The Thing in the Garage

[Richard T]

erm.. yerss.. for once it's a relief to have a little one.
Anyway, here's the thing that the thing goes through with the thing that goes through it, through it.

Yes! It's half a G cramp with holes drilled in it.
The side plates need to have another plate fixed on to them so as the rivet heads don't interfere with the vertical sliding; I think I will use pretty brass sheet for that.
The hooked piece is about to get two holes drilled through it to take different dog tools - straight spike for bigger, lumpy, bark-still-on stuff and gentler, more padded feet for stock I don't want to put spike holes in.
Also I will draw out the back end of the bar into a thin tang to put a wooden handle on.

 

[bodgermatic]

This is really interesting, thanks for sharing.

 

[DavidE]

Hi Richard,

Cool! - I'll be interested to see this develop. One day I fancy trying to make a WoodMizer style one where the saw moves rather than the log. I figured that was easier than trying to make a setup to move the log. This thread could change my mind though... all those Stenner heads are tempting!

Keep posting!
Cheers
David

 

[Richard T]

Thanks folks, it's very good to have interested people to share this with as I go along. It helps to sort it out in my own head too.

David, I pondered for ages on which would be the best system for me and although I've heard good things about the woodmiser, it looks like the frame takes up a lot of room, and I don't think you can get much of a deep cut? It's been a while since I looked into them.
I think the best sort of saw for specifically planking up big rough timber is the bandsaw mill - the saw being horizontal and traveling on rails along the length of the static log. I think that this is also the cheapest for the biggest results.
Hopefully what I am doing is going to turn out the most versatile - I should be able to cut lengths up to 7' 6" at a depth of up to 13" and also very short, thin and light pieces. But the most important thing for me is being able to use the bandsaw just like a normal bandsaw without having to dismantle anything or add anything on. I can have a table on the throat side of the blade, and a table that fills one of the areas between two of the beds on the carriage. So the knees can all be wound back and the carriage parked with the table section on the other side of the blade for curves and cross cutting.
Sounds good huh? (Ghodd, I hope it works.)

 

[DavidE]

Hi Richard,

Err yes I've only ever seen pictures of the WoodMizers so I'm not really sure about their abilities.

I was looking the other week and have seen some designs on this site.
I fancy making something like this - it probably wouldn't be on a trailer though!
http://www.diybandmill.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=18&Itemid=1

There are some interesting videos on YouTube too.. this one shows how simple they can be - it seems pretty effective too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ub6_pACrWYw

I think your solution sounds a good way as you get the versatility and waste less space. I'll be interested how you arrange the carriage for the log. Like many things I don't have enough time and I only got really interested as I was trying to plank some sycamore on my bandsaw (reasonably successfully) and though there must be a better way!

Cheers
David

 

[Richard T]

I'm afraid that my design will waste space compared to a band mill - the biggest advantage of the band mill (apart from not having to lift the log much) is that the length of cut is as long as the rails are.
When the log passes the saw, it can only be half the length of the rails. And with my set up this will be 7' 6".
I can't think I've had much call for timber longer than that myself, except for timber frame beams which I have axe hewn or chainsawn or both.
But a potential customer may want floor boards or banister rails or something awkwardly long like that I suppose, but I've been reassuring myself with the thought that I will have the ulimate bandsaw fence with a dead flat piece parked in the carriage, and I could pass any length through it - not anything like as easily, but still possible.
Looking at the utube vid you posted above, I see that everything that I am making is present there, just in different places: there are two-way movable dogs, rails with wheels and guide wheels, a geared lowering and raising system, it's all there. So the build cost and difficulty would be about the same. That's good to realise as I had assumed that the moving saw way would be simpler too.
I suppose it's length v versatility.
The band mill is a sawmill and a very efficiant one. Mine is just a glorified jig really, but it is still a decent sawmill as well as being a bandsaw. (He says hopefully, not having finished it yet....)
More photos when the photographer gets back from her mother's.

 

[DavidE]

Hi Richard,

Err yes I guess everything is always a compromise (without unlimited space and/or budget!)! I'm looking forward to seeing how this progresses though as I might change my mind on approaches. As you say the beauty of the rails is the fact you can always make it longer if needs be.

Cheers
David

 

[animatedpomegranate]

I'm the lucky winner of the vb42 above. Its going to be a huge project but hopefully I can bring it back to life. Before I decided to go the route of the stenner I was seriously looking at building a horizontal bandsaw like a woodmizer. In my research I found the website www.diybandmill.com if you haven't seen it before and are interested in these sorts of things do take a look. The guys (mostly in America) are really helpful and the machines they have made are fantastic.

I'll post some reports of my progress with this saw as it comes along, in the mean time I have to calm down because I can hardly believe I won it!

 

[jlawrence]

oh to have enough space to try something like this and enough to build a kiln as well

 

[animatedpomegranate]

something tells me some of it will get into the kitchen for restoration during the cold winter nights. Seriously though I am very lucky to have a little bit of ground. I first saw one of these things working twenty odd years ago and always dreamed but never really thought it would happen. over the years I have seen these things working on some really small plots of land.....never give up hope. 6 days ago I didn't even know I'd be bidding for this and was convinced the homemade mill was the only option. Lady luck does smile sometimes

 

[Richard T]

I am now the proud owner of a set of rack and pinion gears. I need another three sets, but bought the first one on its own just in case the dimensions were unworkable and I had to change it, but it will fit fine.
It's 40mm x 40mm rack with 9mm deep teeth.

This will give me about 20" travel winding on to the saw which should be plenty.
I've also drawn out the tang for the handle on the back of the first dog.

But haven't shaped or riveted the handle on yet as I won't be able to take it apart once it's riveted on.

And here's the possition it will (sort of ) eventually be in.

You just have to imagine it is sitting in its ladder rack which I haven't started on yet.

 

[Richard T]

animatedpomegranat - how are you getting on with your new purchase? Do you need to dig a pit for that bottom wheel? How did you get it to your house? ( did you yet?) What size blade? where from? Are you going to keep it under cover? What's the track like, how are the bearings, how are you going to power it? ;Etc...
I would love to see the progress of this - how about a thread of its own?

 

[animatedpomegranate]

hi. Still organising the delivery which will hopefully be sometime this week. I'm not sure how to do the thread thing but will look into it. I have been in touch with some woodworking magazines. They are very keen to follow progress and we are talking about the possibility of an article over the coming year. I'll let you know in due course.

As to your other questions. The saw has a 25hp 3ph motor. Although I have 3phase the wire run may be a bit on the long side from our distribution point, but i'm looking into it. I'm leaning more towards a perkins 4236 engine or the possibility of a tractor pto.

The site it is going into is an existing lean to barn which will have to have some alteration. At the moment I'm still running through the options. It does have to have pit for the bottom pulley the wheels being 42" in diameter. The saw takes a 23' blade 4 or 5" wide. Every bearing seems ok but there is renovation work to do and also safety regs to adapt.

I'm so excited about and will keep you all informed.

 

[woodsworth]

wouldn't it be easier to build a platform as big as the longest pieces you want to cut and then build a horizontal band-saw that will run along runners?

something like this

but a little beefier.


I've seen people make the band saws out of car tyres powered by petrol motor.

 

[wobblycogs]

I think the basic idea of the project is to be able to use the existing upright bandsaw in the shop to do the cutting to save space (I hope that's the idea anyway ). I suspect a track based bandsaw would be easier to build but that would mean two bandsaws and track storage etc. I'll be interested to see how this project turns out.

 

[Richard T]

It would be easier to build a horizontal bandsaw and I could cut twice the length of wood but I didn't fancy getting everything sqaure and straight each time with those fiddly things between the rails.
Also I wanted to be able to use the bandsaw as normal too - curves and cross cutting.

Things are finally moving at a pace now that Christmas, sprained ankle, snow etc are out of the way.
By far the most amount of time on this project has been taken up by trying to save up enough extra money for the next bit - first the gears then the steel.
My engineering buddy has lots of bits to be getting on with and I have two 15' rails to mount on a long frame and a carriage to build.
There's not much worth photographing yet, but as soon as there is I'll post some.

 

[Calpol]

I'm loving this thread Rich T (sorry about that :roll, I've got a thing for old machinery. I'll need to post up some of my old circular saw when I remember... It's belt driven (off a thresher) which we pulled out the barn to make a useable sized space. The blade is about 2' diameter and the entire thing is made of rust but I still love it

Somebody stopped by once to see if they could melt it down :shock:

 

[Richard T]

Good Grief it's been a long time - I've been getting milling, welding and general engineering done as I have been able to afford it and now I'm nearly there.
All the four beds are nearly finished; the gears are in place and all the slidy parts have been machined smooth.
I've cut the two lengths of wood for the body of the carriage - that's two pieces of white pine 3"x 6" x 6'9"
Got the rails cut to length - 15'
Now what's left are the steel wheels - 3 flat and 3 grooved to run on the angle rail and the main shaft - drawn, bright, round bar and to get it and all the pinion gears key-wayed.
The last thing is the advancing mechanism or setworks.
I've decided to go with the traditional method which looks like this:

It's the bit with the ratchet around the bar like a huge revesable ratchet wrench. I'm not exactly sure how I'm going to do this as noone seems to make big ratchet wheels anymore, so I might have an awful lot of bench work to do.
I should have photos of the beds and knees by the weekend.

 

[Eric The Viking]

Good Grief it's been a long time - I've been getting milling, welding and general engineering done as I have been able to afford it and now I'm nearly there.
All the four beds are nearly finished; the gears are in place and all the slidy parts have been machined smooth.
I've cut the two lengths of wood for the body of the carriage - that's two pieces of white pine 3"x 6" x 6'9"
Got the rails cut to length - 15'
Now what's left are the steel wheels - 3 flat and 3 grooved to run on the angle rail and the main shaft - drawn, bright, round bar and to get it and all the pinion gears key-wayed.
The last thing is the advancing mechanism or setworks.
I've decided to go with the traditional method which looks like this:

It's the bit with the ratchet around the bar like a huge revesable ratchet wrench. I'm not exactly sure how I'm going to do this as noone seems to make big ratchet wheels anymore, so I might have an awful lot of bench work to do.
I should have photos of the beds and knees by the weekend.

This is possibly very silly question, as I can see why "Yes!" is a safe answer: do you need an actual ratchet?

I was wondering about a small disc brake, either from a push bike, or, possibly better, from a kart (go-cart). IIRC, both types use bowden cables and have a lot of grip. Admittedly you couldn't then use it to index for precise thicknesses, but it would lend itself to being ganged-up easily (either one for the shaft or one for each pinion). It might collect sawdust though.

I may have misunderstood where you need it though, and a disc brake may be too expensive anyway.

 

[Richard T]

Dear Eric,
I'm not sure I entirely understand the question - I had thought about disk brakes - I freely admit it; but when it comes to thinking about how to translate that to what I need compared to a ratchet and pawl. the later seems much more likley viz:

A modern setworks, albeit with complicated reversing stuff involved ....
I just want to wind on and wind out again with the relevant old fashioned noises.