Shortage of veneered plyboard around the country?

[BrianD]

edited: so the emoticons are right!

Hi all,

I feel I am living in a bloody woodworking desert! ':twisted:'):':shock:'

I have been shopping around for some veneered 19mm plyboard for a project. It has to be ply and not MDF as the specific project (speakers call for this) as the material density is important).

I am in a small town south side near Heathrow and for the love of money cannot find anyone with this - is there a UK national shortage or are the various outlets not interested in this? All what is available is cheap construction grade/packaging board nothing at furniture grade. Where can I get this? ':?:'
Anyone have ideas?

A different question: to build sh/elves using 19mm MDF faced with American Cherry. Can one get MDF sheets with both faces veneered with American Cherry? Is seems forget solid wood here.

Any comments on this? The shelf sides are to go to 2.5m height x 300mm wide assuming 19mm boarding with a 6mm veneered backing

I need several sheets and my quantity is small, as a hobbist, compared to several "production" folk on the forum.

Thanks
Brian

 

[mailee]

Well Brian, there is a shortage of veneered anything around my locale. In fact there is also a shortage of hardwood too. Luckily I mainly use softwood.

 

[wizer]

Richard Russel stock 19mm Veneered Ply. Free delivery on orders above £50

 

[jasonB]

Never seen 19mm veneered ply at Richard Russels. Or any of the other large panel specialists for that matter.

Generally you will find that veneered ply is readily available upto 12mm thick and then only one show side and balancer the other. Sizes above that will have to be specifically veneered on a one off basis.

Your options are to veneer 18mm Ply or glue two sheets of 9mm veneered board back to back.

The density of ply can vary a lot from softwood or poplar core which is quite light through to birch which is as heavy as MDF give or take a Kg or two.

I suspect you have been reading Americam sites/books where 3/4" Veneered ply is readily available.

Jason

 

[BrianD]

Thanks for the info guys.

Wizer, the site is for veneered MDF A/B 6 and 18mm - I will have to live with that since there is no A/A it seems (as an amateur perhaps there is no A/A??? ':?')

When it comes to the plywood they only have lessor grades, (I think I am correct, no furniture grade - speaking of course as an amateur!). Ideally something like Finnish A/A or A/B would be fine on 12 and 18 mm. Any ideas?

cheers.

 

[BrianD]

Jason,

thanks for the input. No not USA mags but want to build some speakers (must be ply 18 and 12 mm) and some bookshelves 18/19mm with 6mm veneered MDF.

The shelves - just because of the size and number - I do not think solid wood 300mm wide/shelf is viable $$$ cherry, especially the number of shelves so I thought veneered is the way to go.

What do you think?

 

[jasonB]

Brian, Finnish (Birch) ply is not regarded as a Veneered board. It is Birch throughout, the quality of which gives a very good surface.

As for the quality of the surface you will have a job getting even B/B, it can be had to special order from someone like Edens but you are likely to have to go with S-improved face/BB even that will set you back &82.63 + Vat a sheet for 18mm

Jason

 

[Rich]

Hi Brian, try Arnold Laver in Reading.
regards,
Rich.

 

[jasonB]

If I understand you right on the shelves you are proposing to stick 6mm veneered MDF to a Plywood core?

You would be better using the ply core but sticking 6mm cherry one side ply to this as the ply will be about £20 a sheet cheaper than the two side veneered MDF.

Have a look at Richard Russels to get an idea of whats available and get an ieda of costs, just click on the "stock" box

Jason

 

[BrianD]

Nope!

the 6mm 1 side cherry is for the back of the shelves the ply is 12mm for the speakers.

 

[jasonB]

Got It now on the shelves.

2 side 19mm veneered MDF & 1 side 6mm ply with cherry are not a problem though thickness may need to go up if the span is too large. Also 2500 tall is just a shade over standard boards at 2440, large press is available in 19mm MDF but not so easy to find, 6mm ply that big will be very hard to find, if atall.

What do you require for the speakers, original post said 19mm veneered, last post said 12mm and you also mentioned Finnish (birch) ply

Jason

 

[BrianD]

OK, it seems I was not clear.

The speakers must be part 18 and 12 mm ply - ideally it would have to be Finnish or similar A/A grades with Cherry veneer. Why that - because the cheapo far east stuff is not cabinet grade with lots of voids and I need some quality on this for the resonance and it should look good as you will see the inside and outside of the speaker so finish is important.

What are my alternatives?

BTW 2440 is fine for shelves - I was approximating.

 

[wizer]

Looks like your best option then is to use 2 layers of 9mm to get your 18mm as Jason recommended

 

[BrianD]

Seems like it.

I can use cold glue for this? And of course place a mass on top - just to help as I do not have an airpress.

Should be OK?

 

[jasonB]

The two layer wont work as it seems brian needs a high quality ply core, all the veneered stuff about is just a far eastern core maybe only 3plys about 2.5mm thick with show one side and balancer the other giving the total 9mm, same goes for 6 & 12mm one side just the core changes thickness. Original post only said it must be ply.

The only way I can see of getting a core with the quality of Finnish birch throughout ply is to by birch ply and then veneer it in cherry, pre jointed "flexi veneer" would be the easiest option if you are not upto full veneering. If you are having any curved panels then it will be better to laminate from say 3 layers of 6mm (for 18mm total) if the curve is shallow, if its a tight radius then make it up witha lot of layers of 1.5mm "skin" or "aircraft" ply

BTW A/A & B/B really only refer to the outer layer of veneer, even these boards will have a lesser quality birch for the core but all voids will be filled and they will be WBP bonded.

Jason

Edit, just did the calcs for the density of the various options:

Two layers of veneered 1 side ply glued together = 686kg/m3
18mm Birch ply with veneer applied to both sides = 780kg/m3
off the shelf veneered 2 side MDF = 862kg/m3

 

[BrianD]

it looks like a BIG job if I have to bond it myself layer by layer.

Would Marine Ply be any better? Then I can bond Cherry layer to outside?

If not it seems I will have to create own ply - massive job methinks to get to 18mm.

What do you think Jason?

 

[jasonB]

You may not have read what I said right, if its a flat surface then 18mm Finnish birch ply improved/BB surface with your own veneer on each face will be the way to go. Building up layers is only required for a curved surface.

As with most things there are different grades of "marine" ply you can get Far Eastern ply that is Marine bonded through to high quality Marine ply to Lloyds spec only the latter type is likely to have the density you require at a price

Jason

 

[BrianD]

Jason, I reread your response earlier - I get it :idea:

So veneer some Finnish birch ply with Cherry and away I go.

So where do I find decent Finnish ply? - in my alignment to my original question.

Also, I went to the SW bash at Philly's two years ago and "someone" present was giving out some veneer samples. Does anyone know who that was? I may as well look into supporting his company. The samples where really good.

Philly, do you remember?

It seems that Finnish is scarce, I've been calling up suppliers and no decent response yet. I have been all over the TTF site as well.

Anyone have recommendations?

Appreciated.

 

[Jake]

Try this you'll need to refinish it

 

[BrianD]

Thanks for info - sent a request to the person for sheets. I'll see what happens.

Cheers.