This is coming from someone who was a good maker but bad designer and never made any money after 15+ years of furniture making.
 
Beau":1idu0uw3 said:
I don't think you want to be selling just furniture as mentioned there is lots of good functional furniture out there going for peanuts. You need to make art that works as furniture then money seems immaterial to those that want it. This is coming from someone who was a good maker but bad designer and never made any money after 15+ years of furniture making.

yeah thats the thing utility furniture is everywhere and very cheap no way could i or anyone compete with that but you said it exactly it has to be almost art, utility art if you like.
 
Hi paul, i've been making bespoke furniture for a living for 26 years now, the advice i would give myself if starting again would be to make a range of items and just stick to them, produce a small catalogue, sell on line.
Then you have cutting lists, jigs for those items and know what timber is used.
Problem their is getting the items from A to B without damage.
Like Beau never made any money out of it, just keeping my head above water, so best of luck.
Their are people on here who will dish out some good advice !
 
I have commented on business aspects before so will not repeat here. No 1 issue is finding customers. No 2 is them being happy with your lead times as you will not be holding stock I expect. No 3 is delivery and returns risk. If you have the drive and good designs and excellent on-line marketing skills you will make it. The internet is a big place and getting your stuff seen by the right people is a challenge. But you will never know unless you try. Good luck with your venture.
 
running a small business from home is quite feasible so long as it is not intended to be your sole source of income.

I have run several small businesses from, just myself and my partner at home to a business employing 27 staff full time with workshops, offices etc .
The one thing that I would say is that if a business is to be the sole source of income ,you will inevitably run into cash flow crisis from time to time when you'll find that the banks won't want to help you and creditors are pressing you and some of your clients haven't paid you for work and something expensive breaks down and a supplier goes bust , and your deadline for supply is looming etc etc .
Try not to invest too much in expensive equipment straight off and keep a reasonable contingency fund for emergences. Cashflow is any businesses life blood

As you are retaining your full time employment as your main source of funding then I would say go for it :D I'd recommend you do a simple projection of your annual expenses overheads and maybe consult an accountant before you start. Working from home you will be able to claim as much as a 1/4 of your household expenses for the business and a percentage of your car etc
 
thanks for the advice sawdust1, that was my plan from the start produce a range and sell it, in a nutshell. Thankfully my overheads are nearly zero and i am counting on low sales believe it or not.

the net is a huge place and is a minefield so getting it out there is a massive challenge, social media is my plan eg YouTube videos (haha, video, showing my age) showing construction of the item and FB to somehow market it its all there to be used just need to find the people who know how.

i was umming and ahhhing for ages and a friend of me and my wife said when you doing it then? i said doing what? she said setting the business up i ummed a bit more then she said you will never forgive yourself if you dont at least try. so i have little choice but to give it my best shot and learn quickly how. im in the forces and we are always thrown in the deep end so it should be second nature. time will tell

thanks
 
Beau":3an8n73r said:
I don't think you want to be selling just furniture as mentioned there is lots of good functional furniture out there going for peanuts. You need to make art that works as furniture then money seems immaterial to those that want it. This is coming from someone who was a good maker but bad designer and never made any money after 15+ years of furniture making.

You raise a very interesting point.

For most of the 20th century the majority of independent furniture makers, no matter what particular style they worked in, followed the Arts & Crafts ideal of making functional furniture that was intended for real homes or real workplaces. It rarely worked out that way, as bespoke furniture was just too expensive for anyone but the wealthiest few percent. But sometime during the late 1980's and early 1990's something remarkable happened in both the US and the UK, a few audacious makers began to position their furniture as either artworks or as future antiques, so not for the top 1% but instead for the top 0.1% or 0.01%, and previously unimagined prices began to be achieved. Suddenly the target market for bespoke furniture was no longer well-off but still middle class lawyers and company directors, it was now super rich hedge fund managers and museums.

Many people have identified John Makepeace's "Millennium Chair" as a turning point in the UK (despite its name I think the first of these chairs was actually made in the late 1980's). This article from 1993 gives a flavour of the impact that this movement, often called Studio Furniture, was having,

http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-enter ... 62748.html

A generation of furniture makers in the UK and US looked at these six figure prices and concluded (not unreasonably!) that instead of walking a perilous financial tightrope they'd get themselves an agent, produce just one or two astonishing pieces a year, and cash in on this new bonanza.

It also heralded a desperate scramble to raise skill levels in order to make pieces which were at the very cutting edge of what could be achieved. This is a bit of sidetrack but it's an important one. To make good quality rectilinear furniture isn't all that difficult. Maybe something of the order of 1,000-1,200 hours of training will normally get someone to the level where they can make most furniture that's primarily composed of straight lines and right angles (think Shaker style furniture for example), a dedicated hobbyist could reasonably aspire to this standard. To become a fully rounded "cabinet maker", i.e. able to make veneered, curved, laminated, shaped, and compound angled work such as jointed chairs or a Carlton House Desk, is a level above this, and probably requires 10,000-12,000 hours, so in effect not much different to a traditional apprenticeship. But the astronomical prices for "Studio Furniture" required the maker to raise their game to a third level, where they were making pieces that involved genuinely new and highly demanding techniques like free form lamination. So there was a migration to the workshops of Makepeace, Barnsley, Osgood, and Krenov where designer makers thought (rightly or wrongly) they could equip themselves with the masterpiece skills to break into this new super priced market. It's also no co-incidence that in the UK the Guild Mark took on a new significance, as makers hoped that by winning a Guild Mark they could join this elite club and attract the attention of museums and collectors.

But here's the thing. When the 2007/8 crash happened the Studio Furniture market was one of its first victims, commissions evaporated overnight. And, when I talk to people who were or are genuine players in this category, I'm told sales have been very, very slow to come back. Even though six figure prices are still occasionally being realised today, it does seem they are now very much fewer than they were. Maybe this business will bounce back, who knows, however as of today it seems it was a brief twenty year aberration that's been and gone. But that hasn't prevented a small group of extremely talented makers doggedly pursuing this particular dream. Good luck to them, even if the super high priced market isn't there, they're pushing the boundaries of what's possible in furniture making and as far as I'm concerned that's a wonderful thing in itself!
 
I would love to make some of what i call arty farty furniture but my client base consists of mainly retired folk who have a more conservative taste so what i make is of a traditional nature. Its what they ask for, its what i make, it pays the bills.
Although furniture has been my main income, these days its on the back burner and my income now is from other wood related
businesses, been their done it and found it to much of a struggle.
Thats why i'm happy to give advice to any beginner.
Anyone starting out now has the best tool available to them now and thats the internet, it wasn't around in my day !
Paul i see you are at Yeovil i,m your side of Honition, coffee and a chat if you want.
 
sawdust1":1uqff0nh said:
I would love to make some of what i call arty farty furniture but my client base consists of mainly retired folk who have a more conservative taste so what i make is of a traditional nature. Its what they ask for, its what i make, it pays the bills.
Although furniture has been my main income, these days its on the back burner and my income now is from other wood related
businesses, been their done it and found it to much of a struggle.
Thats why i'm happy to give advice to any beginner.
Anyone starting out now has the best tool available to them now and thats the internet, it wasn't around in my day !
Paul i see you are at Yeovil i,m your side of Honition, coffee and a chat if you want.


yes mate ill do that thanks
 
For what it's worth, I think the only way of being able to make a living is to potentially offer fitted furniture. Built in cupboards under the stairs or alcoves ...

I have a friend who makes very contemporary furniture which he then sells each year at Dorset Arts Week. One thing he makes is floor standing lamps. He will knock these out as and when he is a little quiet or has time on his hands. His main business though is fitted furniture and cupboards. You need to find a niche that you can fill, where it is not cost effective or the volume is not there for a large player to enter the same market.

Good luck with what you decide.
 
I have to say this area of woodworking was the basis of my business plan 15 years ago when I finished my apprenticeship and set up my first machine shop, and have made many attempts at it since!!

The fact I have found over the years is it really is more of a dream/hobby than a sustainable business. When I took the company in the direction of more mainstream joinery (kitchens/ doors/ built in furniture ect) I always thought that if it grew and made me my fortune that I could then enter into that field of woodworking with the security of the amount of money required.
My main company now covers 3 warehouses and 2 yards to give an idea of size and I would swap it to be a private 'MAKER' in a small studio workshop any day!! The market in my opinion is just not there nor strong and sustainable enough.

Through my main company we do get to work on the odd small high end piece of furniture now and then and the profit is substantial to say the least (just finished a console table for a customer at a cost of just over 11k, it probably cost around a thousand pound to produce including labour and took around 16hrs total start to finish) We only got it as that was the customers budget for it and we had made their kitchen, study and library last year. They said they only asked us if we would make it as they couldn't find any one that could but felt it was too small a job for us!!
With 10 thousand pound profit for 2 days work and a customer that thinks we done them a favour why wouldn't we all want to be in that market place!! DO we have another job like that lined up?? NO!

You may think you would only need 10 jobs like that a year for a healthy living, but the fact we got it was ONLY because of the main company.

A lad that left me 5 years ago went off to become a private 'MAKER' he lost 70k of his parents money in the first year!! So he started making pine tables ect and selling them on online, he turns a little over a million pound a year and takes a salary of around 150k. Not bad for a 28 year old. His tables sell for between £450 - £650 but they are churning all day and ship them all over Europe. He was a good joiner and had a fantastic business head on him and a lot of drive. Moral is that he could have made it easily as a maker if the market was there, but it wasn't!! so he went the opposite and started to make his fortune out of a hand made low end product to the masses!

My advise is to follow the main stream market and excel where the competitors fail. Maybe then you will be lucky and fall into the "MAKERS" market!! I LIVE IN HOPE!!!!!!!!!!
 
Like others who have posted I would agree that a main business should be to fulfill a known established need - fitted furniture or builders joinery are the two best examples. That's what I do. Now and then I get to design and make something nice, but only now and then. And even then it's still mostly fairly run of the mill. For example, a current client wants a long (1.6m) low (520mm) 4 drawer shoe chest from solid Oak. Not exactly exciting but at least there won't be any Spax pointy devils in it. And I get to get my planes and chisels out and feel like I'm a maker. But I've still got to go for it - two days max excluding finishing or I'll be working for minimum wage.

Ho Hum.
 
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