Sedgwick CP single phase - what plug?

[Helvetica]

Hi lads, I just received my beautiful old planer thicknesser, but there is no plug. I was under he impression that single phase meant I could just plug in into a wall socket with a 13a 3 pin plug, but it arrived with thick 3 core cable with no plug attached, and a circular blue 'alto' socket that I have nothing to connect to. Could anyone advise me on how to power this machine? I'm afraid to just wire a 3 pin plug in case I put too much pressure on the motor. Thanks

 

[SteveF]

quite a few larger single phase require 16 amps at startup
13 amp will no cut it so you need to fit that blue plug that you have
and a 16 amp socket in your ring (assuming that your circuit is up to it)
you may need to put it on its own motor rated RCD curcuit if it keeps tripping

Steve

 

[memzey]

A word of warning: my Sedgwick MB draws 96 amps on startup! Yours will no doubt draw considerably more as the larger head will have more inertia that needs to be broken. A regular circuit (or even 16amp) will struggle. I had a 32 am circuit installed with an MCB capable of taking the load. Not cheap by the way.

 

[Helvetica]

Could I remove the fuse from a regular 13 amp socket and replace the live pin and fuse holder entirely and with the neutral pin from another 3 pin plug? I believe it is no different than the blue plug which also has no fuse (rated 16a but actually relies on the circuit breaker)

 

[deema]

You will need a 32A socket which is wired to its own dedicated 32A class C MCB. You will need at least 6mm cable, and this will need verifying depending on the cable length. Class C trips slightly later when it sees an overload than a class B which is found in doemstic consumer units. You need class C as the motor at start up has an 'in rush' current much higher than it's normal running current for a very small period of time. The plug you have is rated at 32A reading the label.

You may be able to get away with a 16A system and suffer the odd trip especially when it's cold.

http://www.discount-electrical.co.uk/pr ... e-32a-230v

Nice machine, I have one too.

 

[n0legs]

Could I remove the fuse from a regular 13 amp socket and replace the live pin and fuse holder entirely and with the neutral pin from another 3 pin plug? I believe it is no different than the blue plug which also has no fuse (rated 16a but actually relies on the circuit breaker)

NO. Do not do this ever and don't get cutting down a 1/4" bolt to fit a plug either.

Find the rating plate, see what load it has and do it properly. You will need, as the others have said, a dedicated circuit. Might be a 20 amp radial with a 16 amp socket or it might be a 32 amp with a suitable socket.
It's your property and the choice is yours, but you might end up sorry if you don't do it right.
A 16 amp socket should not be installed on a domestic ring main circuit. There are ways to do it safely, but they might contravene the regs.

EDIT.
Apologies everyone, it was only on reading Steve's post below I realised I had written something incorrect. Rushing to dinner
"Might be a 20 amp radial with a 16 amp socket" This is the incorrect bit.
I should have wrote a 2.5mm radial with a 16 amp socket. This would obviously be protected by a 16 amp MCB/RCBO.
I'm sorry for any confusion.

 

[SteveF]

A 16 amp socket should not be installed on a domestic ring main circuit. There are ways to do it safely, but they might contravene the regs


I was not aware of this an apologies for suggesting to OP

is it ok to have a 13 amp and 16 amp socket on a radial rated 20amps, if only one is used at a time?
or is the rule not to mix sockets?

Steve

 

[memzey]

You will need a 32A socket which is wired to its own dedicated 32A class C MCB. You will need at least 6mm cable, and this will need verifying depending on the cable length. Class C trips slightly later when it sees an overload than a class B which is found in doemstic consumer units. You need class C as the motor at start up has an 'in rush' current much higher than it's normal running current for a very small period of time. The plug you have is rated at 32A reading the label.

You may be able to get away with a 16A system and suffer the odd trip especially when it's cold.

http://www.discount-electrical.co.uk/pr ... e-32a-230v

Nice machine, I have one too.

Deema has more or less described my setup. I got a sparky to do mine and certify it so my home insurance is still valid.

 

[Wildman]

Could I remove the fuse from a regular 13 amp socket and replace the live pin and fuse holder entirely and with the neutral pin from another 3 pin plug? I believe it is no different than the blue plug which also has no fuse (rated 16a but actually relies on the circuit breaker)

you will fry the rest of the wiring in the circuit if you do that. A 32 amp circuit is needed even a 16 amp will struggle. Just a thought that needs checking but isn't an electric cooker feed 32 amp? you will certainly need a separate supply and will need to be part p certified.

 

[n0legs]

is it ok to have a 13 amp and 16 amp socket on a radial rated 20amps, if only one is used at a time?
or is the rule not to mix sockets?

Steve

Sorry Steve I may have added to the confusion with my original post. I have amended it now.

In answer. No. The idea of used one at a time, even though in a single occupancy environment it would be possible to police, is not a position I would put myself in. I have however seen this done and apparently it passed inspection.
The issue even though both sockets are adequately protected is that both could be used at the same time. At the very minimum under overload condition the protection device activates causing both sockets to go off. Worse case could be a faulted circuit breaker not seeing the overload and allowing the cable to reach an overloaded state.
Some will tell you MCBs etc do not fail, they do. Point in fact Volex, and others, during 2009-10 IIRC had a major recall of faulty breakers.
Machinery with higher loading characteristics should be given dedicated supplies of their own. If it's plugged in to it's own circuit constantly, a circuit specifically designed for it's purpose and thus correctly protected, will operate properly and most important of all safely.

 

[deema]

A socket is going to be c£12, the MCB will be another £15 (most consumer units will have a spare location for an extra MCB, if not it was poorly specified.....IMO, the cable is about £1 / meter. You need a sparky to certify or sign off on an installation before uts powered up. It shouldn't break the bank to do it properly. The only additional thing I would add is a 32A isolator. That adds an extra c£13 and with the additional of a little padlock can avoid little fingers getting curious with buttons. It's always good practice to isolate the machine before fiddling with the knives.

http://www.discount-electrical.co.uk/pr ... -15kw-415v

 

[chris-a]

It's funny I had one of those Sedgwicks with the 2 button startup...from what I could tell because it used two separate starters for in-feed rollers and the cutter block itself it didn't have such a large start up spike that it blew fuses..it certainly never tripped in my workshop with a normal circuit, it also had a 13amp plug spliced onto it.
My table saw on the other hand needed a type c breaker and socket etc because with an adaptor it spiked.

Also if you go to a wholesalers for things like MCB you can pick them up way cheaper than £15, mine was about £3

 

[Helvetica]

Just wanted to respond and say thanks for the clear advise. Got my spark to install a 40a type C MCB, 6mm cable and a dedicated wall socket. 70 quid all in and the machine is running happily with dust extractor, lights, bandsaw running consecutively. The lights dim a bit alright!