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Musically Beyond The Pale

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Andy Kev.

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In response to MikeG's pertinent point on the "not good at thread", I thought I'd start this one although it's real start is in that thread.

At which point does music become unlistenable/unacceptable?

Some of the best candidates are put out under the tag of "New Music". I tend to think of it as organised cat strangling. If you want to imagine what it sounds like, think of hitting a saucepan with a wire brush while kicking the strings of a piano. They even have festivals of this stuff. It's the sort of aural equivalent of Damien Hurst's works.

I'll see if I can find a link.

Here you go, try this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AVnpktJtOms

And if you can get beyond five minutes, you're doing better than me. This, by the way, must count as a relatively mild and tuneful example. You can, for instance, identify most of the instruments.
 

MikeG.

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Andy Kev.":2scapvpw said:
......Where does music be unacceptable?.......
In a public space where listening to music isn't the point of being there, such as pubs, restaurants, shops, lifts and so on. I cannot bear background music.

The other answer is everywhere in the world after 1994.
 

Andy Kev.

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MikeG.":3g0ccckz said:
Andy Kev.":3g0ccckz said:
......Where does music be unacceptable?.......
In a public space where listening to music isn't the point of being there, such as pubs, restaurants, shops, lifts and so on. I cannot bear background music.

The other answer is everywhere in the world after 1994.
I tend to agree with that. I think that e.g. cafes, jazz or light classical quietly playing in the background can be pleasant but on the whole I think that public places are best filled with the sound of human voices murmuring away in the background.

(I'll change the wording of my OP because I didn't mean physically "where" although it is an interesting point to discuss.)
 

Sheffield Tony

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Gosh what grumpy old men we have become.

What is great, and what is unbearable is all (with a few exceptuons !) personal taste. A bar without background music can be strangely uncomfortable and awkward. And I don't want light classical, or other Musak. I personally put Jazz in the unbearable category with Opera and rap. But that's only my taste.
 

Chris152

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Pierre Bourdieu - “Taste is first and foremost distaste, disgust and visceral intolerance of the taste of others.”
 

Andy Kev.

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Sheffield Tony":2utyj9wf said:
Gosh what grumpy old men we have become.

What is great, and what is unbearable is all (with a few exceptuons !) personal taste. A bar without background music can be strangely uncomfortable and awkward. And I don't want light classical, or other Musak. I personally put Jazz in the unbearable category with Opera and rap. But that's only my taste.
I think that one of the first conclusions which could probably described as philosophical which one comes to in life is that there can be little objective discussion about why one likes or dislikes a piece of music. So I agree with you. However, that doesn't rule out having a bit of harmless fun in having precisely that discussion.

Incidentally, I suspect that the good old standard distribution of the Bell Curve quite possibly applies to general approval of a piece of music. For instance, I would imagine that a large majority of people would, when in a good mood, hum along to The Blue Danube. I think that most people generally like the odd tune they can hum.

My tolerance begins to fray at the point where we are getting into Emperor's new clothes territory, where the "music" concerned is just as much a talentless bluff as is much modern art. To an extent we have, at the fringes, made a vice out of the virtue of tolerance. Ultimately it doesn't matter because if someone wants to hand over a couple of million for something made by Tracey Emin or they are prepared to cough up for a Harrison Birtwhistle CD, that is their business. It only becomes my business when some of the money I've handed over as tax becomes involved.
 

Trainee neophyte

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What is music, and why do we have a need for it? There is something in the human brain which responds to rhythm and melody, and gives an emotional response. You would think, therefore that good music ought to have rhythm and melody. Tone poems and other Avant Garde nonsense might be making intellectual statements, but they aren't "music" as such. Jazz works sometimes, but when it sounds like you threw the band down the stairs, what is the point?

However, the most apalling music in the history of the world is the stuff played by gypsies at village festivals in the mountains of Greece. It can be challenging. Here is a random example for you to "enjoy". [youtube]2a0Hllfgyxg[/youtube]
 

thetyreman

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Trainee neophyte":1t50tpsx said:
What is music, and why do we have a need for it? There is something in the human brain which responds to rhythm and melody, and gives an emotional response. You would think, therefore that good music ought to have rhythm and melody. Tone poems and other Avant Garde nonsense might be making intellectual statements, but they aren't "music" as such. Jazz works sometimes, but when it sounds like you threw the band down the stairs, what is the point?

However, the most apalling music in the history of the world is the stuff played by gypsies at village festivals in the mountains of Greece. It can be challenging. Here is a random example for you to "enjoy". [youtube]2a0Hllfgyxg[/youtube]
:lol: that sounds nasty
 

Sheffield Tony

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Hey, I quite enjoy a bit of Psarantonis myself. And Daemonia Nymphe ...

[youtube]nLuiAibzTiM[/youtube]

But they do live in London.

But really, the problem with Greek mountain music is that it continues until 4am. If you're lucky ...
 

Andy Kev.

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TN,

that mountain gypsy stuff or something very similar to it, can be heard throughout Balkans. I've never been able to make my mind up about it.

This is the kind of gypsy stuff I can listen to: the accordion player is amazing:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5VzJqtuNg3I
 

Andy Kev.

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Sheffield Tony":l5qja6wd said:
Hey, I quite enjoy a bit of Psarantonis myself. And Daemonia Nymphe ...

[youtube]nLuiAibzTiM[/youtube]

But they do live in London.

But really, the problem with Greek mountain music is that it continues until 4am. If you're lucky ...
I quite like that. There's interesting music to be discovered everywhere ...
 

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Can't decide which grates on me most, Freestyle Jazz, Bollywood music or Grime or as I call it Grimm (among other things that would have me banned from the forum). :x :evil: .
 

Trainee neophyte

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This is fun, but if you don't have a link to the awfulness, how can we believe you?

I will admit to having this on my MP3 player - sometimes I am not man enough for it, but sometimes, (in heavy traffic for one), it is perfect:

[youtube]z8ZqFlw6hYg[/youtube]
 

AJB Temple

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Back in the days when I was a student type, I was quite often employed (for extra cash) as a session musician. I could read music fluently (classically trained piano) and could play guitar and could mange a violin. Half the time we had no idea what the stuff we recorded was being used for. Some of it was definitely intended to be "musak". The guys (and a few girls) playing this stuff could do it whilst half asleep. I've always found background music pointless: if it's good enough to listen to, I will do that. Otherwise why bother - it's just noise.
 

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MikeG.":dnqm3m9a said:
Andy Kev.":dnqm3m9a said:
......Where does music be unacceptable?.......
In a public space where listening to music isn't the point of being there, such as pubs, restaurants, shops, lifts and so on. I cannot bear background music.

The other answer is everywhere in the world after 1994.
In the good old days (aka pre-lockdown) I noticed a trend of people listening to music typically on trains via loudspeaker on their phone rather than headphones ... now that is unacceptable.
 
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