Router - Where did I go wrong?

[technium]

Hi

Today I was going to continue with my workshop build and put up the interior wood walls around the window so had the idea to cut the 8x4 sheet to correct size, roughly measure where the window will be and leave abit of a gap and then cut out the window with a jigsaw leaving about 1 inch excess around the window to then use a flush router bit with bearing to trim flush to window frame.

Well that was the plan, unfortunately it didnt quite go that way. I have a Trend 127 Router and purchased a set of Trend router bits so thought I was sorted. Chucked the flush bit in the router, set the plunge depth, tightened all the knobs and away I went. One side went really well, I stoped now and again to make sure it was cutting flush and all was ok so once I got my confidence up I then cracked on with the other 3 sides BUT near the end of the second side the router seemed to really dig in and was harder to hold so I stopped, looked at the frame and realised it was no longer trimming flush it was cutting into the window frame. I wondered how this had happened and noticed the damn bearing had come off the router bit (insert several swear words here!). I actually didnt realise the bearings could even come off but anyway I managed to find the bearing and spring but not the little grub screw thing. I then removed a screw from another router bearing bit and put that on my only flush bit and made sure it was tight. Started again and this time after about a minute or two I noticed sparks coming from the bit so stopped and this time the spring between cutter and bearing had then come out and was sticking out. At this point I knew it wasnt my day and decided to give up until ive calmed down.

So question is what did I do wrong, why did the bearing come loose and then after tightening did the spring come out and lastly, can I buy replacement grub screws?

Also are trend a poor make, If I am to replace the bit what make should I ideally look for?

thanks in advance.

Colin

 

[SteveF]

was the grub screw bottoming out ?
trend are normally good

Steve

 

[worn thumbs]

Trend are normally pretty good.I have never seen a spring in a flush trimming cutter.There are two main types of flush cutter-one has the bearing at the bottom and the other has the bearing at the top-which type was it?

 

[SteveF]

also how much are you cutting away?
did u trim with jigsaw enough?
just wondering if you are trying to take too big a bite and cooking the bit \ bearing
also wonder if your collet is tight and enough of the shank is inserted
could be vibration causing it


Steve

 

[technium]

Thanks guys

Router bit was shank then cutter then bearing ( not sure if thats top or bottom, assume bottom).

Grub wasnt bottoming out as it was only being used as a guide against the window frame but there was at least another inch of frame so nothing should have come in contact with the grub screw.

I had about 20-25mm to cut away so went in from the side until it touched the frame and then routed around so that would have left about 15mm of waste the other side of the cutter, is that too much?

thanks

 

[SteveF]

i would say too much in my opinion

i always aim to be cutting on one side only

Steve

 

[skipdiver]

I always check the grub screw is tight on bearing guided cutters before i commence using them, especially if they are new. It's possible it wasn't properly tight and it's also possible that when you refitted it, that you didn't quite get the spring in right before tightening, so it may just be down to bad luck and may never happen to you again. Do agree that you were taking too much stock in one go though and that will put strain, friction and possible vibration into the mix. I bought a set of Trend bits a few years ago and they are definitely not the professional range they do, more of a light use range. For bits i use frequently, i always use Wealden, which are as good if not better than Trend IMO and usually a bit cheaper too. They are also a very good firm to do business with.

 

[kevinlightfoot]

Would totally agree with skip diver take a much lighter cut one or two MM and make sure you are all tightened up re collet ,grub screw etc method seems fine but your initial cut needs to be much closer to your frame also agree that cutter quality from trend can vary Wealden are excellent.

 

[technium]

thanks all. So I guess I took too much off, I have another window to do on the other side so will try and cut alot closer to the edge with the jigsaw first and then use the flush bit to trim alot less and see how that goes. Never heard of Wealden, will go online and have a look at them.

Final question, is there a right or wrong direction to route in?

Once ive done the other window in a day or two I will update on how I get one.

thanks again

Colin

 

[skipdiver]

You should go against the rotation of the cutter. Clockwise for an internal cut and anti clockwise for and external cut. Unless you have it in a router table, then everything is reversed but still against the rotation of the bit. Hope that makes sense.

 

[technium]

You should go against the rotation of the cutter. Clockwise for an internal cut and anti clockwise for and external cut. Unless you have it in a router table, then everything is reversed but still against the rotation of the bit. Hope that makes sense.

Thanks Steve, I think i got that wrong aswell then LOL.

I started going clockwise and then finished up going anti clockwise. i am abit confused about the internal / external cut, surely theyre both the same? If I have a square piece of wood with also a square cut out of it (say a picture frame type shape) then if I go to do the left hand outside (external cut) that would be surely the same as cutting inside the frame on the right hand side so wouldnt they both be the same direction or am I really being a noob?

 

[SteveF]

hand held left to right
so inside the frame would be right to left
draw it on a piece of paper and it will make sense
if you dont want to cut closer with jigsaw, then thats ok
just "nibble" away at it with router
try and make sure bit has less than 50% of cut is clear of timber (half moon, not full moon)
place your left hand palm down
stick your thumb out to touch the side of timber u r cutting
stick your finger next to thumb facing forward
cut the way finger is pointing
Steve

 

[skipdiver]

If you imagine your picture frame and you want to rout let's say a roundover on both edges; when you go around the outside edge, you would go in an anti clockwise direction. When you did the internal edge, you would go clockwise. Both cuts would be against the rotation of the router cutter.

 

[skipdiver]

If i think about your window cut, you should have been going clockwise all the way round, no matter which edge you started on.

 

[SteveF]

If i think about your window cut, you should have been going clockwise all the way round, no matter which edge you started on.

yes it was an inside cut, so clockwise

Steve

 

[Bm101]

I'm new to routers too and it is a bit baffling, so this is certainly not 'advice' but the way I got my head round it was to think of it like a handsaw. You're wanting to cut in the direction of the teeth. You'd never try to cut a straight line with a saw against the direction it was meant to go. I use a Japanese saw for example. Right or wrong. The cutting is done on the pull stroke which as beginner I find suits me for whatever reason. If you tried to push it only you'd be all over the shop. The saw wants to pull. It wants to cut. It's the nature of the beast. By pulling the saw the teeth set in the cut. If you pull too hard or try to brace to hard etc, eg you overpull and don't let the saw do the work, the saw is forced into working to hard and will bite or stall. You'll break a tooth or your line will wander. It's no different with a router.
Your baseplate will probably show the direction of the bit. Going in that direction pulls the bit into the wood and helps to stop it from running away from you. If you look at the bit it should suggest the direction of the cut once you get it squared in your head. Using the router is not something I do lightly tbh. (Beginner as I said) I'm not scared of it but it makes me wary. When metal bits are running that fast things can go wrong very fast. As others have said and from what I've read you might want to be cutting at no more than 2-3 mm depths. I love my router like I'd love a gifted but nutty child. I'm amazed by what it can do but i'm always faintly relieved when it goes home and I can have a cider and use handtools.
Sorry, I'm not trying to sound like Charlie Big Potatoes. Just thought the analogy might help.
Cheers
Chris

 

[technium]

Thanks guys, that helps more.

I will have a go on the other window and let you know how I get on. I will try and refit the spring on the bearing bit and hopefully it will be ok.

Any idea about getting a replacement grub screw?

cheers

Colin

 

[sunnybob]

You should picture the bit rotating and the cutting edge biting into the direction you are travelling. If you travel with the bit rotating backwards to travelling direction youre not really cutting, youre wearing away the wood, hence the friction and heat. Also if you are using a bearing in the wrong direction you are making the thread undo. And its best to cut only a half the diameter of the bit at most or again excess heat will develop.
A steep learning curve is what it is.

 

[Bm101]

Trend website? Bit of googling? Otherwise I'd go to Wealden in the future. Like I said I'm only a beginner but when Tuffsaws or Wealden come up over and over again in every post on bandsaw blades or router bits in every thread you read for the last 5 years you don't have to wonder too much I'd guess.

 

[Adam9453]

It's really important to understand how to use a router safely, they can be very dangerous if things go wrong.
Cutting in the wrong direction can lead to the router running away from you which can be disastrous.
I personally wouldn't trust the bit that came apart and to be honest you may have damaged it permanently by trying to cut the way you did.
I'd suggest you get a new bit from Wealden, trim the material to leave max 2-3mm to trim off, then cut it in the right direction. You should then end up with the result you want.
Hope the above doesn't sound too serious but it was stressed to me how dangerous they can be when I was taught to use one.
FYI there are no doubt lots of videos on YouTube regarding safe use of a router, I think norm Abraham did one that was pretty good.
Edit: here's the link;
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=zSPFa3gI_aM