COP26 progress or same old

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From here. Might be a bit out of date, but it gives an idea, China's total CO2 is 9.8 Billion Tonnes, so over a fifth is consumed outside China.


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I think China will end up leading the way. They've made a massive effort to catch up with USA industry and productivity (China still well behind on per capita carbon), making massive strides to sustainability and will be supplying the world with solar panels and other tech.
https://www.worldometers.info/co2-emissions/co2-emissions-per-capita/One dubious advantage of a totalitarian govt; they can listen to the science and do whatever is necessary
 
Careful now Jacob, these are only phd level scientists who live, eat and breathe their subject and have decades of knowledge to rely upon. They are not Brenda from Facebook, so not too sure their evidence can be relied upon.

🤭
 
Maori is not widely spoken in NZ but a lot of words have entered into daily usage. On of these is the term 'hui' which translates as a gathering, a party, or a meeting.
A day or two ago I heard a politician on the radio responding to a question from the interviewer about the climate meeting in Glasgow.
'What's needed,' he said, 'is a little less hui and a lot more do-ee.'
 
Careful now Jacob, these are only phd level scientists who live, eat and breathe their subject and have decades of knowledge to rely upon. They are not Brenda from Facebook, so not too sure their evidence can be relied upon.

🤭
You mean they may "have studied the subject in the past both academically and post academically.
and have degrees in Geology/Geophysics"? Phew! :unsure:
I wonder how well they know the writings of David Bellamy and the sterling work of Piers Corbyn? :rolleyes:
 
One the biggest advances in identifying the causes of air pollution has been the discovery of the fallout from the rectal verbosity that emanates from such as these forums.
The only thing that will cure that is a good dose of education.
 
One the biggest advances in identifying the causes of air pollution has been the discovery of the fallout from the rectal verbosity that emanates from such as these forums.
The only thing that will cure that is a good dose of education.
I'm sure you are right. When are you starting the cure?
 
I'm sure you are right. When are you starting the cure?

I'd be quite happy to load up Zoom and do a live debate with you to see exactly how much you do know about the subject without access to a computer so that you can't cheat and then post a video of it on here! Would that suit you?

You can even take your trousers down behind a screen if you wish so that you wouldn't sound muffled to the viewers!
 
I'd be quite happy to load up Zoom and do a live debate with you to see exactly how much you do know about the subject without access to a computer so that you can't cheat and then post a video of it on here! Would that suit you?

You can even take your trousers down behind a screen if you wish so that you wouldn't sound muffled to the viewers!
If you want to get up to speed on CC you really need to address a few of the 99% of research scientists who 'have studied the subject in the past both academically and post academically and have degrees in x,y, z etc " They'd be happy to put you straight!
 
If you want to get up to speed on CC you really need to address a few of the 99% of research scientists who 'have studied the subject in the past both academically and post academically and have degrees in x,y, z etc " They'd be happy to put you straight!

No! I don't need to read those papers, instead I'd like YOU personally to get me up to speed as you are quite happy to ridicule my intellectual integrity and believe I am wrong, so why not put me right, eh?.
You'll even have the bragging rights to impress the rest of your mates about it on the video!
 
No! I don't need to read those papers, instead I'd like YOU personally to get me up to speed as you are quite happy to ridicule my intellectual integrity and believe I am wrong, so why not put me right, eh?.
You'll even have the bragging rights to impress the rest of your mates about it on the video!
OK I'll try. You could start by looking more closely at the M Mann hockey stick controversy which you brought up. If you don't like wikipedia there are plenty of other sources e.g. Climate myths: The 'hockey stick' graph has been proven wrong
Actually the wiki article is pretty good https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_change_denial - so the next thing you need to do is fight your anti wikipedia prejudice along with your CC denial problem.
Hope that helps
 
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So every so often, a rank outsider wins the race. Nobody would deny that.
The relevant point to take away is that most of the time, they don't.

Indeed. There's an amusing trend for people to say "if 99% of qualified experts agree, they're probably wrong". I assume the people making such silly statements lose a lot of money if they go gambling.
 
Everyone can be wrong.
I was wrong once.
Apparently :oops:

Although I disagree with it.

I don't pretend to know everything. I do however have sufficient knowledge of the subject to at least be in a position to question many claims which quite frankly are questionable if one takes the time and trouble to actually look at them critically.
Over the years I've come across some claims which are so flawed that even a second year A-level student should be able to question them and yet people are soaking up these claims without any question!

If one doesn't subscribe to that way of thinking then it's like being part of a religion which doesn't allow any form of dissent. Anyone who questions their beliefs is a heretic and that is how pro-anthropogenic CC bods behave.

I don't see why they object to healthy critical reviewing of many claims. If the claims are correct then what are they afraid of?

These claims are what subject-ignorant politicians have to base their policies upon. It's not their fault as they don't know any better but any errors in the data or interpretation and modelling could have far reaching and dire consequences for many economies and people's lives if these figures are wrong or misleading.

That has got nothing to do with believing that mankind plays no part in GW. Of course it must do and as a matter of course, common sense tells us we have got to reduce such as carbon emissions substantially but there are many other factors which contribute to both CC/global warming and cooling although listening to the alarmist scientists etc, one wouldn't think so.
The question is, how much does anthropogenic input actually affect climatic change? There are innumerable models bandied around, some accurate and some dubious but few actually quantify their claims and without those figures, how does one know if the measures to reduce carbon emissions are sufficient or not?
 
Indeed. There's an amusing trend for people to say "if 99% of qualified experts agree, they're probably wrong". I assume the people making such silly statements lose a lot of money if they go gambling.
Well maybe not. The difference is that the bookmakers adjust the odds accordingly. I'm not sure how that compares with CC denial.
 
I don't pretend to know everything. I do however have sufficient knowledge of the subject to at least be in a position to question many claims which quite frankly are questionable if one takes the time and trouble to actually look at them critically.
Over the years I've come across some claims which are so flawed that even a second year A-level student should be able to question them and yet people are soaking up these claims without any question!

If one doesn't subscribe to that way of thinking then it's like being part of a religion which doesn't allow any form of dissent. Anyone who questions their beliefs is a heretic and that is how pro-anthropogenic CC bods behave.

I don't see why they object to healthy critical reviewing of many claims. If the claims are correct then what are they afraid of?

These claims are what subject-ignorant politicians have to base their policies upon. It's not their fault as they don't know any better but any errors in the data or interpretation and modelling could have far reaching and dire consequences for many economies and people's lives if these figures are wrong or misleading.

That has got nothing to do with believing that mankind plays no part in GW. Of course it must do and as a matter of course, common sense tells us we have got to reduce such as carbon emissions substantially but there are many other factors which contribute to both CC/global warming and cooling although listening to the alarmist scientists etc, one wouldn't think so.
The question is, how much does anthropogenic input actually affect climatic change? There are innumerable models bandied around, some accurate and some dubious but few actually quantify their claims and without those figures, how does one know if the measures to reduce carbon emissions are sufficient or not?
Could you kindly point me at one of these claims that a second year A level student could see through? One that is currently being relied upon by the scientific community concensus? I'm genuinely interested.
 
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All those in later years can relate to changes in many aspects of life, what there was compared to what it is now and just based on simple observations and experiences then probably like me you can only conclude that we are having a major impact on our enviroment and you don't need to be a scientist to know this, a scientist may have the ability for a deeper explanation and to raise theories but the average old joe can see their surroundings just as well. So what changes have I seen, well the most obvious are the seasons merging without the much clearer divide there once was, then I can remember seeing wildlife such as Hedgehogs and barn owls on a regular basis, along with many other song birds. The roads were much quieter, far less intrusion into the countryside by development and people lived a more realistic lifestyle without being so needy or materialistic so yes we are having a very big impact and no one really knows what is at the destination we have chosen to head for except it will be different.
 
I don't pretend to know everything. I do however have sufficient knowledge of the subject to at least be in a position to question many claims which quite frankly are questionable if one takes the time and trouble to actually look at them critically.
Over the years I've come across some claims which are so flawed that even a second year A-level student should be able to question them and yet people are soaking up these claims without any question!

If one doesn't subscribe to that way of thinking then it's like being part of a religion which doesn't allow any form of dissent. Anyone who questions their beliefs is a heretic and that is how pro-anthropogenic CC bods behave.

I don't see why they object to healthy critical reviewing of many claims. If the claims are correct then what are they afraid of?

These claims are what subject-ignorant politicians have to base their policies upon. It's not their fault as they don't know any better but any errors in the data or interpretation and modelling could have far reaching and dire consequences for many economies and people's lives if these figures are wrong or misleading.

That has got nothing to do with believing that mankind plays no part in GW. Of course it must do and as a matter of course, common sense tells us we have got to reduce such as carbon emissions substantially but there are many other factors which contribute to both CC/global warming and cooling although listening to the alarmist scientists etc, one wouldn't think so.
The question is, how much does anthropogenic input actually affect climatic change? There are innumerable models bandied around, some accurate and some dubious but few actually quantify their claims and without those figures, how does one know if the measures to reduce carbon emissions are sufficient or not?
If you really have anything interesting to say you'd do far better for your scientific reputation by winning an argument against experts in the field rather than losing it to somebody on a woodwork forum.
Hope that helps.

PS Re "the question is, how much does anthropogenic input actually affect climatic change?" the consensus says the current exceptional rate of change is 100% anthropogenic. There do not seem to be other forces at work, over and above normal variations.
 
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global warming and cooling
I think your answer was fair up until this point here which youve added and is the crux of nay sayers who claim its all part of a natural process, one we humans cant influence. A cycle going back millions of years etc etc.

We have to listen to the science on this and to the men and women who as I said previously are qualified and live and breathe their subject
Its a bit like youre losing weight, feeling generally unwell and go to the doctor who takes blood and sends it off to to examined. The doctor calls you in and says Sorry, you have a cancer. We're putting you down for a round of chemo.
Would it be prudent to retort, well doc, Brenda on facebook disagrees and says by eating kelp i can cure the illness.
Obviously not,and in such circumstances we are more than happy to listen tot he science, but in the subject of global warming we can only do the same and to think otherwise is irrational.
 
You will always have those who cannot face reality, so solution is to just deny and hope it goes away. Another way to hide a truth is confusion, don't just deny something as people will then speculate, much better to start lots of rumours so the masses end up burying the truth for you and casting so much doubt no one ends up believing.
 
Could you kindly point me at one of these claims that a second year A level student could see through? One that is currently being relied upon by the scientific community concensus? I'm genuinely interested.

I second this. For all the 11 pages, there's such little substance. I'm open minded and like listening to both sides of subjects. So please, enough with the fighting and share some of your knowledge. People are eager to learn.
 
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