battery driver advice required...

[andyavast]

My Panasonic battery driver has given up after two and a half years of heavy use, so I'm in the market for a new one. Money is no object as I use my cordless every day. I use it for a little drilling/counter-boring/counter-sinking and lots of screw driving.

Currently I am looking at offerings from Festool, Hilti and Panasonic but have heard good things about the new lithium ion offerings from Makita.

I would very much appreciate any advice on this matter.

cheers.

Andy.

 

[chicken_house_man]

I've tried makita but found them a bit weak (power wise and life)
Now swaped to a bosch professional which I've had for a couple of months without any problems. They come with a 3 year warrenty. The only possible down side is they are faily heavy but that would also mean they are made of something heavier than plastic. I don't seem to notice the extra weight now.

 

[chippy1970]

I've tried makita but found them a bit weak (power wise and life)
Now swaped to a bosch professional which I've had for a couple of months without any problems. They come with a 3 year warrenty. The only possible down side is they are faily heavy but that would also mean they are made of something heavier than plastic. I don't seem to notice the extra weight now.

You cant be talking about the LI-ION Makita ones as I have the 18v combi drill and impact driver had them nearly 2 years and use them every day and they are very powerful and long lasting.

I even used a 120mm hole saw on 18mm ply with no problem :shock:

Only problem I had was the gear box broke a couple of months ago and Makita fixed it even though it was out of warranty. I know of a couple of people with the NiHM battery Makita's that also had the same problem so there must have been a common fault.

I have heard that the Festool drivers are good but they seem a bit behind on the battery side.

 

[Karl]

I've had a Makita 12v Nimh combi (MXT), and was completely unimpressed - it lasted 12months (of not that heavy use) then gave up.

Got one of the Hitachi 18v Li-ion combi's now, and it is in a different league.

Cheers

Karl

 

[big soft moose]

at home i'm currently stuck with a crappy B&Q offering which i wouldnt reccomend to anyone

however at work (and at home when ever i can borrow it ) we have a dewalt 14.4v drill driver which is the mutts nuts.

 

[Racers]

Hi,

I am seeing loads of Makita drills etc being carried by people these days hardly any yellow stuff at all.

Pete

 

[Mr Ed]

Having had a succession of DIY-level Bosch drills that were never that good, about a year ago I decided to go for a pro quality drill. I went for the Metabo BSZ18 Impuls Li-Ion 18V, which at the time was £200, although it appears to be around £225 now. At the time I bought there was an offer for a 2 year warranty for free.

Have been really pleased with it and would definitely suggest considering Metabo if you are heading for the upper end of the market.

My 2 cents on battery drills are as follows;

1. Just go for a drill-driver, if you are drilling masonry I would just use a corded SDS hammer.
2. Ni-Cd's are rubbish; too early for me to say if Li-Ion is the solution but they seem OK so far.
3. Up to a point, more money does seem to equal a better drill in my experience.
4. Get one with 2 or 3 batteries (although they all seem to have that now)
5. I would keep an eye on the weight of the drill - too heavy and its tiring to use. On the same lines, I would watch the size as I find the designs with a more compact body easier to use also.
6. Finally, every time in the past I have looked at the price of replacement batteries when they are dead, I have concluded it best to throw the drill in the bin and buy a new one.

In my youth I was always told by those older and wiser that Metabo was 'the' make of drill to have. I suspect thats less the case now, but I have been well pleased with the one I have.

Cheers, Ed.

 

[Streepips]

My Panasonic battery driver has given up after two and a half years of heavy use, so I'm in the market for a new one. Money is no object as I use my cordless every day. I use it for a little drilling/counter-boring/counter-sinking and lots of screw driving.

Currently I am looking at offerings from Festool, Hilti and Panasonic but have heard good things about the new lithium ion offerings from Makita.

I would very much appreciate any advice on this matter.

cheers.

Andy.

Andy,

I assume that the panasonic drill itself has "died" rather than just the batteries that have failed?
If thats the case, and its just the motor then it may be worth a repair. If its the gearbox then I don`t know if its worth a repair.
I have a 15.6V Panasonic drill driver. 3.5Amp hours version and it worked hard for about 3 years then the motor died...So I bought a Makita 18V LXT Lithium Ion , one of the specials, the black and silver ones in an ally case.....
A few points here:

The panasonic 15.6V motor from a Panasonic dealer works out at about £28:00.So I bought one, found a Torx driver to undo the body shell and soldered in the leads of the new motor. Drill fixed......

The makita chuck is nowhere near as good as the panasonic, it slips, not badly because overall its a good quality chuck, but not as good as the Panasonic

Power:

Not much to choose between them , although the Makita has the edge on sustained heavy duty usage sessions because of the Li-ion batteries.

Functions:
The Makita has Impact mode, which is great for masonry drill work, but the Panasonic is no slouch either in its hammer mode.
Makita has the edge here but its a moot point really, both cope well in this respect.

Forward reverse button.....
For me, the Panasonic wins here. Slight awkwardness with the Makits, not much in it but enough to call a judgement

Speed selector( Speeds, 1 & 2)
The Panasonic wins hands down, just slots in and stays.Flicks easily to the other setting .
The Makita switch is not as positive, nor does it feel as robust or positive in use. Far worse is the fact that it often slips out of a speed or gear setting, losing drive and making an awful internal racket which cannot be doing it any good. Not enough to warrant a return, but not as bullet proof as the Panasonic.

Ergonomics. The Panasonic becomes an extension of your arm, whilst the Makita is a comfortable drill to use. Weight for both or either is not an issue for me, both fine in this respect, balance is good with both as well

Battery load /unload
The panasonic is not the easiest battery to disengage, but locks in tight in service.
The Makita battery loads and unloads easily.
Both have "smart" chargers, but the Makita recharges the quickest, although you get plenty of warning when the Panasonic is getting below par so lots of time to charge up another battery anyway.

Gimmicks?

The Panasonic does not really have anything I would call a gimmick, unless you count the spare bit holder hidden away in the battery housing
( I bet most owners do not even know its there ! )
The Makita has an LED "worklight" that does not actually shine where you wish to drill, the light is obscured/deflected by the drill contours, so at best this is a waste, albeit minuscule, of battery resources.

Overall toughness:

Hard to quantify without a test to destruction, but I feel the Panasonic will outlast the Makita.

Would I buy either of them again?
Yes, I would buy the Panasonic, especially a Li-Ion version of the same drill. but I would not but the Makita drill again, not because I didlike Makits, I don`t I have lots of excellent Makita kit, including 9.6v and 12 v drill drivers, drywall screwdrivers, sanders and an excellent metal cased Makita jigsaw, but as for a workhorse cordless its the Panasonic for me
I would not want a DeWalt, various reasons, a Hilti might be good, industrial background and pedigree?
The Festool of course will be a lot more expensive, and perhaps not such good value because of the high price even though it will probably be at least as adequate as the Makits, Panasonic, Hiliti etc.
Good luck with whatever you get !

 

[Oryxdesign]

I've got one of the Panasonic Li-Ion it's the business, just as tough as the old ones, very powerful and much lighter. I have compared to all the other makes and Makita are getting close again but no cigar.

 

[andyavast]

thanks for all the advice fellas, the panasonic has died in terms of battery life. They won't hold a charge and I'm not prepared to pay more than the price of a new drill for two new batteries.

My brother uses a 15.6V Hilti cordless and it has not missed a beat since he got it 18 months ago, I'm assuming it has something to do with superior engineering and the intelligent charger which constantly monitors the condition of the batteries. I reckon I'm going to go with the Festool TDK 15.6V which has a similar spec to the Hilti, but a better accessories package.

Every piece of festool equipment I have used has been of the highest quality so I can imagine their drill/drivers are of the same calibre.

Andy

 

[Streepips]

Andy,

would you consider posting me the drill for spares then? Post paid etc...

 

[hpl]

HI just seen your post. I use a Festool C12 (12v) and a LiOn 18V Makita. I have had the Festool for about a year and the Makita for about 2 months. ( I have had previous makita's) One point, my local tool shop (small independant) only sell the makita and the Festool in cordless drills. This is because of the reliability but mostly the availability of spares and the manufacturers aftersales service. It is easy to get a makita or Festool fixed, or get a spare part etc.

I bought the Makita as a second drill driver as I have just started someone working with me and we always want the drill at the same time. They are mostly used for screwdriving and small holes etc.
Out of choice I mostly pick up the Festool because of it's balance and that the system works, i.e. it is easy to change 'heads' between the chuck and the centro thingy with the screwdriver bits or countersink or whatever. Another simple but so useful thing is the magnetic strip on the front of the handle, prob my favourite feature, how sad, but it is very useful. The makita has more power for the weight, the 18V feels like it is the same weight as the 12v festool, but saying that I have always been impressed with the power of the festool as it is only a 12v, it isn't far behind the 18v makita. The Nicad batteries don't hold their charge if left in the case like the new LiOn, I have noticed that if the batteries have sat in the case for a couple of weeks then they don't last very long

Looking at your last post you mention the 15v Festool, I would suggest trying the C12 as it is better balanced and the 12v has loads of power and the 3.0ah batteries last ages. If you are putting in loads of large screws then it may need more frequent charging than the 18v Makita. I mostly use 16 - 40 mm screws but it is still happy to put 70 - 100 mm screws into wood with no problem, usually on the second speed. The Makita does have more power, but for me I don't usually need that.

I like my C12 and would buy another if I was replacing. I am Festool biased and have lots of their tools, but only because they are well engineered and well thought out.

Hope this helps

Johnny B

 

[Karl]

I notice that Rutlands have got these on offer. Presume it is a clearance line of an old model? It only has 2 x 2.0ah Ni-Cad batteries - but with a 15 min charger, would that matter?

Anybody else know about these? The look to be the predecessor to the new C12????

Cheers

Karl

 

[hpl]

Hi Karl

The early C12 was not a good tool, mostly because the balance was wrong. I know someone who has one and he never uses it for that reason. I have tried one and it isn't worth buying. The new C12 on the other hand... (see my previous post)
The one you have linked to I don't know about but it does look and sound like the earlier version of the now TDK 12v. The old version of the C12 had 2.0ah batteries where as now they are 2.4 + 3.0 ah so guess it was the same with the earlier version or the now TDK.
I don't know anything about the feel, quality etc. of the one you have linked to so can't help there.

Hope that helps

Johnny B

 

[mailee]

Just my tu penneth, I have just bought a 12V Makita with three batteries and charger and case plus an impact driver for £119 on offer at Anglia tools and yes it is Ni Cad but seems pretty good. I fited two doors today and used it for drilling, screwing and recessing the lock barrel on one 1.3ah battery! I also have a 9.6V Makita driver that I have had for fifteen years on the same two batteries and one has just given up at long last! (Hence the new driver) I have not used the Festool so can't comment on these but for the price of the Makita I don't think you can go wrong. :wink:

 

[RogerS]

I've been using a Makita Impact driver for the last year - day in, day out. I'd buy another tomorrow but this one shows no sign of dying yet! With the variable speed you can even use it to finesse in plasterboard screws without fuss.

 

[cambournepete]

Another vote for the Festool C12 which I think would be ideal for your stated needs.
It's expensive but worth the money (to me anyway) and a pleasure to use. I've got the larger NiMH batteries and they hold their charge well and last for ages. The offset and right-angle chucks work perfectly as well.
I also purchased the drill and bit systainer set - this is the current one.

 

[andyavast]

Hello all, I'd like to thank you very much for the advice and information you offered concerning my cordless drill. I don't know how I coped before I discovered UKW!

I bought a Festool C12 with 3.0AH batteries and the full complement of fitments. I haven't used it yet but already I am impressed with the sturdiness of the construction, soundness of engineering and ingenuity present in the design.

Thanks again y'all.

Andy.

 

[DangerousDave]

I don't know how I coped before I discovered UKW!

Andy, I agree. Its like having a shed load of mentors on tap 24/7

I bought an 18V Black & Decker drill/driver 7 years ago to do some decking, thinking I would chuck it after the job. Its still going strong on the original battery (which holds a charge for ages) and I give it dogs abuse on an almost daily basis!!!! :shock: Its a dark blue colour, I haven't seen them anywhere since. Unlike most of their other tat this thing is indestructable; you could tow a caravan with it I also have a Ryobi D/D as a secondary. I agree with whats alredy been said; always use corded for masonary. Am thinking about getting a Makita (drill/drivers are like routers; you can never have enough. IMHO you need at least 3. One for pilot bit, one for countersink and one for driving. Saves changing bits the whole time).

 

[neilyweely]

Hello mate

I have the SF144 14.4v Hilti Drill/driver, Makita 14.4v MXT combi, Ryobi 18v one+ combi and the Makita li-ion. I use the Ryobi a lot as I am not so concerned if it gets nicked, and the only problem with it is its battery life. I have 3 batts for it, so not a real issue (although I have to charge one as I am working because I use 6 or 7 ryobi cordless tools) but truth be told I would not reccommend it as a stand alone drill. This is because it's performance, whilst excellent for the money, is only average in reality, however, for 90% of jobs it 'copes'.

The Makita mxt 14.4v is quite old now, and is my day in day out combi, used for fixing small rawlplugs and general site work, and the Li-ion is also a good tool. Everything said earlier in thread about them is true.

If, on the other hand, I was going to France again, and wanted to be sure that I had a single tool to perform well and cover any eventualities it would certainly be the Hilti. Why? It is well engineered, light, excellent batt life, powerful, easy to operate and performs VERY well. It is only a drill driver, as a wise man once told me that the hammer/impact function on a cordless tool is likely to reduce its operating life significantly. I would do as my learned colleague stated and use a SDS drill for any masonry work.

I am a firm believer in buying single purpose tools, as I feel that a tool which is made to do several functions is going to compromise its ability to do one job as well as it can. A single purpose tool, ie a drill driver is just, well, better. Only opinion.

As far as De Walt are concerned I am told that manufacture has moved to China which has resulted in a drop in quality. I do not own anything de walt ( one 3.6v screwdriver!! ), but do own an old B&D RAS, and an ELU router, both of which have connections to de walt and both of which are excellent.

So, IMHO, steer clear of yellow, blue is a good bet, and will get a lot of votes, but my vote is RED!!!! (sorry festool, not considered as too pricey!)

Nothing red of mine does anything but impress, just because it WORKS!!! Like the varnish it does exactly what it says on the tin, nothing less.

Anyroad, there is a warm spot in the bed upstairs with my name on it, so.......

night night

Neil