Domino stair spindles

[chippy1970]

I've got a job coming up this week that involves changing spindles on an old staircase. I'm fitting a new baserail but the customer wants to keep the existing handrail. The rail is the low profile type but has a flat bottom (no groove for spindles). I'm thinking of making some sort of jig to hold the domino flat and centred under the rail and I could put a domino in the jig so it pushes into the last hole to space the holes out. Then I could use the trim stop (if I had one) to domino all the spindle tops.

One worry is watching out for old nails in the handrail.

The big question is should I bother with any of the above or just glue and pin them in place or even pocket screw ??.

 

[ColeyS1]

Could you take the old handrail out and mortice it back shop, or run a groove in it ?

Tough one. Although probably just a nail and some glue would work, think id still be tempted to put something mechanical in- like a tenon. If you didn't want to risk the domino, could you use a forstener bit on the handrail instead ? Either put a round tenon on the end of your spindles or put a smaller square tenon on the end and find a forstener bit that fits.
Get yourself a little metal detector wand thing. It'll pay for itself in no time when working with suspect timber- just dont be a pleb like me and scan wood with a metal circular saw sled underneath :lol:

 

[Peter T]

Did something similar a while ago at my son's house.

Removed the panelling, new base rail, kept the existing hand rail. Difference was that the hand rail was grooved.

I domino'd through the base rail to fix the spindles at the bottom, and then normal pins, glue and spacers at the top.

The results look good and the whole assembly is very rigid. I was surprised how much rigidity the dominos add to the bottom joints!

Good luck,

 

[Graham Orm]

If it's to be painted you could plant on strips up either edge of the underside of the rail to form a groove, then spacers made to match the thickness of the strips. Do you have a nailer? They make this kind of thing much easier.

 

[chippy1970]

Coley, yeah I did think of getting a cheap metal detector, those domino cutters aren't cheap

Peter , yeah sounds like you did my job but upside down :grin:

I think I'm just trying to find a job for my shiney new domino :grin: if I do use it I will try and post pics.

 

[chippy1970]

If it's to be painted you could plant on strips up either edge of the underside of the rail to form a groove, then spacers made to match the thickness of the strips. Do you have a nailer? They make this kind of thing much easier.

Yeah I've got a few nailguns but that idea wouldn't work. The original handrail is stained oak and it has to stay the same profile too so any bits nailed on would ruin the look.

The new spindles are pre primed stop chamfered 32mm so just pinning and gluing them is ok as its being painted, I just thought dominoes would give it extra strength.

 

[xy mosian]

How are the existing spindles fitted? Could you match this fitting? For a job which is butted, all be it on an angle, I think I would be looking at dowels, one at the top of each spindle at right angles to the underside of the rail. The bottom fitting should stop any potential twist.
xy

 

[chippy1970]

Xy

The old ones are crap, the angles are cut badly, they are just butted and nailed and to top it all the spacings are wrong about 8 to 10 inches apart :lol:

I've started knocking up a jig for the domino will post pics if it works. Just need to buy a trim stop now.

 

[xy mosian]

chippy,

They sound really rough. Your replaced spindles are going to look tremendous. Good luck with the domino.
xy

 

[chippy1970]

Change of plan :grin::lol:

After thinking and advice from others I'm going to just use normal dowels. This will be fine as the bottom rails will stop any twisting. I've just knocked up a couple of quick jigs out of a chunk of oak and some mdf. I can clamp one on the spindle square off the cut edge then drill thru the jig into the spindle. Then I've got another block of oak that will clamp under the rail this also has a 10mm thru hole I can drill thru to make a matching hole in the rail. Job done :grin:

Also this way if I do hit a nail its a £3 drill rather than a £30 domino cutter.

 

[xy mosian]

Hi, I've been thinking about this a bit more. My earlier advice about dowels at right angles to the rail underside would perhaps be the easiest way of making the joint, but having the dowels in line with the spindles would be stronger.
xy

 

[chippy1970]

I think it should be ok by the time its glued and I might fire a pin in to hold it while the glue sets.

 

[chippy1970]

I posted a while back trying to get opinions on whether or not to use my domino to fit some spindles on a job I was pricing up. The job involved keeping the existing handrail so I would have to domino the new spindles into the flat underside of the rail and use a new base rail. Anyway after advice from Bob ( nine fingers) I decided to make a couple of jigs and just dowel them with ordinary dowels. I made one jig to drill a 10 mm hole in the spindle end and another that clamped to the rail to drill the corresponding hole. Once I had drilled the first hole in the rail I used a scrap of mdf with a dowel fixed in it butted against the jig to correctly space all the 10 mm holes. I then just worked my way up the rail with the spacer inserted in the previous hole every time. The rail turned out to be bowed , no problem I just propped it down off the ceiling while fitting everything until the glue had gone off. It did also have a slight twist which I left alone and when cutting the spindles I had to cut 45 degrees and 3 degrees bevel (compound).

Photos below of before and after.