Jacob
New Luddism. Awake and resist!
Personally, no.
I don't have lot of faith in arbitrary definitions and all the various "..isms"
Mortgage rates / interest etc
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I don't have lot of faith in arbitrary definitions and all the various "..isms"
Sorry - that is absolute nonsense
A company can do business in the UK and also have many transactions taking place elsewhere...
To bring this back to woodworking - I will buy from e.g. Rockler in the US - I may be a UK citizen and living in the UK and making the transaction from the UK, but the transaction is absolutely happening in the USA and under US law.
Obviously governments cannot do just what they please, as they are subject to the world environment; ably demonstrated in the UK recently...
1/However, if you look for it, you'll see that the people of countries where the range of earnings top to bottom is low, appear to be more content.
2/The variability of the human species means that there will always be some who cannot care for themselves (learning difficulties, say) and statistically there will always be roughly as many who are barely bright enough to hold down an unskilled job, as there are those at the top. The problem is there are not that many low skilled (labouring) jobs nowadays. In a humane society the many should support those who need it.
3/I wonder about wage benefit top ups. The minimum wage is not really enough to live on, so you can claim benefits. But why does the taxpayer have to subsidise the firm who is not paying their staff enough to live on? Subsidised jobs drain the economy and their public cost should be used elsewhere.
4/ We paid off our mortgage about 20 yeaars ago. The interest rate paid varied between 15% and 7% over the 25 years; around 10% was "normal".
1/However, if you look for it, you'll see that the people of countries where the range of earnings top to bottom is low, appear to be more content.
2/The variability of the human species means that there will always be some who cannot care for themselves (learning difficulties, say) and statistically there will always be roughly as many who are barely bright enough to hold down an unskilled job, as there are those at the top. The problem is there are not that many low skilled (labouring) jobs nowadays. In a humane society the many should support those who need it.
3/I wonder about wage benefit top ups. The minimum wage is not really enough to live on, so you can claim benefits. But why does the taxpayer have to subsidise the firm who is not paying their staff enough to live on? Subsidised jobs drain the economy and their public cost should be used elsewhere.
4/ We paid off our mortgage about 20 yeaars ago. The interest rate paid varied between 15% and 7% over the 25 years; around 10% was "normal".
johna.clements
Established Member
It will also be subject to UK law. If you are doing something that is contrary to a UK law you may be fined or imprisoned.Sorry - that is absolute nonsense
A company can do business in the UK and also have many transactions taking place elsewhere...
To bring this back to woodworking - I will buy from e.g. Rockler in the US - I may be a UK citizen and living in the UK and making the transaction from the UK, but the transaction is absolutely happening in the USA and under US law.
That’s not the case, it’s perfectly normal practice to actually conduct transaction in a different country whilst selling in another. When we were within the EU, if memory serves a large American company we all know and I’m sure just about everyone has used who operated online did all of its UK sales with the sales transaction in Holland the UK law didn’t not apply to them. This mitigated it’s tax liabilities.
I’m sure most will have purchase stuff of say Alibaba, a sale in the UK but not under UK law.
johna.clements
Established Member
As you state "it’s perfectly normal practice to actually conduct transaction in a different country whilst selling in another". This transaction is subject to some UK laws.
But I was referring to "If a company is doing business in the UK that that transaction is taking place in the UK". If Company A opens a restaurant in the UK selling meals for £11 it should pay the same taxes as the business next door selling meals for £12 that is owned by a UK citizen.
Again no, we are entering more complex structures. One restaurant can be a subcontractor to a ‘sales’ company. You sit down order your meal, but the order is entered to a ‘sales’ company based in Ireland. They subcontract providing the meal to the company that delivers your meal. You won’t know, but it’s perfectly legal. The providing meal company makes no profit, it’s all made in Ireland.
People make the mistake of claiming that every socialist is a command economy advocate. That the "left" want state ownership of everything, and that "has been tried, it fails" whilst ignoring countries like Norway that actually derived state wealth from their oil fields.
It always just flags the comments as either being naive, or deliberately biased, hence asking the question to highlight the (possibly deliberate) lack of understanding.
Norway is not a socialist state. Like the UK it’s government reaped large rewards from oil and gas exploration. Norway chose to invest their income primarily in the stock market and the returns on those investments used to derive benefits for its citizens. The UK government’s voted in by us: so it was our decision, was to spend the revenues. It was spent by all political parties.
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Jacob
New Luddism. Awake and resist!
Thatcher used N Sea oil revenue to run down British industry.
johna.clements
Established Member
And the UK will tax the sale in the UK.
Again, I fear you're comparing Norway to the Soviet Union.
In a pure free market system, if i want your wife's kidney, and i have enough money, essentially, i have it. Possibly not by force, but even otherwise, i can use my wealth (legally) such as her "selling" me her kidney is your only option.
Do we have countries where this happens? Maybe, but not officially.
So everything is on a scale. Its not "communist Russia" and everything else. This is *exactly* the point i was making with my "social democrat / democratic socialist" comment.
But, again, to many, possibly even including yourself, "all socialism = command economy failings = soviet gulags".
It really isn't as binary as the ever repeated "has been tried, it fails" comment.
Adam W.
A Major Clanger
I'm normally tipsy after lunch.
Terry - Somerset
Established Member
Free market economies are not completely free. The UK rightly imposes rules to avoid the exploitation of labour (minimum wage, child labour, paid holidays etc), standards governing quality safety and performance, consumer law (cooling off periods etc).
There is a debate to be had about whether these constraints are too onerous, or still leave the public and workers exposed to unreasonable or unfair outcomes.
Regulation adds cost to products and services. It makes it more difficult to compete internationally where overseas companies may be less regulated.
Simplistically, "capitalism" seems to favour low regulation to promote innovation and efficiency, "Socialism" tends to favour regulation to minimise inequity.
Companies are free to choose where to locate operations based on logistics, labour market, stability, regulation, tax etc. This will not change in the foreseeable future. The UK government has no jurisdiction in other countries.
Options:
There is a debate to be had about whether these constraints are too onerous, or still leave the public and workers exposed to unreasonable or unfair outcomes.
Regulation adds cost to products and services. It makes it more difficult to compete internationally where overseas companies may be less regulated.
Simplistically, "capitalism" seems to favour low regulation to promote innovation and efficiency, "Socialism" tends to favour regulation to minimise inequity.
Companies are free to choose where to locate operations based on logistics, labour market, stability, regulation, tax etc. This will not change in the foreseeable future. The UK government has no jurisdiction in other countries.
Options:
- compete through providing better goods and services onshore - generates jobs, some tax, investment, wealth
- stifle innovation and change by creating barriers to trade (import duties, tax etc). ultimately leads to the loss of jobs and associated taxation that regulation was intended to protect.
Jacob
New Luddism. Awake and resist!
Thought for the day:
All modern economies are largely socialist, with massive levels of tax and public spending.
There is no alternative.
The "capitalist" state, where everything is provided by free market forces, is a childish fantasy; "Trussonomics"
or the fundamentalism of the Tufton Street Taliban.The most often repeated mantra of the right is about keeping taxes low. They keep flogging this dead horse simply because they think taxation is "unfair", rather like spoilt kids with too many sweets.
Truss pulled the covers off briefly and showed it in all its silliness. She will be remembered!
Maggy has a statue in Grantham, where should Lizzy's go?
https://www.ceicdata.com/en/indicat...about UK Tax,Jun 2022, with 270 observations.Denmark 41%, Norway 35%, UK 26.5% ...
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Jameshow
Established Member
India is pretty freemarket with little state social services. It may have changed in 20 yrs since I was there...All modern economies are largely socialist, with massive levels of tax and public spending.
There is no alternative.
The "capitalist" state, where everything is provided by free market forces, is a childish fantasy; "Trussonomics"
The most often repeated mantra of the right is about keeping taxes low. They keep flogging this dead horse simply because they think taxation is "unfair", rather like spoilt kids with too many sweets.
Truss pulled the covers off briefly and showed it in all its silliness. She will be remembered!
Jacob
New Luddism. Awake and resist!
India 7.8% and desperately poor https://www.brookings.edu/blog/futu...dard-time-for-a-higher-poverty-line-in-india/Free market theorists would say that the Indian peasants should pull their fingers out and work a lot harder. Then they can buy their own clean drinking water and lavatories when they've earned enough.
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