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New to woodturning - advice on dust extraction

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Croyboy

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Hi
I am just getting started on woodturning - have partitioned off about half of my 'standard 1 car size' garage for my lathe etc . Can anyone advise a good dust extraction set up that would be appropriate for me?
Any advice gratefully accepted.
 

tomosap

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Would say you can't go far wrong with one of the Axminster craft series dust extractors (the ones with the big bag on the top half). They have 100mm hoses so that along with a big mouth dust hood (also at Axminster) will be ideal to run next to your lathe to suck up all the chips and dust.
 

Croyboy

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Thanks
Would I also need to invest in any kind of face respirator as well?
 

Inspector

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At least a 2hp cartridge filtered DC with 6" duct and hose to the machine (shortest run you can make) with a bell mouth hood to grab the fine dust (better than a big mouth). And wear a good mask too unless you add very good ventilation to exhaust the air outside.
Reasons.
You want to move 1000 cubic feet per minute (cfm) of airflow to capture and remove fine dust and the flow claims in the sales specs are almost double what they actually flow.
4" duct can only flow a maximum of 425 cfm. Where 6" flows a 1000 cfm. A 4" pipe on a bigger machine will still only flow 400 cfm.
There will be fine dust you can't see that is not good to breathe thus the mask. The big stuff landing on the floor isn't the problem.

If you really want to understand read Bill Pentz's web page.
Others will disagree and that's fine but you decide what is good for your lungs.

Pete
 

Croyboy

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Thanks Pete
I don't understand everything on your post but I will start to investigate what you have said.
Really appreciate you taking time out to help.
 

Spence

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You need a respirator, especially for sanding. Some wood is worse than others, Yew is particularly bad for your lungs so get one that seals up well. The finer the dust the more the problem.
 

Inspector

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Croyboy":1uepwqwr said:
Thanks Pete
I don't understand everything on your post but I will start to investigate what you have said.
Really appreciate you taking time out to help.
If you tell me what you don't understand I'll explain it in more detail.

Pete
 

Yosarian

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Inspector":1h9xivx7 said:
You want to move 1000 cubic feet per minute (cfm) of airflow to capture and remove fine dust
Bill Pentz recommends airflows of 1000CFM for "effective fine dust collection at our larger and dustier tools". To understand what this machinery may be, his site also contains a table with different CFM requirements for various tools. For saws with blades up to 16" diameter, this is between 790 and 988 CFM depending on the standard, which I guess is where the 1000 CFM figure is from. I think this is related to overcoming the dust particle velocity created by the tool, which presumably is related to the velocity which the teeth on the saw blade are moving.

This table doesn't seem to differentiate between table saws with dust collection built in both above and below the table, and mitre saws without.

My table saw blade is only 8.5" diameter. Does this mean the teeth are travelling at ~half the speed as a 16" diameter bladed machine? I haven't seen any figures for CFM requirements for smaller machines. I wonder how they vary. I have a 2HP extractor connected via a 100mm flexible hose, and my dust meter does not detect much increase in PM1.0, 2.5 or 10 levels when using it (that doesn't stop me wearing a powered respirator).

Sometimes, I get the impression Bill Pentz stacks lots of unfavourable variables together, ending up with a conservative (but therefore safe) conclusion. Does anyone have any views on this?

Sent from my SM-N950F using Tapatalk
 

TFrench

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Personally for turning I wear a powered respirator - its good face protection and protects from sanding dust. All I use with mine is a microclene fine dust filter. That collects the dangerous stuff, anything else is big enough to sweep up at the end of a session!
 

Woody2Shoes

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I use these: https://www.axminster.co.uk/3m-aura-932 ... tor-501428
under one of these: https://www.axminster.co.uk/axminster-f ... sor-500080
I also have one of these in the background: https://www.axminster.co.uk/jet-afs-500 ... tem-310483

I've found that turning/sanding is usually something that generates a lot of mess/dust and I've not found one of these: https://www.axminster.co.uk/axminster-w ... ood-508480
attached to one of these: https://www.axminster.co.uk/axminster-t ... tor-508334
particularly effective - so I end up using using a broom and a dustpan.
 

Deadeye

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Yosarian":1a7amtuf said:
Inspector":1a7amtuf said:
You want to move 1000 cubic feet per minute (cfm) of airflow to capture and remove fine dust
Bill Pentz recommends airflows of 1000CFM for "effective fine dust collection at our larger and dustier tools". To understand what this machinery may be, his site also contains a table with different CFM requirements for various tools. For saws with blades up to 16" diameter, this is between 790 and 988 CFM depending on the standard, which I guess is where the 1000 CFM figure is from. I think this is related to overcoming the dust particle velocity created by the tool, which presumably is related to the velocity which the teeth on the saw blade are moving.

This table doesn't seem to differentiate between table saws with dust collection built in both above and below the table, and mitre saws without.

My table saw blade is only 8.5" diameter. Does this mean the teeth are travelling at ~half the speed as a 16" diameter bladed machine? I haven't seen any figures for CFM requirements for smaller machines. I wonder how they vary. I have a 2HP extractor connected via a 100mm flexible hose, and my dust meter does not detect much increase in PM1.0, 2.5 or 10 levels when using it (that doesn't stop me wearing a powered respirator).

Sometimes, I get the impression Bill Pentz stacks lots of unfavourable variables together, ending up with a conservative (but therefore safe) conclusion. Does anyone have any views on this?

Sent from my SM-N950F using Tapatalk
I agree regarding your last point.
We conflate problem 1 = keeping things clean (no chippings on the floor), problem 2 = keeping dust out of lungs now (while we're using the machine), and problem 3 = keeping dust out of lungs over time (coming back into the workshop later in the day or even next day).
And, because we conflate these things, often we seek a single solution.

Problem 1 is the most addressed and best satisfied, although machine design really doesn't help. A big sucker, a cyclone and bags and a hoover for bits that escape.
Problem 3 is less well addressed and includes all the fine particles that the hoovver lets through its bag. A very fine/electrostatic filter running over extended periods plus a reliable PM1.0 meter help.
Problem 2 is the least well addressed. Bottom line is at leats a good quality mask, and preferably a hepa-filtered positive pressure visor.

For me, investing in a good PM1.0 meter was a transformational moment. I set out to take some "for fun" readings and ended up rethinking entirely. One good approach uin summer has been to vent the post-filter air outside and pull fresh in. That's fine until I'm trying to heat the place. Plan is a filtered visor and ongoing air filtering.
 

Croyboy

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Thanks for all of the replies - complicated or what!
For myself the most important thing is my personal health - so my first purchase will be a respirator.
I have a broom and dustpan so - good to go there.
I am finding woodturning start up a lot more expensive than I first thought - the lathe is like a starter for ten.
I will keep an eye on ebay for DC kit - is there any other place anyone can recommend to look for used kit in the Midlands?
 

wallace

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I think you've made the right decision about what is more important. Make sure you get your respirator with P3 filters. I've tried every mask out their and not found one comfortable for long term use. If at all possible get a powered one. I know there expensive but the 3M versiflo is the dogs ****.
They come up on ebay used for not crazy money and are well worth the piece of mind. I think I paid £200 for mine and then bought an extra battery to rotate.
 

Jacob

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I can't easily wear face masks because of glasses steaming up. Nose seems to work OK though, if I keep my mouth shut!
I leave my big dust extractor on running with the pipe end in the vicinity, which clears the air quite quickly.
I also dust around with an old vac with pipe and nozzle which blows instead of sucking. Gets dust off all surfaces and out of boxes, drawers, nooks and crannies, what the extractor doesn't pick up ends up on the floor for sweeping up.
 

CHJ

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Jacob":5aqc51j1 said:
…..
I also dust around with an old vac with pipe and nozzle which blows instead of sucking. Gets dust off all surfaces and out of boxes, drawers, nooks and crannies, what the extractor doesn't pick up ends up on the floor for sweeping up.
I have to say that that is a practice I would never even contemplate let alone suggest to be good practice Jacob. You are re-energising already settled airborne fine dust back into the breathing environment.

In any COSHH assessment of a workplace that practice would fail at the first hurdle.
Where 'Blow-Down' is the only way to remove debris then every effort possible needs to be taken to entrain any fine particles disturbed straight into an extraction system and not distribute it over a wider area. (usually within Machine Cabinets)

A decent Vacuum Cleaner and a good tack cloth to wipe tool surfaces with should cover anything that escapes good workshop source extraction.
 

Jacob

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What I do is a quick blast around, leave dust extractor on and leave the room , closing the door behind me, for half an hour or so. Wouldn't suit a bigger workplace I agree.
 

TFrench

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Croyboy":1ebfj6ik said:
Thanks for all of the replies - complicated or what!
For myself the most important thing is my personal health - so my first purchase will be a respirator.
I have a broom and dustpan so - good to go there.
I am finding woodturning start up a lot more expensive than I first thought - the lathe is like a starter for ten.
I will keep an eye on ebay for DC kit - is there any other place anyone can recommend to look for used kit in the Midlands?
I've got a 2hp chip extractor I'll be selling soon? PM me if you're interested. Failing that just keep an eye on facebook marketplace, gumtree and ebay - stuff comes up all the time, you just have to be quick to get a bargain.
 

RickG

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Hello, I've just found this thread. I'm a novice in woodworking too.
The OP has asked about dust extraction. The advice given here seems to be about chip extraction and recommends machines with filtration to 30 microns. Is this the same thing? Surely it's the small dust that's the problem?

The route I've gone down is getting an extractor that sucks in everything and filters down to 0.5 Microns. I got the Record Power DX1000. It's a bit on the loud side. So I use hearing protection, but if you need hearing protection with the equipment you're using it's not a problem.
https://www.yandles.co.uk/record-power- ... 000w/p5064

Camvacs are probably better in that they're quieter, but more costly.
https://www.yandles.co.uk/camvac-36-lit ... gv286/p270

For collection, I have a 100mm hose going to the lathe. A job I've not got round to doing yet is installing a "Y" connection with a 50mm reducer and blast gates to connect the bandsaw.
Then for taking out the big stuff I bought a cyclone and drum off EBay to go in the 50mm pipe. This way, I'm hoping the 45Ltr bin will take some time to fill up.

I have a respirator mask, but using the DX1000 I don't find I need anything. It's only when sweeping up I find I need to take care not to breathe the dust in. Which is all good because as a beard owner masks don't always seal well round the face.
 

Yosarian

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RickG":315zjvg0 said:
The advice given here seems to be about chip extraction and recommends machines with filtration to 30 microns. Is this the same thing? Surely it's the small dust that's the problem?
Yes, absolutely. With only a coarse 30 micron filter its important to keep it outside of the working area. I keep the collection side of my chip extractor in an open sided little wooden 'shelter' attached to the outside of the workshop, with the hose going through the wall.
 
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