Mitre saw or Table saw

[cutting42]

Hi All

I have been reading the various threads on table saws and mitre saws with much interest. I have a slight variation on the advice I am seeking.

I have a budget of £500 to play with and want to replace a knackered £50 B&Q mitre saw and a home made table saw based on a Skil saw.

Having looked at many of the threads on both types of saws I am looking for others opinions on what is more useful to me so I can send the majority of the funds there. My favourite products so far are the DW 712 and the Scheppach TS2010 but can't afford both. I could buy one of them and then a cheaper £100 Table saw or mitre saw.

I am an enthusiastic DIYer and have built some garden furniture and a play house for the kids:

I am hoping to develop my skills and build some furniture for the house and my long term objective is to be able to build my own kitchen but this is a few years out yet.

I would like to know what people think I should invest the majority of my budget in or have I got it wrong and I can get two high quality tools for my £500 and I just have not found them yet? My workshop is a Garage so a degree of portability is essential as most of my cutting is on the driveway.

Thanks for your attention

Cheers

Gareth

 

[paulm]

Hi Gareth,

I am sure there will be a lot of different opinions on this, but I would suggest a decent tablesaw, such as the SIP 10" cast iron which you can get for £500, on the basis it will cross-cut (with an easily made jig) and rip pretty much any size timber or sheet material you are likely to use.

Angled cuts and compound cuts are also possible although a bit more challenging unless you invest in a decent mitre gauge like the Osbourne or Incra.

By contrast something like the DW712, while a great tool, and especially so if you expect to do a lot of crosscutting/compounds etc on sectional timber rather than using a lot of sheet material, is I think inherently more limited as to what it can do, although arguably what it can do it does at least as well or possibly better than you could do on a medium priced tablesaw.

I suppose you could use a cheap circular saw and guide instead of a table saw, and get the DW712 as well, just depends on what you envisage doing most of the time.

Hope that makes sense ! :shock:

 

[engineer one]

you kind of have to think about what wood you are going to use more regularly.

are you going to use lots of sheet materials, or solid wood.
if sheet, you really need to start i think with a table saw on a moveable stand. with solid the mitre saw allows good cross cutting, but little or no ripping.

maybe however you should spend your money on a good circular saw like the mafell or festo, and their tracks. build one of the disposable cutting frames, and go that way.

the problem with an under £500 table saw is that it is not going to be as accurate as you might like. many here use the festo and its track, but festo buying is addictive, a more slippery slope than buying hand planes i think.

paul :wink:
who has a 708 and dw 744 also.

 

[Scott]

Hi Gareth

I'm afraid you wont get two tools of the quality and capabilities that you're looking for at your budget. I guess you probably knew that really.

I have a DW 712 and only had that and a bandsaw for a long time and managed fine. The 712 is fitted with a 60 Series 80 tooth blade and does a great job.

I now have a table saw though (JET) and I would have to say I'd recommend the TS if it's all you're going to buy but it would need to be good quality for accuracy and I'm afraid I've no experience of the SIP.

I'm afraid I've no experience of the (highly regarded) Festool either but Paul's suggestion is another good one. I guess if I was you I'd be thinking long and hard about what type of work I intend to do and choosing between the TS or the Festool. The 712 means you have no ripping capacity.

Also, the 712 would be a cheaper "second tool" to save up for afterwards than the TS

My 2p worth.

All the best

 

[LyNx]

build my own kitchen

£500,hmmmm

As your looking for self home development only, the festool TS55 has all your sheet and large cutting At £340 max and then you have £160 for nice chopsaw. OR you could extend your budget and go for the new table saw from the yellow axminster range (perform) but not that mobile

My workshop is a Garage so a degree of portability is essential as most of my cutting is on the driveway.

Another reason to think "big output from a small product" (say goodbye to a table saw)

 

[LyNx]

whats your location in this lovely planet. it may help to sample a few machines before purchasing.

 

[cutting42]

Thank for the comments so far, I live in Watford NW of London. I have had a good look at the DW stuff but none of the local stores seem to have a decent TS to look at let alone use!

In terms of wood types, I guess both ply/mdf and real wood as my first project is a desk for my daughters bedroom, I like to design as well and have not designed the plans yet. In the future I suspect I will try and use good quality woods when I can but sheets will always be used I am sure for carcases etc.

I had a look at the SIP and it does not look very moveable!!! Very nice looking and quite tempting - has it got an induction motor? - I could not find out from the links I found. I would need something I can move into a corner to get bikes etc in and out of the garage.

Not convinced on the Festool concept, I would need to see it working but the idea is cool - how different is it to a regular circ saw against a clamped straight edge?

Cheers

Gareth

 

[paulm]

The SIP does have an induction motor, 3hp I think, and is lovely and quiet to use, with a decent sized cast iron table top and an excellent fence as well. Only dissapointment for me is the mitre gauge which is a bit of a sloppy fit in the slot, but the general concensus on this particular tablesaw seems to be that it is terrific value for money with no major drawbacks, and would seem that you would have to pretty much double the amount of money you are spending to get something better like the Excalibur :shock:

What I have done is put the table saw onto a mobile base so that it can be wheeled around as required and locked into a stable position when bieng used. Mine is a commercial product which cost around £50 I think, but I have also knocked up similar ones from 2x4 with large castors and they work great too.

Let us know what you decide in the end

 

[LyNx]

Not convinced on the Festool concept

I wasn't either, until a had a few conversations with someone who owns one. Now looking back, it was the best solution for my workshop and the materials i will be cutting.

The biggest selling point of the hand held saw over a table saw is the cutting of large sheets without putting your back out. I lay out a few battens on the floor, place the sheet on top and cut away. I believe you get a better straight cut from this method than on a table saw. You may get a bit on movement off the fence if trying to cut large sheets on a table saw too. I went the table saw route first off and i found it was taking up too much room in a small workshop and didn't earn it's space.

If you are ever passing swindon (not that you will want too) then i can show you some of the benefits i'm taking about.

Andy

 

[Alf]

To avoid the ever-present danger of Festool Addiction consider the EZ Smart Guide too. No connection, never tried one, blah, blah.

Cheers, Alf

Who just about resisted putting "sweet" before those initials and making a comment on what you get for all that money just to see how many folks got wound up about it... :wink: :lol:

 

[RogerS]

Not convinced on the Festool concept, I would need to see it working but the idea is cool - how different is it to a regular circ saw against a clamped straight edge?

Chalk and cheese!

Gareth, I am/was in a similar position to you..having most of my 'woodworking' aligned more with DIY than furniture (but aspirations for the latter!).

I bought a cheapie Ryobi table saw (meets your criteria re portability) and also have a DW cross-cut mitre saw. I then bought a festool TS55 one of THE best purchases I have made.

I've laid solid oak floors (DW for perfect butt joints, festool), built bespoke kitchen carcasses (festool), ripped oak floorboards (festool). I very rarely use the table saw but admit that some time in the future I will buy a better one.

If you work in London then you're very welcome to come and see the festool (and look at the results) as my flat's near Paddington.

 

[cutting42]

Well I think i have a decision made now, or at least part of a decision thanks to all your input.

I will hold off on a Mitre saw and invest all I can in a good Table saw as it has a wider range of abilities than the Mitre saw.

I am interested in the Festool approach but will see how I get on with the TS as I am unlikely to be ripping 8x4 as I intend getting the sheets roughed at the timber yard and finish off on the TS (and I have 2 circ saws already and a third might struggle past the doorman)!

I would very much like to see the SIP in person if anyone here has one I could visit I would be interested. Possible alternatives are Axminster and if I push the budget to £600 possibly one of the Xcaliber contractor saws which seem to have a great following on here. I have an office in Manchester so could visit Woodford as part of a trip there to see one.

It seems to me that the SIP and the Xcaliber are a cut :lol: above the TS2010 and its competitors (Kity, EB etc) and this is swaying me to invest all my budget into a quality bit of kit.

Many thanks for the help so far, it has been most useful.

Cheers

Gareth

 

[paulm]

You are welcome to come and see the SIP at my place Gareth if you fancy a trip down the M3 to Basingstoke, although it's not exactly local for you !

PM me if you want to and I'll give you directions, if you don't get a better offer more local to you

 

[Anonymous]

Gareth

I can't quite agree with your statement that the SIP is a cut above the Kity. I own the Kity and have looked around a couple of SIPs and have to say that although the SIP is a pretty nice saw, it does not come close to the Kity (a cast iron top is not everything) in terms of quality of manufacture and materials. I suspect Bean will bear me out on this as he was intending to buy the SIP until he used a Kity :wink:

Good luck with the hunting

 

[cutting42]

Thanks Chisel, I may well take you up on that offer.

Thanks for the comment Tony, I did not mean to "dis" any kit out there especially as I have not seen them myself. I will take a look around at the many saws in this price range as I can over the next few weeks.

Cheers

Gareth

 

[engineer one]

not meant to be an advert, but jaycee tools in northolt have a specialised festo room and stock, they also have a number of other products in stock,
since you are in watford, a quick run down the M40 will give you a chance to check why people look hard at festo.

given what you want to do i think a table saw is the way to go,
and maybe you could think about adding a smaller router to
say a clamp guide from trend to clean up those edges you are
not happy with.

anyway welcome to the world.

paul :wink:

 

[Colin C]

Just a small side set on post here 8-[ .
Does anyone have a Kity I could have a look at near me as I am looking at get that or the new Fox , which looks just the same ( dont know if it is )
Thanks

 

[engineer one]

just a thought fro those who want to look at a festo review,
American Woodworker, april/may 2006 issue
has a festo 55 circular saw and guide review.
very complementary, and you know how the american magazines
try not to like european tools!!!
:lol: :lol:
paul :wink:

 

[cutting42]

Just a small side set on post here 8-[ .
Does anyone have a Kity I could have a look at near me as I am looking at get that or the new Fox , which looks just the same ( dont know if it is )
Thanks

Actually after Tony's comment I would like to see a Kity as well, if there is one within a hour of NW London, I would love to come and see it is possible.

I have found a Scheppach to look at (Jaycee Tools - Thanks for the info Paul) another friend has an EB to show me so the last TS to see are the Xcaliber contractor saws.

Incidently, I cant see the pics on the woodford site, has anyone got pics of the 802 and 805 saws so I can see the difference. I have found a post with pics of the 804 saw so that version is covered.

Cheers

Gareth

 

[devonwoody]

I'm a Triton workcentre fan, its portable so the garage can be free. It is easy to transport or take into the garden.

I have had two tablesaws in the past 12 months and I still have my Triton (4 years) but the tablesaws were returned.
You could pick up a large triton outfit perhaps on Ebay for that money.