Stanley #151 spokeshave knurled screw?

[sploo]

In a "doh" moment, I've won an eBay auction for a Stanley #151 spokeshave... and only just noticed that it appears to be missing the knurled screw that fits into the hole at the top of the triangular shaped Lever Cap. I.e. the hole at the top on this item: http://www.stanleytoolparts.com/12-151-2-05-b-24.html

I can get a spare parts kit (http://www.uktoolcentre.co.uk/Shop/p~26 ... GwodA2EDXQ) but that's a decent percentage of the whole tool, and I'd be paying for bits I don't need.

Does anyone know the thread size and type of this screw?

 

[lurker]

Buy one of these and use the bits

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Sourcingmap-a12 ... poke+shave

I think they will fit but at the price is no risk

 

[AndyT]

I've been and measured mine - a 1980s vintage, made in Sheffield - and it's a shade under 3/16" diameter with 28 tpi.
I think that means it's one of those effectively non-standard Stanley specials, so your simplest and cheapest option is probably to enlarge the whole a tad and tap it to M5.

 

[Cheshirechappie]

Just measured my Record A151, which is of similar vintage to Andy's. The two adjuster screw posts are 0.212" x 28tpi, but the 'cap-iron' screw is 3/16" x 24tpi which is 3/16" Whitworth.

That may be completely irrelevant for a Stanley product, but I just mentioned it to flag up that you can't necessarily assume all threads on a given tool are the same. It also flags up that buying a donor tool with unknown threads may not necessarily yield the parts needed.

 

[AndyT]

Yes, what CC said is all true. I have a Record as well as a Stanley, and looking at the two side by side, the screws are definitely not interchangeable.

I then remembered that I happen to have two older 151 spokeshaves, one Record and one Stanley, both probably early C20th. The old cap iron screw on the Stanley was the same size as the 1980s one. Similarly, the old Record cap iron screw would fit the newer Record spokeshave.

So based on this very small sample, if you find a screw from a spokeshave older than yours, but from the same maker, it will probably fit.

If it's from another maker, it's a lucky dip.

 

[rxh]

Let me know if you fail to find one. I intend to make a screw for a Record 151 soon and I could do one for your Stanley at the same time.

 

[sploo]

Buy one of these and use the bits

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Sourcingmap-a12 ... poke+shave

I think they will fit but at the price is no risk

I was going to say that the price was obscene(ly low) and that I guess it's probably exactly the same thing (i.e. same factory) as the new Stanley 151. However, it indicates it's a 44mm blade, rather than the 54mm in the 151. Might be a typo I guess, but as you say - at that price it's worth buying just to see what turns up. Thanks for the link.

I've been and measured mine - a 1980s vintage, made in Sheffield - and it's a shade under 3/16" diameter with 28 tpi.
I think that means it's one of those effectively non-standard Stanley specials, so your simplest and cheapest option is probably to enlarge the whole a tad and tap it to M5.

Thanks. I was thinking I could just tap and try to find something appropriate. Problem is that I don't own a bottom tap (is it a blind hole, or is it drilled all the way through)?

Let me know if you fail to find one. I intend to make a screw for a Record 151 soon and I could do one for your Stanley at the same time.

That would be hugely appreciated. It occurred to me that someone with a metal lathe and/or a suitable die cutter could probably knock out a replacement part pretty quickly. Sadly I don't have one, or know someone that does.

 

[lurker]

Well I guess it will have metric threads but they will be close to the original sizes so like Andy says you will have to run a metric tap through them

I've bought several of these just for parts, the blades have been surprisingly decent, I use the bare blade for hand scraping crud off recycled wood

 

[rxh]

My spokeshaves have the following threads in this position:
- Record A151: 3/16" x 24 TPI (i.e. 3/16" BSW),
- Record A151R: 5 mm x 0.8 mm pitch (this is comparatively recent),
- Stanley 64: 3/16" x 28 TPI (which agrees with AndyT's 151, as mentioned above).

I have made a screw for my Record A151. I also one that fits my Stanley 64 and you are welcome to have this screw FOC - please PM me your address if interested.

 

[matt_southward]

Well Sploo I for one would heartily recommend taking the screw from Richard, his work is excellent! On a slight side note: my Record 151 has a habit of the blade slipping somewhat when the blade positioning screw is tightened. I've traced that to the profile of the underside of the screw being an odd curve. I'd decided to try filing it but wondered if you chaps could tell me what the originals should look like?

 

[AndyT]

Matt, all four are nicely rounded over at the tip. It's what I expected, and allows even pressure when the screw is not at right angles to the surface of the blade it bears against.

If you find the iron slipping against the bed, try a rub with some rosin - it's only a quid or two from any music shop - and it's a good remedy for unwanted metal to metal movement.

(Tip courtesy of Alf, one of the many things I've learned on this forum over the years.)

 

[ED65]

Matt, standard advice for this kind of pressure screw is for a domed or rounded end but I don't recall any further detail being given. What this means in practice is that it should be an even curvature, how curved doesn't matter. The only important detail is the apex of the curve needs to be centred on the axis of the screw.

The tip above about using rosin for the back of the cap is a good one but I believe a wipe of shellac or sanding sealer will do the same job if you already have either one of those. This is essentially the same technique as using hairspray for any socket chisels that have handles with a tendency to pop free.

 

[sploo]

My spokeshaves have the following threads in this position:
- Record A151: 3/16" x 24 TPI (i.e. 3/16" BSW),
- Record A151R: 5 mm x 0.8 mm pitch (this is comparatively recent),
- Stanley 64: 3/16" x 28 TPI (which agrees with AndyT's 151, as mentioned above).

I have made a screw for my Record A151. I also one that fits my Stanley 64 and you are welcome to have this screw FOC - please PM me your address if interested.

Very nice looking work, and many thanks for the offer! I'll send a PM shortly.

Well Sploo I for one would heartily recommend taking the screw from Richard, his work is excellent! On a slight side note: my Record 151 has a habit of the blade slipping somewhat when the blade positioning screw is tightened. I've traced that to the profile of the underside of the screw being an odd curve. I'd decided to try filing it but wondered if you chaps could tell me what the originals should look like?

Yea, the photos I've seen show a soft point (or steep dome) on the end of the screw.

 

[matt_southward]

Apologies, I did intend to reply before now, but with work and Christmas prep the time just flew!
Thanks for your feedback, it's very useful. I admit that I hadn't really thought about the mechanics of the spokeshave cutter until now, but after your comments I had a closer look yesterday and can now see the sense of the design and I'm glad I didn't wade in with a file. The rosin/hairspray tips are good ones!

 

[sploo]

Richard's (rxh) screw arrived this morning. Really nice little item (a good chunky knurled section), and massively better than the modern version.

I don't have any "before" shots of the spokeshave (it was pretty rusty/gunky) but a good clean and a coat of wax has resulted in this:

I noticed that the blade has the SW in a heart (sweetheart) logo. Once sharpened it'll shave through the edge of a piece of paper better than any chisel I own. Maybe I just lucked out with the sharpening today. Maybe it's a good blade.

Anyway, with the right screw to put pressure on the blade in the right area it cuts beautifully, so many thanks to Richard for helping another old tool back to life!

 

[ED65]

Looks great sploo! Nice one to Richard, that was very generous of you.

Once sharpened it'll shave through the edge of a piece of paper better than any chisel I own. Maybe I just lucked out with the sharpening today. Maybe it's a good blade.

Might be down to a shallower honing angle.

You can't tell steel quality by cutting action directly. For example you can get a stamped stainless knife to be just as sharp as a hammer-welded knife in carbon steel that costs £££. The difference shows up in durability, not in outright sharpness.

 

[sploo]

Looks great sploo! Nice one to Richard, that was very generous of you.

Once sharpened it'll shave through the edge of a piece of paper better than any chisel I own. Maybe I just lucked out with the sharpening today. Maybe it's a good blade.

Might be down to a shallower honing angle.

You can't tell steel quality by cutting action directly. For example you can get a stamped stainless knife to be just as sharp as a hammer-welded knife in carbon steel that costs £££. The difference shows up in durability, not in outright sharpness.

Thanks.

No idea why it's so sharp. It needed some grinding work, and I initially thought I'd made a mess of it (but the angle is the same as my other tools). I made a holder for the blade as per one of Paul Sellers' articles and that made sharpening the bevel much easier. It's a really nice tool to use.

As an FYI, before Richard made his generous offer, I'd hit the button on this http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/391340467856? ... 26_rdc%3D1 (search "BRAND NEW STANLEY CAP 17669 & THUMB SCREW 36671 FOR 51 + 151 SPOKESHAVE" if the link no longer works).

It (eventually) arrived today and the good news is that the screw also fits my cap. The red cap is pretty lousy in terms of casting and painting quality, but it means I've got some spare bits. The screw isn't a patch on Richards, but would be perfectly acceptable for those situations where a kindly forum member isn't there to help you out :wink:

 

[sploo]

Buy one of these and use the bits

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Sourcingmap-a12 ... poke+shave

I think they will fit but at the price is no risk

I did order one of these (well before Xmas) and it turned up this morning. Initial impressions weren't good (anyone for a "Sopke shave"):

At this point I suspected it might be less Jade eagle and more Pyrite sparrow.

On taking it out of the box things didn't improve much. The blade adjustment nuts are clearly coated in something to make them look a little like brass (they have that fake look like the foil around a chocolate coin). The cap is just a bent sheet rather than a casting.

But, believe it or not - it cut straight out of the box. The grind was at 25 degrees, but must have been done with something so rough it's created lines on the bevel that result in wood looking like it's received the attentions of a Zen garden rake. But it did cut.

I just had enough time to quickly sharpen the blade and chuck it back together, and... it's really not that awful.

The sole is coated in the same black paint as the rest of the shave, and that means it leaves streaks on the wood, so that needs grinding off, and I haven't checked the flatness of the area where the blade sits, or flattened the edge of the cap.

Here it is in comparison with the #151:

The red cap top left is from this cheap model, and the red cap far left is a replacement cast one from a modern #151. You can see this cheap one is quite a bit smaller than the #151.

TBH for £3 I don't think this is a bad purchase. Once sharpened it's working reasonably well. It might be useful if/when the #151 is too large. At least based on 5 minutes use this evening I'd reach for it if I were in the middle of a job and the #151 blade needed sharpening.

Ironically, the one thing I forgot to do... was check to see if the cap screw fits the #151!

 

[DTR]

"Sopke shave"

(hammer) (hammer) (hammer) :lol: :lol: