i don't understand tablesaws

[selly]

chaps,

Please explain something I don't understand.

What is the difference between a cheap table saw and a good one?

I'll give you an example. I would quite like to by the little sip 10" table saw for around £100. Fundamentally I don't see myself using a saw for much more than ripping (but hardwoods). It is unlikely I shall use it for cutting sheet stuff as I would rather work with planked wood. I guess more important than anything is a good blade and a tidy fence, can anyone recommend a make of saw?

Does a cast iron table really make that much difference? I don't understand why these small saws are not really rated so well, are they really that limited. Equally I don't want to end up buying the wrong type of saw which is too limited for my desires.

I am only a hobbyist but I would like to make fine furniture and perhaps do my kitchen up one day, but unlikely to fire the saw up daily. Would a good 10" benchtop saw do the deeds and I could then save a bit of cash for a better p/t.

Thanks

 

[Roger]

Hi Selly - welcome to the forum

The differences are basically, quality, accuracy, reliability, repeatability, ease of use, stability, power, safety …. And the list goes on. Anything that differentiates between a ‘good’ piece of equipment and one that you’ll hate to use after a while and regret having bought.

Cheap and light almost invariably means inaccuracy in the fence and mitre gauge and in a lot of case, these will actually shift during a heavy piece of cutting and ruin the work. Heavy and relatively expensive Table Saws are bought for their stability, power and accuracy of a repeatable cut. There’s little point in having one apart from that, if you really do want to make good pieces of furniture and perhaps kitchen cabinets and doors.

Ripping solid wood demands a fairly powerful motor, an accurate and solid fence, a good sized table and good safety features. I don’t have any personal experience of the SIP – but I can almost guarantee it’s not something you’ll be happy with, even though SIP generally has a decent reputation. Looking at the saw (roughly 36” square table size and a weight not much heavier than a full suitcase), I’d advise against it for what you want. It’s a small, underpowered cheap saw, not much good for anything other than very light hobby work on small thin wood. Sorry !!

 

[DaveL]

Hi Selly,

Welcome to the forum.

I had a B&Q 10" table saw, not a lot different to the SIP one you are looking at. See it here.
It did work but it was very noisy, and quite light weight. I bolted it down on a large wheeled cabinet. The fence needed to be very carefully set as if did not stay square on the table.
So having slaged it of, I did use it to make quite a bit of nice stuff.
I gave it away when I bought a second hand Wadkin saw, large cast iron table, quiet induction motor, fence that locks square when you set it. If you follow the links on the Wadkin page you will see the bench I made, I would not of attempted to machine the large Ash boards for the bench on the B&Q saw.

Beware there is a Cast Iron Slope TM, I am still sliding down it, you are very near the top and once on it you wont get off very quickly. :roll:

 

[Steve Maskery]

Oh boy, you are opening up a can of worms!

I'm sure you will get lots of advice about this but I'll start you off.

Many small saws are not very well-powered. I mean, although they have a 10" blade, and can, in theory, cut 3", you'll struggle with hardwoods to cut more than 2". If you try to force it, you run the risk of burning out the motor.

A cast-iron saw will absorb vibration much better; if you search on here for "vibrate" or "vibration" I bet you'll find some horror stories.

Other complaints about low-end saws are:
Fence won't lock square, blade not parallel with mitre slot (and being un-adjustable), poor switch, unfriendly guard, noisy motor.. the list is endless.

That doesn't mean that all small saws are rubbish. I had an entry-level Axminster one that I bought about 15 years ago, and I've done a lot with that, with all its faults, until upgrading recently to an Xcalibur. But now having a good, expensive saw, I really wouldn't want to go back.

There you go, who's next?

Cheers
Steve
EDIT - Like buses, three come along at once! And I didn't realize - welcome to the forum!

 

[John McM]

As a hobbiest I started out with the same mistake. Bought a budget bench saw. In a little workshop the noise was horrendous. It was not a pleasure to use but kind of did the basics. You can get the SIP 01332 cast iron t/s for £450 all in if you shop around I would save up for that.
Best of Luck
John

 

[andycktm]

Hi selly,
I've got a mafell site saw, sort of halfway between the sip and the cast iron jobs.It's soft start ,quiet and fairly accurate also the cost is cheaper than cast too(in some cases ).

 

[Martin]

Hi selly,

I can only echo what others have already said - I started with a (relatively) cheap Draper brush motor saw - it cost me £240 at the time, but in those days you couldn't get anything cheaper.

Anyway, I got by with it, but it was very noisy, vibrated when switched on and the mechanism used to attach the riving knife was sloppy to the point of being almost dangerous (i.e. it was attached to the end of the table, not the blade rise/fall assembly, and would often lose alignment with the blade meaning that the edge of the riving knife would then "catch" against one or other side of the cut piece as you pushed it through).

In the end I sold it and got a Scheppach TS2500 which is a world apart, quieter, more accurate and feels much safer to use (but then so is the price - about £1500).

If you can't justify the price of one of the mid-range saws (quite likely if you're just starting out) then I'd recommend at least getting something a notch or two up from the bargain basement offers. For example, I've heard very good things about the Kity 419 (around £400), and as others have said you can get good cast iron saws in the £400-£500 range these days.

Cheers,
Martin.

 

[johnnyb]

beleive it or not your choice of saw can make a massive difference to the length of your wood work interest. personally i would swap every other tool in my shop for a quality table saw. i would also buy one with a classic design. 10 inch blade two 3/4 mitre slots handwheel rise and fall quality fence. possibly a used saw may be the way to go.

 

[selly]

Thanks guys.

I understand a lot more now. It seems to definitely be worth waiting a little to save up for a decent cast iron saw then.

I wouldn't want to make the mistake of buying too cheap and getting frustrated.

 

[RogerS]

Don't get hung up on cast-iron. Kity make very respectable table saws and IIRC they aren't cast iron.

 

[mpooley]

I bought a Nu-Tool table saw for about £100 several years ago and i would like to tell you it was a wonderful saw and the best money i ever spent.

BUT i'd be a liar! I made a special base for it to give it some stability but it was the scariest few hours of my life :shock:
The fence was awful - i tried to rip a nice piece of 4x2 and it ended up too small with a taper :lol:
The noise and vibration was horrendous and it taught me a lesson.

don't do it.

I took mine back within a day and got a full refund

 

[Fecn]

I'm on my second table saw now... The first was a Clarke £100 thing that didn't last too long. The monkey-metal gearbox on the motor shattered whilst I was cutting some bed slats and the cost of a new motor was the same as the cost of a new saw. (It also had a permanently attached blade guard so you couldn't do trench cuts.)

I'm replaced it with a £250 ryobi ets1825 saw which is a whole different tool. It doesn't have any cast iron bits, but it does have a fence which stays square, a large extening table, a folding stand with wheels, and a motor with a respectable amount of power for my needs. I've cut sheet goods on there with no problems. The mitre slots are annoy me however.