Spindle Moulder question

[DFC1047]

Hi,
I am new to woodworking, and have never used a spindle moulder before, although I have seen the one I have , in operation before I acquired it. Kity 0629.
I am making some replacement shutters for my house ( in France), from chestnut. I have planed up the wood, now in 1.3 meter lengths, 150 mm wide, 30 mm thick, which I need to tongue and groove and thought the spindle moulder would be ideal.
In the photo you will see the tool block, and 2 cutting knives. I have 2 of each.
Question, although they differ in weight by 15 grams, can I mount the 2 different ones, so I can make the groove and a chamfer on one edge, then turn the wood over for a second pass to centralise the groove, and make the second chamfer OR must I use 2 similar knoves to cut the groove, then change to the chamfer knives and cut the chamfers.

Any other comments, advice would be greatly appreciated .

 

[dzj]

I wouldn't do it. Theoretically it might be possible, but with 2 same blades you'll have a cleaner cut and
your bearings will last longer. True, It'll take a few extra passes.

I once saw an old-timer do something similar. He used just one cutter and in the opposite slot he put an
old worn out blade. He had a heavy cast iron machine and still it made funny noises when he used this method.
His blades weren't self-centering and he said he couldn't be bothered to set them up every time, so he used just one.

Don't try this at home folks (as they say on TV).

 

[Billy Flitch]

What you have there is a euro block I`v never seen a euro block fitted with 4 knives. It should be used with 2 knives and 2limiters. The limiters are to stop the machine acting soft and also to stop you taking your fingers off up to your elbow.
I dont want to frighten you but you should give this machine a great deal of respect so learn how to use it before you use it.
Its one machine that does not forgive mistakes. take a look at this for the block.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Hnn71VxCc0

 

[Chrispy]

It's really not a good idea and any way if you put those two cutters in that block one opposite the other you would just get a large chamfer with no groove.

 

[blackrodd]

T&G is usually made with a thicker face, so the tongue and groove is not central, this makes identifying the face side simple and it gives room to clean up and re finish in the future as in floor boarding.
in the spindle moulder the face side is down when you set up and work the stock.
As has been said. never try to mix and match cutters as you have suggested, they are as a set and both the cutters and
limiters will have been matched as a set and not to be fiddled with!
Also the "shoulders" of the T&G should not be in line the face edge should touch first, ensuring a good fit.
I would set the face side to be 2mm thicker and match the two, tongue and groove,to fit.
The tongue and groove operation will be obviously with the stock flat, face side down.
You will need a set of bevel or chamfer cutters and limiters and set them to bevel with the stock flat against the fence,
work the bottom bevel first, then raise the cutter block to chamfer the bevel on the tongue side.
Work out how the shaw guard pressure should be set and test on some odd but similar sized stock, pine or whatever.
I have been using these things all my life and you ought to get trained but if you are busting to have a go,
please look at this link,--


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4Kqxl1P3EY
Regards Rodders

PS,Good link above Billy!

 

[DFC1047]

Thanks very much for the info fellas. I have watched both video links now. Will stick to the matched pairs of knives. It would appear that I do not have any "limiters" in the assorted sets of knives that I got with the tool.
I now understand the "geometry" of the groove edges in relation to face and inside , to give a better fit.
Although there are adjustable spring guards fitted to the machine, the adjustemnt for the width of the wood, flat on the machine bed, is not sufficient for some of the pieces of wood I have.
If I am very careful, ie keeping my hands well away from the cutting block, what is the realistic chances of kickback, if I do a series of passes through the cutter after adjusting the fence for cutting depth. Also on the videos it shows usage of a "false fence" ..........is it neccessary.
I know that it is obviously much safer and I would not argue that point at all

 

[dzj]

This block has no limiters. Old type, not popular with the H&S people.

 

[Billy Flitch]

Good eye dzj i just took another look at the block there are only two retaining pins on each side, a total of four which means it can only be used with 2 knives.

 

[custard]

Back in the old days I saw wood machinists regularly use just a single blade in a spindle moulder when they ground a particular profile and didn't want to spend time grinding a second knife, they'd "semi-balance" the one knife with a smaller profile on the other side and run the machine at a slightly lower speed.

But that was also an era when hardly any woodworker made it to retirement with ten fingers, and many didn't make it to retirement at all!

 

[deema]

You can obtain standard knives that cut both the chamfer and the T&G in one knife. Look up Whitehill Tooling for their range which IMO is top class. Alternatively look in eBay there is usually a chap that advertises a set of ovolu tooling (scribe and mould sets) for windows drop him a mail and ask for what you want and he will cut you a set (knives and limiters) for a very reasonable price. I've used him a few times and his tooling is excellent.

 

[DFC1047]

Thanks for all the input guys. I have acquired more knowledge which is a good thing.
I have made the first pair of shutters, heeding the advice given by all, and they seem fine. Still got to varnish them before fitting them.2 more pairs to make.
Realize I need to make some fences for protection on the machine...........I can imagine the damage to fingers if they get in the wrong place. !!!

 

[Giff]

Hi DFC1047

Where about are you in SW Francee ? Geoff

 

[DFC1047]

About 10km from Souillac towards Cahors.