Thinking of a Festool C12 - am I mad?

[cambournepete]

Two years ago in a thread far away...

Anyway I bought a the Bosch 12v (1.3Ah batteries) pro drill for £80 from Axminster and am very happy with it. It's not much more powerful than my 9.6v Metabo, but much faster for drilling and doesn't have a broken gearbox (which may be me overloading it).

Now I'm not so chuffed. The Metabo is still going strong (but slowly), and the Bosch still works but the batteries don't seem to hold their charge for as long as they should and I noticed when using it recently that the drill bit was rotating smoothly (and yes it's straight).
I need to drill some pilot holes in the top of some kitchen cupboards so have looked at angle drills but the obvious one to get is the Ryobi One+ but that feels cheap and nasty (IMHO) and still costs £120.

So, now I've got a little cash, I'm considering getting the Festool C12 and have persuaded SWMBO that she'd like to pay the extra so she buys me the big box of bits from Axminster for my birthday. I fancy getting the offset and right-angle attachments.
Would I be happier buying the Metabo PowerMaxx?
Anybody here got or tried the C12 and can make sensible comment on it?
Am I going completely mad thinking of spending this much on a drill? :shock: :?

 

[LyNx]

Personally i think that is way tooooooo much to pay for a drill. You can get alot more drill for your money, even 4 drills for that price.

Andy

 

[gidon]

Am I going completely mad thinking of spending this much on a drill? :shock: :?

IMO - yes . It doesn't look like it's that compact either.

Cheers

Gidon

 

[houtslager]

:shock: gawd that is a lot

I have the DW 12v right angle drill, [same as the old ELU but yellow]
for 6-7 years and it is a 2 speed forward and reverse drill, imho a bloody good one.I am sure you'd be better off with this, and SAVEE some cash for other things :wink:

HS sweating in front of a pc doing the accounts

 

[Alf]

Aye carumba! That's on offer?! :shock: How small are the pilot holes, Pete? A hand drill/egg beater/wheel brace can get into corners better than most electric drills I've ever seen, or if one-handed operation is wanted then a push drill/handyman Yankee with the drill bit is more efficient than you'd believe. I know, advocating hand tool use is a running joke, but I'm serious - sometimes throwing more money at the problem isn't actually the solution.

Cheers, Alf

P.S What does one do with 42 torque settings? :-k

 

[Neil]

Yep, even as a Festool fan IMO that is way too much :shock:

How about this package deal as an alternative? You'll have to copy & paste as this won't work with the url tag.
http://www.axminster.co.uk/name/202131/ ... (Body-Only)-459510.htm
I have the 14.4v version of the drill/driver and it is very nice. And I'm sure the £300 you'll save could be put to good use buying some other goodies... :wink:

Cheers,
Neil

 

[Paul Chapman]

Unless you are going to do lots of drilling in confined spaces, you can buy very effective right-angle attachments that will fit any drill for less than £20.

But like Alf, I find the humble hand drill (and you can buy compact versions if the standard type isn't short enough) unbeatable 8)

Paul

 

[Alf]

But like Alf, I find the humble hand drill (and you can buy compact versions if the standard type isn't short enough) unbeatable 8) l

Gosh, yes. I have a itty bitty one I barely use, but when I need it...

'Course I'm not suggesting you buy a new one, you understand. That's a mug's game; "pre-owned" beat new for both price and quality every time in hand drills.

Cheers, Alf

 

[RogerS]

Like Houtslager I have the DW and completely agree with him...it's the bees knees.

That Festool...does it take normal bits or do you have to purchase fancy bits (which will cost you an arm and a leg in the long/short term ...let alone not being able to buy one at the weekend when you've just bust the last drill bit....

 

[Scrit]

That's more than three times the price of a 12volt Makita :shock: and the Makita is smaller and lighter than the DW 12volt so it will fit into tighter spaces. Third-party right angle drives are available for "generic drills",so what's so special about the Festool. And yes, I'd like one, but no way could I ever justify it

Scrit

 

[Noel]

Am I going completely mad thinking of spending this much on a drill? :shock: :?

Yes.

Cure = Pansonic / Makita

 

[SimonA]

I think I have to agree with the rest of the gang here.....Thats is a lot of money, but having said that if I was going to pruchase a new drill I'd probably be looking at one of these:

http://www.axminster.co.uk/recno/12/pro ... 377707.htm

Which at £250 isn't a kick in the butt from the Festool. Having said all that if you want a Festool then get one......I would, its going to work just like all the others...and you'll be happy.

SimonA

 

[Dan Clark]

I have the C12 drill with the chuck kit (right angle plus eccentric chucks). It is very expensive, but worth it IMO. It is extremely well built, has more torque than any 12V drill I've used, and has lot's of great features.

For comparison, I have a DeWalt 18V drill. The Dewalt has lots of torque, but it's not that controllable when compared to the C12's torque. Also, it is MUCH larger and heavier, and the chuck is not removable.

Right now, I'm sistering the joists in my house to fix a sag and flex problem. The Dewalt won't fit between the joists. That's a major problem with lots of drills. They are fine if you have it out in the open with lot's of room. Get it into confined spaces and you are in trouble.

On this "sistering" project, I'm attaching 2" X 12" wood and Microllam joists to the current joists. I'm using 3" by 5/16" lag screws using a Torx bit. For an 18 foot joist, that's about 70 screws screwed into about 3 to 3.25 inches of wood with no predrilling.

One C12 battery lasts for about one joist worth of screws (70). That doesn't sound like much until you realize that Microllam and old joists are very tough to screw into and the screws are huge, so that I have to hold the drill tightly with both hands because the torque.

One of the things that sold me was the chuck system on the C12. What is not obvious from the literature is that the chucks quick disconnect. I.e., you can change chucks (not just bits) in about 2-3 seconds. And, some of the chucks can be combined. E.g., you can combine the Centrotec (little green one) or Fastfix straight chuck (big black one) with the right angle chuck.

On my sistering project, I had to use the right-angle and eccentric chuck to get around pipes, wires, ductwork and other obstacles. And in a few cases, I needed to use either the Centro-tec chuck or Fastfix straight chuck with the right-angle chuck. This is easy and straight-forward with the C12 chuck system.

Or as another example, I had to make 27 braces to temporarily hold up the new joists. That meant:
1) combining three pieces of pre-cut wood using four screws, and
2) predrilling through the first two pieces,
3) while keeping all of them aligned using a clamp, and then
4) screwing in the screws half way.

This would have been a major hassle with my Dewalt because I would have had to switch from drill bit to screw bit over and over. With my C12, I just installed a #25 Torx bit in the Centrotec chuck and a 1/8" drill bit in the Fastfix straight chuck and then switched chucks in mid stream.

After about the 10th brace, switching chucks took less than 2 seconds. The whole task for 27 braces took less than 40 minutes to complete.

I think there is a place for 18V and large drills when massive torque is needed. The new Makita 18V Lithium Ion drill would at the top of my list for that task. However, for most woodworking tasks, the Festool C12 is a better choice.

Good luck with your decision.

Regards,

Dan.

 

[Jake]

I'd buy a decent drill, and a decent impact driver that share the same batteries for little more dosh (or about the same if you get a bare body of one of them and have fewer batteries).

Drill/drivers are pish compared to impact drivers for screw driving. And drilling isn't a task that demands huge sophistication or expense from a tool.

 

[Scrit]

Also, it is MUCH larger and heavier, and the chuck is not removable.

18 volt tools are just too big and heavy for many cabinetmaking/light joinery tasks, I'd agree. Try screwing plasterboard ceilings up with one and you'll really know about it.

One of the things that sold me was the chuck system on the C12. What is not obvious from the literature is that the chucks quick disconnect. I.e., you can change chucks (not just bits) in about 2-3 seconds. And, some of the chucks can be combined. E.g., you can combine the Centrotec (little green one) or Fastfix straight chuck (big black one) with the right angle chuck.

There are other systems around which can do this, such as the Makita flip drill, but the damning thing for me is that I'd rather have two or three drills on a job than one - that way if one fails or is dropped/damaged I have a back-up (of sorts). And picking up another drill is quicker than changing, even with a fast changeover. Having multiple drills allows one to carry three different sizes of drill, say a mini-Bosch or Metabo to get into tight spaces, a conventional 9.6 or 12volt drill/driver for general work and a girt great 18 volter for those Conan the Barbarian moments

You appear to have found a pecular situation where the C12 works better, but for that I'd probably just pull-out my Sioux angle drill which will get into even tighter spaces then the C12, albeit on the end of a cord. DW and Makita both do cordless angle drills as well.

I think that we are back to saying that there is no such thing as a one size fits all solution. Perhaps the original poster should list his drill requirements under two columns: "must have" and "nice to have" and see what he comes out with. :lol:

Scrit

 

[bg]

You know you want one, you know its barmy, and you just knew what the forum would say about this didn’t you. But your going to get one…you know you are. Just how long are you in the workshop before you need to drill something. And it’s a real pleasure to use. It fits just so in the hand and using the centronic chucks is just so good. And you need all those extra drill goodies. You will surely use them all ..some day. I’ve a bunch of old drill, some have dedicated bits all ready for use. Do I use them. No I prefer to use the Festool and change the drill bit. And I’ve already wrecked one of my posidrive drill bits so lucky the drill kit give you 10 of each size. Mad of course you are. (Festool kindly put by another of those festool sun specs by for me, my wife nicked the ones you gave me and I’ve done my bit to help another festool loony down the road don’t you think)

 

[CYC]

bg, hahahahahha, suits you sir, hooo, suits you

 

[johnelliott]

I recently bought a Makita kit from Isaac Lord, it consisted of a 12v drill driver, a 12v angle drill and a 12 impact driver, each with a battery and there was a charger. I think the whole lot cost about £160 plus vat.
Apart from my Metabo Powermaxx 4.8v screwdriver/mini drill, it's all I need on site for kitchen fitting. The impact driver has to be tried to be believed, I can't think of any screwdriving task in a kitchen that it couldn't handle

Having said that, if you can afford the Festool and the other bits and pieces, then that's what I think you should have. It's difficult with most tools of the trade (or even hobby items) to afford the very best (e.g.think about cameras) but Festool have made it possible to buy tools that are the best and that are worth it

John

 

[Matt1245]

The impact driver has to be tried to be believed, I can't think of any screwdriving task in a kitchen that it couldn't handle

We drive in M12 x 4" coach screws in the shop when demonstrating them, just holding the drill with finger and thumb. They don't twist your wrist at all. You wanna try taking your wheel nuts off your car with them as well :lol:

Impact drivers are they way to go IMO, especially with people like trend doing a whole range of bits (snappy) in 1/4" hex fitting.

Matt.

 

[Mike B]

May be a little late on this one, but if you do decide to go "mad", may I suggest that you try to find a C12 in the flesh first.

The reason is that in my opinion the C12 is kind of weird to hold and when I picked one up it instantly became a definite no no. It is really small and light but the trigger is just too long for my (tiny!) hands - I ended up with about 3 fingers on the trigger!! For me it would be a TDK without a doubt.

FWIW I know where you are coming from - the offset chuck is a great idea looks sooooooo useful!! But then there are no Li-ion batteries and there is no doubt that 2 drills or a drill and impact driver would be more useful than 1...

Does anyone know whether standard bits fit the additional chucks?? I seem to recall reading somewhere that you need Festool ones with an indent for the ball bearing holder mechanism else they will fall out as the chucks are not magnetic...

Cheers
Mike