record model T5

[mel]

picked this plane up today for a song
would anybody like to guess how much ???

 

[ike]

£3.75

 

[Alf]

For a song, eh? Pennies from heaven, I presume? :lol: Sheesh, it's got the side knob - I fear major suckage this way comes...

Cheers, Alf

Edited to add: Stay Set lever cap?! Has it got the Stay Set cap iron present and correct too then? You'll be saying it's got the tamperproof adjuster and key next...

 

[mel]

alf
your talking above my head here
ill have to have a closer look and let you know
the bloke i got it from bought it from a school auction
it doesnt look that old actually , or has seen little use
he also had another 3 no5 planes but not with the "bedrock lookalike" body
this was the only one with a handle to the side
i thought that the SS on the cap iron meant stainless steel #-o

so come on how much did i gve for it ????

 

[Paul Chapman]

No idea, but if you want to sell it I'll have it - been looking for one of those for years :wink:

Cheers

Paul

 

[DaveL]

No idea, but if you want to sell it I'll have it

Bum, I am second in line again. :x

As Alf says, you suck :twisted: well that is unless you paid a ridiculously high price for it and the drift I am get is that not the case. [-(

 

[Anonymous]

50p

 

[mel]

ill put you out of your misery
its a little higher than ikes guess at £10

so whats it worth , is my next question ????
untouched in, as original condition , but no box
so let the unofficial auction commence :lol:
or will i get banned
private mail bids only please in pounds sterling

 

[mel]

50p senior , shame on you
would anyone like more photos ???

 

[Anonymous]

Its a guess what you paid for it, not what its worth

 

[ByronBlack]

a T5 with a handle is worth a fair bit. I used one at my course last year, and took me a while to find a good one on ebay. I would guess you could get around £50 to £60 with the handle - nice find, and a lovely plane, I wish I still had mine

 

[mel]

from a site linked by alf as part of her blog , i came across this

http://www.oldtools.co.uk/tools/record/record.php

scroll down a bit to see two examples

its not for sale really
ill save it for part of my retirement package

 

[JesseM]

I know this should be obvious but what is the side handle for? For pulling?

 

[bugbear]

picked this plane up today for a song
would anybody like to guess how much ???

http://www.imagestation.com/8334195/3963797065

Anything under 20 quid is good going at car boot prices.

I'd recommend a replacement blade; whilst the earlier square cornered Record blades are good, the later ones (identified by rounded upper corners) are a good deal softer.

SS T5 are quite rare, although it's rather easy for an unscrupulous dealer to take a fairly common SS #04 and a found sometimes #T5 and "breed" them.

I did see a SS #T5 WITH (matching) BOX on eBay though

BugBear

 

[Alf]

Sheesh, luck o' the devil...

"Planecraft" has a whole chapter devoted to the T5 extolling it's virtues in a school enviroment, so forgive me if I don't quote it all...

Side handle - along with the shape of the sides, there to making use in a shooting board easier. Detachable and can be screwed to either side (or, more often, lost altogther) Record shows the web of the hand between thumb and forefinger pushing against it.

Stay Set - that was Record's name for the two-part cap iron now made by Clifton. Planes fitted with it originally have an additional "SS" on the lever cap (may be exceptions depending on dates and stuff - haven't checked, sorry) One of the few plane patents filed by C & J Hampton - #362743, granted on 10th December 1931

Locking nut on the adjuster - in school workshops the idea was you mightn't always want the little blighters fiddling with the depth adjustment, so Record made a locking nut with four holes in it that would fit behind the usual adjuster and is only moveable with a special key.

Anyway, that gave all these permutations of the T5 to choose from:
T5 - ordinary model
T5 S.S. - with Stay Set
T5K - ordinary model with locking nut and key
T5K - SS. - Stay Set with locking nut and key

A few dates applicable to a T5 S.S. are:

March 1939 - introduced with a 2 1/4" cutting iron.
Patent date on Stay Set cap iron until 1947
Production suspended during WW2
Reintroduced in at least 1952 with 2" iron (may have been available earlier but not shown in catalogues)
Iron changed to curved top instead of straight in mid- to late-1950s (may not be original iron of course)
Stay Set discontinued between 1963-65
Discontinued in the 1970s

The price list provided with the Harrison Record catalogue reprint (March 2003) suggests a value around £50-130 depending on condition, fwiw.

Cheers, Alf

 

[Paul Chapman]

In my experience the Stay-set models have a better machined frog. Look at the examples of the T5 in the link provided by Mel above. Certainly in the Record #05 SS I have (ex-school, bought for £20 in a second-hand tool shop earlier this year) the frog is far better than in equivalent non-SS models :wink:

Cheers

Paul

 

[Alf]

(sound of office door banging as Alf hightails it out to the workshop to compare frogs on her only Record planes - luckily one a SS and one not. See? There's always a good reason for having a wide range of planes from which to choose... :wink

Edit
(bang as door closes again, sound of busy work with pics etc Turns out I have three Records - forgot about one )

Okay, are we sure that's not an age issue rather than a Stay Set issue? These three are all much of a muchness in age and quality I reckon - one has an iron stamped 1947 fwiw. Pick out the SS one:







And yes, I need to do a little cleaning - that's the down side of a wide range of planes from which to choose

Cheers, Alf

 

[Paul Chapman]

Blimey Alf, I didn't mean to put you to all that trouble :lol:

I think maybe you are right and that it is an age issue - however, in my defence I've only ever seen those nicely machined frogs on the Stay-set models. I obviously need to visit more second-hand tool shops - as if I needed an excuse :wink:

Cheers

Paul

Edit: the Stay-set one is probably the one on the left because you were selling a #5.5 SS earlier in the year if I remember correctly

 

[Alf]

Edit: the Stay-set one is probably the one on the left because you were selling a #5.5 SS earlier in the year if I remember correctly

Ooo, cheating! :lol:



And t'was no toruble - any excuse. :wink: As it happens I've not had all three out at once before, so I was surprised how well I'd inadvertently gone for ones so similar. Noticeable that Record's blue finish doesn't last nearly as well as Stanley's japanning too

Cheers, Alf

 

[Paul Chapman]

Alf,

As I was sawing up logs for the fire this afternoon, I was thinking a bit more about Record frogs and Stay-set cap irons (well, what else is there to think about when sawing logs :roll: ). My #05 Stay-set has the same sort of frog as your three Records, with a nice, large, flat surface for the blade to bed against. Similar to the T5 Stay-set in the link Mel posted. Later Records, and the non-Stay-set T5 pictured in Mel's link, have a more skeletal frog with a lesser surface area - similar to the Records I bought new in the 1970s. I find that my Stay-set does in fact give a far better seating for the blade than the skeletal pattern (although I suppose one could argue that if they were all machined equally well there wouldn't be much difference). I wonder, therefore, whether when Record stopped making the Stay-set cap iron (presumably as a cost cutting measure) they also altered the frog pattern - the smaller surface area and skeletal pattern would presumably use less metal and therefore also save a few bob? One of the arguments Record made for the Stay-set cap iron was that it eliminated chatter, but that would only be true if the blade seating against the frog was good - which is another reason to make better frogs all the while the Stay-set was in production.

Funny what one thinks about when sawing logs, init :lol: :lol:

Cheers

Paul