BT Business Advice

[Mark A]

Hi chaps,

Just need a bit of advice regarding BT Business.

We've been customers for years and the bills have become silly. Thousands of pounds a year silly... But due to the unethical way line rental and services are arranged we were tied into interminable contracts one way or another for ever.

That's when I came across VOIP systems; namely Vonage. After speaking to their helpful customer services dept. I was given a very good quote for our business telephones which was more than 70% cheaper than BT.

However, VOIP systems apparently work best with fast broadband so I have agreed to upgrade to BT Infinity Fibreoptic. (At least I think I have - I called three times to confirm and each "BT Business Options Team Advisor" couldn't find any records of me signing up for it)

As Vonage only requires a broadband connection our multiple BT lines will become redundant. BT are adamant we have to pay cancellation fees (fines) if we terminate the contracts early. I have attempted to discuss the fees but BT say it's set by OFCOM and therefore non-negotiable.

Is this true, or just more BT BS?

My tolerance for large companies who pass me from pillar-to-post is very little nowadays. I'm still getting over Avis fraudulently charging our credit card £1485, but that's for another time...


Thanks,
Mark

:x

 

[Mark A]

Currently on hold to BT Business.

Their incompetantance would be amusing if the telephones and broadband weren't so vital for our company...

 

[Steve Maskery]

BT are just THE worst utility company in the country, closely followed by nPower.

When I did my Masters, BT were our team's client for our Consultancy module. We had a meeting with our BT contact. We, four students and our tutor, walked across town to BT's offices, to find that our contact had "forgotten", could we come back this afternoon? No we ^&*()(*&^%-well couldn't!

I could write a book about the way BT failed to deliver a telephone handset. A handset. It took nearly a dozen phone calls to sort it out. At one point I had a bill for two when I had possession of none. And after telling me they could not install a telephone line in a new address for over two months, yet I would have to continue to pay rental for a service I could not access, we agreed to part company. I paid a one-month "fine" of about £35, and that was that, or so I thought.

The following month I had a bill for another £130, a cancellation fee. I, of course, queried it. I was told that the cancellation fee was £165, not 35. It's not what I was told when I made the decision, of course. I cancelled my DD and we have been in dispute over it ever since. They must have the conversation on record, but of course, I don't have access to that.

Since then I have had a series of debt-collection agencies sending me threatening emails, texts and phone calls. Finally a paper letter arrived demanding considerably more than £130 by next Wednesday. I wrote back explaining the situation and on the following Thursday, one day after the deadline, I received a letter offering me a 50% off deal.

It's been quiet since then.

I shall never, ever, be a BT customer again. I'd rather live without connectivity than do so again.

Unfortunately I am an EE customer, and have been, very happily, since I signed up with one2one, then T-mobile. BT is buying EE. I think I shall have to change to O2 or Virgin. No use going to Orange, which is also part of EE.

Now don't get me started on nPower...

S

Ooh, I do feel better for all that.

 

[Mark A]

I was on hold waiting to be transferred to another department in a different continent when I heard this message: "Our agents are available between 8am and 6pm". Yep, cut me off :-x

My faith in this company has evaporated. If they handle a sales issue this poorly then what happens when we have a fault?


New question:

What broadband provider does the collective recommend for business use? It must be fast and reliable.


Cheers,
Mark

 

[Mark A]

BT are just THE worst utility company in the country, closely followed by nPower.

When I did my Masters, BT were our team's client for our Consultancy module. We had a meeting with our BT contact. We, four students and our tutor, walked across town to BT's offices, to find that our contact had "forgotten", could we come back this afternoon? No we ^&*()(*&^%-well couldn't!

I could write a book about the way BT failed to deliver a telephone handset. A handset. It took nearly a dozen phone calls to sort it out. At one point I had a bill for two when I had possession of none. And after telling me they could not install a telephone line in a new address for over two months, yet I would have to continue to pay rental for a service I could not access, we agreed to part company. I paid a one-month "fine" of about £35, and that was that, or so I thought.

The following month I had a bill for another £130, a cancellation fee. I, of course, queried it. I was told that the cancellation fee was £165, not 35. It's not what I was told when I made the decision, of course. I cancelled my DD and we have been in dispute over it ever since. They must have the conversation on record, but of course, I don't have access to that.

Since then I have had a series of debt-collection agencies sending me threatening emails, texts and phone calls. Finally a paper letter arrived demanding considerably more than £130 by next Wednesday. I wrote back explaining the situation and on the following Thursday, one day after the deadline, I received a letter offering me a 50% off deal.

It's been quiet since then.

I shall never, ever, be a BT customer again. I'd rather live without connectivity than do so again.

Unfortunately I am an EE customer, and have been, very happily, since I signed up with one2one, then T-mobile. BT is buying EE. I think I shall have to change to O2 or Virgin. No use going to Orange, which is also part of EE.

Now don't get me started on nPower...

S

Ooh, I do feel better for all that.

Feel better after that Steve? :lol:

I could rant about Avis, but I won't 'til the dispute is sorted. I think it is because it's been several months since the 45 day window has passed in which Avis could respond.

 

[mind_the_goat]

The regulators don't set minimum charges for a service, only maximum ones so this is pineapples. There is new guidance on hidden charges: http://stakeholders.ofcom.org.uk/consul ... _statement which includes various types of termination charge. If your contracts have just continued with no changes then I think it's pretty clear termination charges do not apply. If you've changed something then maybe less clear. I would cancel your Infinity order and contact offcom, or at least send BT a copy of that linked document
I got stung for termination charges because I'd added some very minor service, swore I'd never go back to BT unless they paid it back.

I now use PlusNet, they are a BT subsidiary but run independently. Have always found their customer service to be excellent.

 

[Mark A]

Hi,

Thanks for the link. I only scanned through it now but will read it fully tomorrow.

I called TalkTalk and Plusnet earlier and they had some good news - apparently I can keep the line rental with BT (hopefully saving £260 early termination fee) and just sign up for fibre optic broadband only. I'll speak to their business dept. in the morning to confirm.

Mark

 

[Deejay]

Morning Mark

I don't think it's just BT who use these 'sharp' practices in their contracts.

I have a friend who rents Sky TV. He tells me that the only way he can cancel is via a premium rate telephone call. The average call duration is apparently twenty minutes. Apparently, it's in his contract.

You mention Talk Talk. I had a broadband account with Tiscali. Talk Talk bought Tiscali. After a couple of months, they wrote to me to say that if I didn't take their telephony service with my broadband, they would charge me five quid a month extra for my broadband. They seemed to think that they had God given right to take money from me. I made my excuses and left.

If I were you, I'd try and get everything on one contract with one company. If you're not careful, you'll end up with two contracts which are both difficult to leave.

When does your BT contract expire? That would be a good opportunity to make the change.

Cheers

Dave

 

[Mark A]

The contract on the line used for broadband was due to expire in May 2017, but since I agreed to sign up for BT Infinity the date's been moved to 2018. Installation of Infinity is set for 3rd June (as far as I know - no doubt they'll get it wrong) so I have today to make enquiries and maybe cancel the BT order. And sign up for Vonage.

 

[Mark A]

On hold with BT Business again. Apparently they have no record of my Infinity broadband order. This is the 8th time I called them in six days regarding the installation. You couldn't make it up...

 

[mind_the_goat]

SWMBO signed up for Infinity at her office, on the day it was due to be installed, BT contacted her to tell her that the installation of Infinity for the whole town was held up, They hadn't even got it to the exchange. Took about 3 months before they even got the exchange connected.

3 years seems a very long time, their 24 month rates are here, http://business.bt.com/broadband-and-internet/, hope they gave you a better deal than that for a longer contract.

 

[mind_the_goat]

Make sure you keep notes of all the calls, you may need when they turn up in 3 months to install the broadband they have no record of you ordering.

 

[Deejay]

Afternoon Mark

Apparently they have no record of my Infinity broadband order.

Deep joy. Get it in writing. One less thing to worry about.

Cheers

Dave

 

[Flynnwood]

BT are just THE worst utility company in the country, closely followed by nPower.

When I did my Masters, BT were our team's client for our Consultancy module. We had a meeting with our BT contact. We, four students and our tutor, walked across town to BT's offices, to find that our contact had "forgotten", could we come back this afternoon? No we ^&*()(*&^%-well couldn't!

I could write a book about the way BT failed to deliver a telephone handset. A handset. It took nearly a dozen phone calls to sort it out. At one point I had a bill for two when I had possession of none. And after telling me they could not install a telephone line in a new address for over two months, yet I would have to continue to pay rental for a service I could not access, we agreed to part company. I paid a one-month "fine" of about £35, and that was that, or so I thought.

The following month I had a bill for another £130, a cancellation fee. I, of course, queried it. I was told that the cancellation fee was £165, not 35. It's not what I was told when I made the decision, of course. I cancelled my DD and we have been in dispute over it ever since. They must have the conversation on record, but of course, I don't have access to that.

Since then I have had a series of debt-collection agencies sending me threatening emails, texts and phone calls. Finally a paper letter arrived demanding considerably more than £130 by next Wednesday. I wrote back explaining the situation and on the following Thursday, one day after the deadline, I received a letter offering me a 50% off deal.

It's been quiet since then.

I shall never, ever, be a BT customer again. I'd rather live without connectivity than do so again.

Unfortunately I am an EE customer, and have been, very happily, since I signed up with one2one, then T-mobile. BT is buying EE. I think I shall have to change to O2 or Virgin. No use going to Orange, which is also part of EE.

Now don't get me started on nPower...

S

Ooh, I do feel better for all that.

Just as a small aside to this (and in general when dealing with similar occurances), find / research their "Complaints Procedure" and use it. In conjuntion with the Data Protection Act. All in writing.

For instance;

I wish to raise a formal complaint in accordance with your Code of Practice.

My complaint is (....)

I also wish to make a Subject Access Request as per Section 7 of the Data Protection Act for copies held by you in relation to my account, including but not limited to, all data, statements and any correspondence (electronic or otherwise) received or issued regarding the account.

In addition, I wish to;

• be told whether any personal data is being processed;
• be given a description of the personal data, the reasons it is being processed, and whether it will be given to any other organisations or people;
• be given a copy of the information comprising the data; and
• be given details of the source of the data

I also request information about the reasoning behind any automated decisions that are / have been taken, such as a computer-generated decision, in accordance with the above Act.

Please advise if you wish to charge me the £xx fee (a) for supplying this information.

Yours faithfully,

-------------------------------------------

(a) The fee is normally around £10

-------------------------------------------

 

[Mark A]

That's very useful. Consider it copied, pasted and saved for the next time a big company tries to shaft us!

 

[Steve Maskery]

That is indeed useful. TVM.

I should have added that when BT failed to attend the meeting with us as students, the Consultancy project was real work, not just something invented for us to tackle. So they had 4 very bright Masters students, plus me, working for them for nothing, doing real consultancy, that was supposed to improve matters within their company.

Would you like to know the title of the brief?

v
v
v
v
v
v
v

"How to increase levels of trust within the group, between different parts of the organisation"

Well you could start by turning up for your own &*()_(*&^ meetings!

 

[Lons]

I had a problem with BT earlier this year, just dropped an email direct to Libby Barr at 11 pm, she replied at 6.45 am and it was sorted by a member of her team by 10 am.
I'd copy it to Gavin Patterson.

CEO addresses here: http://www.ceoemail.com/

cheers
Bob

 

[dc_ni]

You could try Zen broadband for your ISP. https://www.zen.co.uk/

 

[Mark A]

Hi chaps,

I came across Zen Broadband yesterday while researching alternatives to BT, TalkTalk and PlusNet. I called the number, got through to a knowledgeable human immediately and I'm relieved to say my confidence in ISP's is coming back. They can offer us superfast fibre optic for around the same price as BT's best rate. The online reviews for Zen (and mentions on this site above and by RogerS) are almost unanimously positive; 9-point-something out of 10 on Trust Pilot, compared to BT's dismal score.

The experience of dealing with Zen contrasted greatly with BT immediately afterwards when I called to cancel the installation of Infinity fibre optic and obtain the MAC Code. On hold for 9 minutes, transferred twice and then the "BT Business Options Adviser" attempted to convince me to stay with special bolt-ons.
No thanks... why didn't they the local rep offer the deals when he came to our office last month (incidentally the bolt-on isn't suitable for us anyway because it do not include international mobile calls, just landline). Or indeed mention VOIP systems at all?

I asked for the MAC Code and was told it had been sent. It hadn't. Back on phone to BT (14 minutes on hold, transferred once) and told by a cantankerous woman I will have to call back on Monday as the Infinty cancellation takes 24 hours to be processed and therefore they can't give me the code.

Afterwards I contacted Vonage and signed up for the "Premium + World Option + Mobile 750 Option" package, which means we essentially have unlimited international and UK calls to both landlines and mobiles. A quick and painless experience. Well done Vonage!

I'll call BT on Monday, obtain the MAC Code and then sign up for Zen Broadband. We'll keep the line for the broadband with BT as the cancellation charge is £260.

When all is done we should be paying approximately £100/month for Zen Broadband, BT line rental and phones by Vonage combined. BT say they will charge around £700 as cancellation fees if we terminate the existing broadband and line rental contracts early, but even if we pay that we'll still be saving over £1200 in the first year. Closer to £2000 in the second. And I still have time to dispute the cancellation fees.

The sooner we sever ties with BT the better.

Sorry 'bout the rant!

Mark

 

[Mark A]

MAJOR F- UP by BT...

One of our lines was aparently due to reach the end of its contract on 29th May 2015, and about a dozen BT 'advisors' declared that was indeed the case.

Then on the 28th - the day before it was due to end - another 'advisor' said: "I don't know where they got that from because it says on my system 2017..."

I called BT several times since and on each occassion the date's changed to 2017, meaning we may or may not have another two years of contract to run. Which also means the cancellation fee for that line is £260. Or is that £215? Or £254? Or £240? They couldn't make their mind up for that either.

When a client tried to call us this morning they heard beeeeeeeeeep.... The line had been cut. The client thought we had ceased trading!

I called BT 'Business Options Team' and the 'advisor' said they have no records since the line's been closed and so we can only find out what's happened when we receive the final bill... in a month's time. If we are unhappy then we can dispute it, but only then.

I told him records do not just evaporate and asked him to transfer me to the billing department. They were able to provide two names and a reference number (progress!) but said it's a matter for the 'BT Business Options Team' to discuss. "You've already spoken to them? They should know more about it than me. Do you want me to transfer you?" Aaahhhhhh!

Anyway, I'm now waiting for a call-back which I believe will never happen so it's time to waste another 45 minutes of my life talking to BT.



Mark