Does anyone here know somebody that makes chisels? I work timber framing and am hoping to buy a 60mm framing chisel. Unfortunately the only company I know that make them that size are Petrograd which happens to have had no stock for quite some time and is based in russia.... I have emailed some other bigger comapnies but thought an individual that is known for making great tools might be out there. Any help much appreciated.
Timber framing chisels
- Thread starter Harry581010
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D_W? I haven't tried robert sorby yet because I'm not sold on any of their other framing tools but if I have no luck elsewhere l will message them. Thanks
Jameshow
Established Member
D_W I don't know us real name! He'll be along shortly once he finishes work!
Chisel and plane maker in the states all round good guy!
Hope that gets me a discount!!
https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/threads/cryo-treatment-o1-steel.136102/#post-1562691
Chisel and plane maker in the states all round good guy!
Hope that gets me a discount!!
https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/threads/cryo-treatment-o1-steel.136102/#post-1562691
dannyr
Established Member
There are a couple of one man tool forgers left in Sheffield as well as the remaining R Sorby, Henry Taylor and Crown operations and Iles not far away in Lincs. But whether they'd make a tool to your spec I don't know.
I'm currently modifying an SDS tile ripping chisel bought for under £10. 75mm width, cranked or straight, sold in UK as 'cemented carbide', which it certainly is not, but some sort of reasonably hard (file test) alloy tool steel which might work as a tough, wide, short bladed (will have a longish registered-type handle) framing type chisel, we'll see, just needs a bit more cool grinding, then sharpen.
I'm currently modifying an SDS tile ripping chisel bought for under £10. 75mm width, cranked or straight, sold in UK as 'cemented carbide', which it certainly is not, but some sort of reasonably hard (file test) alloy tool steel which might work as a tough, wide, short bladed (will have a longish registered-type handle) framing type chisel, we'll see, just needs a bit more cool grinding, then sharpen.
pgrbff
Established Member
The Japanese still use framing chisels. Have you tried Dictum and Berlin fine tools in Germany?
Adam W.
A Major Clanger
@Harry581010 Why don't you just get a 2" socketed one and be done with it ?
https://www.classichandtools.com/henry-taylor-heavy-duty-socket-firmer-chisels/p1725
Fine chisels, I've had mine for 20 years and replaced the handles for slightly heavier ones.
https://www.classichandtools.com/henry-taylor-heavy-duty-socket-firmer-chisels/p1725
Fine chisels, I've had mine for 20 years and replaced the handles for slightly heavier ones.
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Sorby timber framers slick ?
One left. Be quick !
https://www.toolsandtimber.co.uk/robert-sorby-2-60mm-timber-framers-slick
One left. Be quick !
https://www.toolsandtimber.co.uk/robert-sorby-2-60mm-timber-framers-slick
Adam W.
A Major Clanger
That's just for paring.☝︎
Just in case that's what it's wanted for.
I agree, probably not
I agree, probably not
Jameshow
Established Member
Linwoodjoinery
Established Member
TF tools sell the MHG chisels. These are nicely made but only 50mm I think
https://www.tftools.co.uk/collections/mhg/products/mhg-timber-tools
https://www.tftools.co.uk/collections/mhg/products/mhg-timber-tools
clogs
just can't decide
I'd be finding a piece of broken truck spring.....the multi leaf kind.....
plenty on the side of the road....lol.....
excellent quality of steel....even upto 1/2" thick.....
Can be shaped by steel cutting discs quite easily.....done right with a long tang for the hammer....
I made a 6-8"blade for my metal cutting Guillotene... done the job and never needed sharpeing over the years of daily use......the original blade was unavailable...the gulliotene is French and over 50 years old......
be interested in what D_W says.....
in the third world old truck springs are highly regarded for steel stock......making cutting tools etc...
for fun I just may try it for making a couple of large scew turning tools.....
good excuse to go to the scrappie......hahaha....
plenty on the side of the road....lol.....
excellent quality of steel....even upto 1/2" thick.....
Can be shaped by steel cutting discs quite easily.....done right with a long tang for the hammer....
I made a 6-8"blade for my metal cutting Guillotene... done the job and never needed sharpeing over the years of daily use......the original blade was unavailable...the gulliotene is French and over 50 years old......
be interested in what D_W says.....
in the third world old truck springs are highly regarded for steel stock......making cutting tools etc...
for fun I just may try it for making a couple of large scew turning tools.....
good excuse to go to the scrappie......hahaha....
Adam W.
A Major Clanger
It's a slick, with a very long handle that you push against and the handle will break if you hit it with a mallet. They are used to clean up timber surfaces and the faces of large joints, much like a plane.
They initially made them with a socket instead of a tang and I think that one is re-badged by sorby. I cant remember where I got my one from, but it was £40 when I bought it.
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I'm probably not a great candidate to make one of these, though I could easily grind one. It would be heavy ground with a tang and ferrule, though, as I don't forge sockets.
And because of the thickness, O1. Thanks to the shipping from the US, it would also be exorbitantly expensive - I'd guess if someone gave me the right proportions and a picture of something they like from top and side, it would be $125 of stock cost plus shipping.
But the rub is I don't know what people like in a slick (so the comment above about truck springs - usually 5160 or 1060 or something like that, and I don't work in the low end of hte high carbon steels. I would imagine the vintage slicks were in the ballpark of 0.9% carbon vs. 0.6% and some guy who works professionally would have to really give me the business on what makes for a good combination of hardness and toughness.
So maybe it's more trouble to get me the information to make a good one than it would be to just find an old one in good shape!!
(separately, if I'm off target on the slick idea and this is just a big socketed chisel with a heavy profile - i'm out there, too - I shape in the forge, but I don't do full forging or make sockets).
And because of the thickness, O1. Thanks to the shipping from the US, it would also be exorbitantly expensive - I'd guess if someone gave me the right proportions and a picture of something they like from top and side, it would be $125 of stock cost plus shipping.
But the rub is I don't know what people like in a slick (so the comment above about truck springs - usually 5160 or 1060 or something like that, and I don't work in the low end of hte high carbon steels. I would imagine the vintage slicks were in the ballpark of 0.9% carbon vs. 0.6% and some guy who works professionally would have to really give me the business on what makes for a good combination of hardness and toughness.
So maybe it's more trouble to get me the information to make a good one than it would be to just find an old one in good shape!!
(separately, if I'm off target on the slick idea and this is just a big socketed chisel with a heavy profile - i'm out there, too - I shape in the forge, but I don't do full forging or make sockets).
Curious - what's the assumed use of this older ibbotson chisel. I'd figured it might be site work - it's not overly heavy (but it's proportional given its size).
Shown next to a tyzack english cabinetmaker's style chisel for scale - 1.7" wide (the ibbotson)
Beautifully made - full hardness the same as a good cabinetmaker's chisel. I've actually used this to help a neighbor refit big bits of his deck when he couldn't find local remade wooden parts in the same style as his originals.
The handle isn't hoop and I'd bet fair money that the handle is absolutely original.
Shown next to a tyzack english cabinetmaker's style chisel for scale - 1.7" wide (the ibbotson)
Beautifully made - full hardness the same as a good cabinetmaker's chisel. I've actually used this to help a neighbor refit big bits of his deck when he couldn't find local remade wooden parts in the same style as his originals.
The handle isn't hoop and I'd bet fair money that the handle is absolutely original.
More on truck springs - grain structure generally is very compact below 0.85% carbon or so, which until there's excess carbon usually equates to high toughness (hard to break tools and knives). I've never heat treated 5160 and recall that it might have some additives in it, so I can't comment (enough to say that it'll really be top shelf just heat, quench and temper). A plain steel with nothing more than a small amount of chromium, manganese and maybe a fraction of a percent of vanadium makes for a dandy backyard steel because it's hardenable, but will not form carbides in any large amount meaning that there are no large carbides to dissolve (and no real significant need for normalization).
So, long story short, the truck spring stuff is really well thought of for utility knives, machetes, etc, and will make a usable (but not great) chisel if at the top of its hardness range). And it's cheap because someone else paid for it when they bought a car.
For woodworking in dry wood, its sucking wind a bit for anything other than axes (which you'd prefer to use in wet wood, anyway) because the lack of carbon corresponds to lower terminal hardness and fine edge holding that won't match something like O1 or whatever inexpensive 0.8-1.2% carbon chrome vanadium steel would be available.
I think plain steel in the 1-1.25% carbon range is fairly easy to heat treat (but i only think that because my test results show I can match commercial process). For some odd reason, my only 1084 samples that I've ever sent lacked toughness and were harder than expected - who knows. I think the guidance to have knife guys start on a lower carbon steel is the assumption that they'll abuse a knife and won't have the ability to normalize the metal.
That's the run down on the popularity of the lower carbon steels, though -it's because you can pretty much beat them until they're covered with dents and they won't actually break easily. Strangely, some of the higher carbon steels don't continue to get tougher if you just temper parts back further and further (so if you're hanging around in the just above saw temper range, the low carbon stuff is superior).
And lastly, I have never done site work or timberframing, so I don't know what those guys love. If the wood was wet, car springs would be fine. If it was oak and dry, I think experienced users would not like it much for trimming joints.
There's an overarching theme for some of the folks on knife forums who forge that they want an endless stream of cheap fuel and cheap steel - so scrap yard stuff remains stylish, but if you're making something fine, then it's nice to buy known bar stock from a known mill that's got a known microstructure.
Every single thing I've gotten from Robert sorby in the last 15 years is soft tempered. It's tolerable in turning tooks, but non-plussing in chisels intended for dried hardwoods. Soft tempered enough that even cherry is hard on them - only soft mahogany and clear pine make them look good (or blunting the edge a bit for heavier work in hardwoods where the objective is bashing and not neat work).
clogs
just can't decide
D_W,
very interesting ur reply...
I was just thinking that once cut to final shape with a long tang even welded up to make bigger....u could just beat it to death with a big hammer....to dig the holes....
I was thinking of big deep mortises nothing finely finished...
I wasnt thinking of extra heat treatment.....more a case of getting on with the job....
The edge would be reshaped quite often I think....
clean up could be with a large modern type chisel of course....
I was just thinking of cheap and cheerful....
very interesting ur reply...
I was just thinking that once cut to final shape with a long tang even welded up to make bigger....u could just beat it to death with a big hammer....to dig the holes....
I was thinking of big deep mortises nothing finely finished...
I wasnt thinking of extra heat treatment.....more a case of getting on with the job....
The edge would be reshaped quite often I think....
clean up could be with a large modern type chisel of course....
I was just thinking of cheap and cheerful....
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