Rknott2007
Established Member
Has anybody experienced kicked back on a table saw with a full length fence? I've always used a pull back type fence, but am considering a change to full length.
Really? Then why is it such a recurring topic of conversation on almost every US forum you read (do a search for Richard Jones and Barb Siddiqui and you'll even find a published article or two by member SgainDubh on the subject, like this one). In Europe it's not so much legislation, but TEACHING which means that almost every properly trained wood machinist automatically uses a short position rip fence as described by others. But then we've also had riving knives or splitters since before I was a lad, so kickback isn't such a topic amongst trained woodworkers here. Interesting how the USA is now bringing its' legislation in line with ours :roll:ondablade":17zxfiji said:There doesn't seem to be much concern about using a full length rip fence in the US.
I wonder what the legislation is on the subject both here and in the US...
The answer is very simple - for jobs such as trimming man-made boards to continuous width (e.g. when removing glued-on lippings), facing a few millimetres off an already sized board (including solid wood) where there is no possibility of movement to affect the cut, etc. In those sorts of jobs support is required but where there is little danger of the board opening out into a Y-shape and jamming twixt fence and blade - something you can experience in spades when breaking down hardwood boards on a long rip fence. Solid wood can be stressed, especially the more exotic hardwoods, so for ripping a short position rip fence really is a necessity - unless you want to experience kick back at some point. Fiddling around with Grippers and the like is really just a sticking plaster approach when there exists a better, safer solutionondablade":17zxfiji said:That saw [Felder] is supplied with a full length rip fence too, and while it is retractable you have to wonder why
FatFreddysCat":2h398wmh said:Those people who say they've never had a kickback are lucky. I'd hazard a guess that most if not all are amateur woodworkers who in reality do very little sawing. As soon as you start to rip hardwoods in volume then binding and movement become much more common and it's worth avoiding kickbacks. After all nobody like blood blisters, or worse
Not specifically, no. At the risk of starting something it was made because there appears to be a widely circulated myth in woodworking fora that if it hasn't happened to me (yet) then it can't/won't happen, etc. when logic often dictates otherwise.Doug B":19m56qlr said:FatFreddysCat":19m56qlr said:Those people who say they've never had a kickback are lucky. I'd hazard a guess that most if not all are amateur woodworkers who in reality do very little sawing. As soon as you start to rip hardwoods in volume then binding and movement become much more common and it's worth avoiding kickbacks. After all nobody like blood blisters, or worse
I presume this comment was aimed at me, as i stated (& stand by) the fact i`ve never had kick back on a saw with a full width fence, when using the machine for the job it was designed to do.
But what do you call a large section? If your piece of material happens to be an 8 x 4in piece of partly machined elm or walnut which you were converting to a 4 x 4in section then you could still come unstuck using a long rip fence were there to be enough tension in the timber for it to allow the timber to warp and pinch between fence and blade. In part it depends on the size/power of the saw you're using with, at least in my own experience, kickback and stalling being much more likely on smaller/lower powered table saws. I've even seen experienced site chippies get kickback on portable table saws ripping down mild 3 x 2in CLS (quite a few times) and that's hardly large section or even a particularly heavy cut, so I think I'll stand by what I wrote (and which was what I was taught as an apprentice)Doug B":19m56qlr said:I was taught that a saw with a full width fence was for use with components that had at least 1 face side & 1 faced edge. It was not for ripping large sawn sections of timber, that was done on a dedicate rip saw. A much larger machine with a thick short steel fence, (& the one i worked on), a power feed.
FatFreddysCat":19qbk791 said:At the risk of starting something it was made because there appears to be a widely circulated myth in woodworking fora that if it hasn't happened to me (yet) then it can't/won't happen, etc. when logic often dictates otherwise.
FatFreddysCat":19qbk791 said:Those people who say they've never had a kickback are lucky. I'd hazard a guess that most if not all are amateur woodworkers who in reality do very little sawing.
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