Washing Machines - Cold Fill - Energy use

[dedee]

It has been a long time since I bought a washing machine and am currently surfing around (in somewhat of a hurry) for a new one and I am somewhat surprised that the majority all now seem to be cold fill only.

Can this really be more energy efficient than a hot & cold fill? Or is it just an excuse by the manufactures to cut costs in some way?

Andy

 

[cambournepete]

I guess you've already figured out that the theory is that you only heat the amount of water you need, rather than filling lots of pipe work with hot water and still needing to do some heating in the machine.

Seems to make sense really, just make sure you compare the energy usage on a like-for-like program basis.

I think that some Siemens machines and most Miele now have 10 year warranties (parts and labour) which has to be worth something. I'd go for one of those personally.

Senseless ramble over!

 

[andrewm]

As Pete said. Modern machines use less water than older ones so it is likely that the water wouldn't have run hot by the time they are filled so it would still need to heat the water and would leave hot water in the pipes to go cold. So in reality its probably more energy efficient that way.

Andrew

 

[wizer]

hmm i guess it has to be worked out on an individual basis, taking into account variables such as: What type of heating system, How far away the tank or boiler is, etc

 

[tim]

Siemens machines and most Miele

Slightly OT but maybe worth considering when looking at prices etc: Siemens, Neff and Bosch are the same company.

Cheers

Tim

 

[ike]

Modern machines use less water than older ones

Not only that. Popularity of biological detergent means majority of washes need only warmed (30C) water, not hot water.

With cold supply only, the machine can be more freely located away from a boiler.

But in all likleyhood cost-driven to make appliance simpler and cheaper to make/compete.

PS. FWIW I hear good reports about LG machines from trade/repair source. Recently replaced aged Zanussi with one. It's seems v.good - but so many lights on it, I won't need a separate Christmas tree this year!

 

[chiba]

Washing machines here in Japan are all cold fill, and they don't have heaters. They just wash with cold water. Go figure. 8)

 

[StevieB]

I was told when buying mine that all washing machines, cold or cold and hot fill, use cold water only up to 60 degree washes. Its only boil washes that draw hot water from the pipes in hot and cold fill machines. Not sure if this was sales pitch or not.

Was also told that Miele are best (with price to match :roll: ) then Bosch with Hoover and Zanussi as the worst. When I asked about others I was told in two places that price is your best guide to quality.

HTH,

Steve.

 

[dedee]

Thanks all, we used to use biological detergents until we saw the results of non-bio powder on our oldest's eczema.

I found this site which appears to offer some sound and unbiased advice on both the purchase and repair of washing machines and has this to say about Hot and cold fill.

I shall have a quick look this evening, more in hope than expectation, to see if I may be able to repair the machine - from the symptoms described it may just be a belt problem.

I've always wanted to buy a Meile appliance but always baulked at the cost. We have been very pleased with the Bosch dishwasher so will probably have a close look at their washing machines.

Andy

 

[Argee]

Cold fill goes hand-in-hand with low temperature washing. A word of warning, though - if you use washing machine liquid detergent, this will, over a period of time, form a scum within the walls of the outer drum and make the machine really pong!

The solution (no pun) is to revert to powder and give it a really hot wash with a couple of old towels in there. You'd be amazed at what comes out - we're back to powder now which seems fine, even for low temperature washing.

We've had a Bosch "A" rated machine for seven years now - totally trouble-free and very easy to use.

Ray.

 

[matt]

If you're anywhere near a branch of John Lewis (or visit their web site), they do a good range of own brand white goods now - all made by reputable companies and offering excellent value for money.

Miele machines are bullet proof (as are the refrigeration products). You tend to find that certain manufacturers have strengths in particular types of machines: Bosch excel at dishwashers, washing machines, and tumble driers. Neff are ovens & hobs specialist. Miele excel at washing machines, tumble driers, and refrigeration. etc...

 

[Shady]

I use Bosch - very pleased. As an aside though, I'm totally unconvinced by washing at anything under 40 C: I find that this is the minimum temp to really get clothes fresh, regardless of the detergent: am I missing something? (and unless they're 'extremely delicate', most of my stuff gets a good 60 degree blast...)

 

[dedee]

Got home last night and thought I'd better check to see if machine was working OK. It did, cold wash short cycle no problem! Later on put a child's bath robe (wet) in and did a fast spin - again no problem.
No point in taking the machine out then to look at the belt. - WRONG

This morning put a load of washing in - nothing, motor kicks in but the drum moves about half an inch. Obviuosly a slippng belt can't cope with the weight of clothes plus water.

Now why does every washing machine spares website list every model of washing machine except mine! - Servis Quartz M6110 by the way 7 years old. A local shop can get me a belt but in 10-14 days!!!

It may be possible to adjust the belt tension - will have to check this evening.

Andy

 

[beech1948]

Hi,
We have a Bosch Maxx. It was expensive. It is utter rubbish.

The bl**dy machine is 5 years old and has just had new brushes put into the motor. Motor promptly blew up at this minor repair.

I think that Bosch are poor and this is confoirmed by some figures a technician waved at me showing relative reliability.

OK. On to the Mielle with a 10 years guarantee....or do I buy the cheapest and just replace as needed.

 

[cambournepete]

Just foundthis article on cold fill. It's quite a useful site actually.

And now the AEG machine is dying slowly - had a new bit after about 2 years (at a cost of over £100) and now often needs kicking to start or resume programs. :evil:

Miele here we come...

 

[dedee]

Pete,
there is indeed some interesting info on that site including the merits of using Calgon - ie he doubts if it is worth it.

For my own part I still cannot justify the expence of a Miele so settled on a Zanussi - from Sainsbury's. The one I wanted was not in stock so they offered a higher spec machine at no extra cost. Two failed deliveries and several emails & letters later I have had my delivery charge refunded and a £30 goodwill gesture.
As a result I've ended up with a higher spec machine than we wanted at very reasonable price but Sainsbury's Kitchen Appliances will get no more custom from me.

Andy