Benchwayze
Established Member
And for garden tools; shovels etc. Or am I getting confused Jim?jimi43":v7b8bbqj said:
Help Identifying My Chisels!
- Thread starter =Adam=
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jimi43
Established Member
Benchwayze":7vex0uqc said:And for garden tools; shovels etc. Or am I getting confused Jim?jimi43":7vex0uqc said:
I dunno mate...that's brown stuff work...I don't get involved with that.... :mrgreen: :wink:
I'm sure Professor T will be along shortly with the full history! 8) :wink:
Jim
Benchwayze
Established Member
I think it must be the same firm Jim; and who is Professor T? :?
jimi43
Established Member
Benchwayze":2db4ihza said:
Our resident researcher...AndyT of course! Is there another one? :mrgreen:
Jim
Benchwayze
Established Member
Ahhh. Gotcha! and no probably not! :lol:
Did I hear someone say one is enough?
Oooops!
Hat, Coat >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Door! :lol: :lol: :lol:
Did I hear someone say one is enough?
Oooops!
Hat, Coat >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Door! :lol: :lol: :lol:
jimi43":1ikhav5j said:Benchwayze":1ikhav5j said:And for garden tools; shovels etc. Or am I getting confused Jim?jimi43":1ikhav5j said:
I dunno mate...that's brown stuff work...I don't get involved with that.... :mrgreen: :wink:
I'm sure Professor T will be along shortly with the full history! 8) :wink:
Jim
Not sure about the prof bit, but I do have a collection of bookmarks and downloads that come in handy from time to time!
The answer to the question is found in a lovely old 1941 Brades catalogue, available here on the ever-useful Toolemera site which lists a bewildering variety of axes, hammers, chisels, garden tools, augers, bits, billhooks, matchets, banana pruners, turnip hoes, coffee diggers, hot sets, bottom rounding tools (!) and even a page showing their 26 different trade marks!
I think this was a time when the accountants were not yet in charge...
jimi43
Established Member
Ya see prof...what can I say! :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
Jim
Jim
Hi guys,
Well I popped along to another boot sale today (I know it is strange to have one on a Wednesday!) and managed to pick up three more chisels, this time I got all three for £1!!!
Here are some pics:
They have very similar handles to the last lot that I bought so I assume that they are the same make. Am I right?
Also they have quite shallow bevels, would this mean that they are general chisels as opposed to mortice chisels?
The smallest chisel is mint (bar some rust) whereas the larger two have got split handles, this doesn't worry me as I will just turn a couple of new ones!
One thing that worries me about turning new handles though is how do I:
A) get the old steel out of the old handles?
B) secure the steel into the new stock?
Sorry for all of the questions haha!
Well I popped along to another boot sale today (I know it is strange to have one on a Wednesday!) and managed to pick up three more chisels, this time I got all three for £1!!!
Here are some pics:
They have very similar handles to the last lot that I bought so I assume that they are the same make. Am I right?
Also they have quite shallow bevels, would this mean that they are general chisels as opposed to mortice chisels?
The smallest chisel is mint (bar some rust) whereas the larger two have got split handles, this doesn't worry me as I will just turn a couple of new ones!
One thing that worries me about turning new handles though is how do I:
A) get the old steel out of the old handles?
B) secure the steel into the new stock?
Sorry for all of the questions haha!
They all look like they could easily be put back into use. I think the generic 'Made in Sheffield' suggests that they might be more 'ordinary' than a named tool, but still very likely to be decent steel. I wouldn't replace any of those handles either. If a bit has split off (as on the middle one) you can plane it down flat, glue on a lump of similar timber (ie ash in this case) and when the glue has set saw/carve/sand it down to match the shape of the rest. This is easier than full renewal, where it is surprisingly easy to end up with a handle not in line with the chisel. The right hand one just needs a trim, and then a life where it's not hit with a hammer.
Cheshirechappie
Established Member
Don't worry about asking questions - that's what the forum's for!
Those are 'firmer' chisels, which as you correctly suppose are general purpose chisels for bench or light site work. Mortice chisels are much thicker in the blade, and tend to be quite narrow (just like mortices!). The other sort you may well come across are bevel-edged chisels, which have a blade with the sides sloping, so that they can get into tighter spaces such as when cleaning up dovetail joints.
They may well not be by the same maker as the others - you'll get a better idea once you've had a chance to clean them up. Sheffield had a long history of smallish, independent makers of tools and tool parts alongside the big firms, so it's quite possible that several chisel makers bought handles from one turner, who in turn probably bought in the ferrules from someone else. They do look like good chisels, though.
Those are 'firmer' chisels, which as you correctly suppose are general purpose chisels for bench or light site work. Mortice chisels are much thicker in the blade, and tend to be quite narrow (just like mortices!). The other sort you may well come across are bevel-edged chisels, which have a blade with the sides sloping, so that they can get into tighter spaces such as when cleaning up dovetail joints.
They may well not be by the same maker as the others - you'll get a better idea once you've had a chance to clean them up. Sheffield had a long history of smallish, independent makers of tools and tool parts alongside the big firms, so it's quite possible that several chisel makers bought handles from one turner, who in turn probably bought in the ferrules from someone else. They do look like good chisels, though.
Thanks for the replies guys!
The one on the right has a had a big bit smashed off with a hammer, almost one third of the handle.
I like the idea of glueing a piece of timber into its place though! I will then trim the top off and round it back over then it should look like new!
I am not really a hammer wielder, more of a mallet haha!
I am confident that these will clean up nicely
The one on the right has a had a big bit smashed off with a hammer, almost one third of the handle.
I like the idea of glueing a piece of timber into its place though! I will then trim the top off and round it back over then it should look like new!
I am not really a hammer wielder, more of a mallet haha!
I am confident that these will clean up nicely
jimi43
Established Member
Excellent Adam....you are starting to build quite a collection....and what you will get is a huge amount of experience in sharpening, shaping, mending and grafting...you name it, you need it to restore tools.
This is what the ash handled ones will look like when you finish restoring them:
The one on the right is boxwood...look out for these, they are lovely,
That one was considerably longer...sadly I don't have "before" pictures...but was just as mashed up as yours...
But just look at that wood...
I just sawed off the rough end and sat there with coarse sandpaper and then finer and finer until it was shaped (of sorts)!
One of my most favourite of chisels.
Good luck and let us know if you need any tips...
Jim
This is what the ash handled ones will look like when you finish restoring them:
The one on the right is boxwood...look out for these, they are lovely,
That one was considerably longer...sadly I don't have "before" pictures...but was just as mashed up as yours...
But just look at that wood...
I just sawed off the rough end and sat there with coarse sandpaper and then finer and finer until it was shaped (of sorts)!
One of my most favourite of chisels.
Good luck and let us know if you need any tips...
Jim
Those look great now they are restored!
Could you explain the difference between the profiles of the two chisels please? All of the modern ones tend to be like the right handed chisel, is it just a way of having the same strength but less metal?
What grade of paper did you finish them on?
Could you explain the difference between the profiles of the two chisels please? All of the modern ones tend to be like the right handed chisel, is it just a way of having the same strength but less metal?
What grade of paper did you finish them on?
jimi43
Established Member
=Adam=":1qxk4z9m said:
As mentioned earlier and explained there...the left one is a firmer (like yours) and the right a bevel edge.
The edges are bevelled so they can get into the corners of dovetails etc. It's much clearer HERE
It has nothing to do with saving steel...the right hand one is actually a lot older than the left one.
The key to reforming using abrasive paper is to use coarse first and then go down through the grades to fine. Don't skip grades or you may leave scratches from a coarser grit.
I use Mirka 60G or 80G depending on what's cheap at the bootfair....then Abranet 120G to 400G then MicroMesh 1500M to 12000M or whatever finish I want...perhaps silk...I stop earlier.
Cheers
Jim
Thanks for the link, that cleared things up a bit
Your finishing methods seem quite intense, however the finish is superb! I have got some 60,80 and 120 paper to hand along with 180 and 220 foam pads which should be enough for what I want in terms of finish, however I may be tempted with the abranet, never used it so it may be worth a trial!
Your finishing methods seem quite intense, however the finish is superb! I have got some 60,80 and 120 paper to hand along with 180 and 220 foam pads which should be enough for what I want in terms of finish, however I may be tempted with the abranet, never used it so it may be worth a trial!
jimi43
Established Member
=Adam=":1nu86cp4 said:Thanks for the link, that cleared things up a bit
Your finishing methods seem quite intense, however the finish is superb! I have got some 60,80 and 120 paper to hand along with 180 and 220 foam pads which should be enough for what I want in terms of finish, however I may be tempted with the abranet, never used it so it may be worth a trial!
Absolutely Adam...just stick with what you've got and then if you feel you want to get a smoother finish...go for more.
Abranet is really quite economical...compared with abrasive papers and cloths. It is on a mesh so that you can shake out the dust and it hardly clogs at all...particularly good on lathes. The MicroMesh is really wonderful stuff...again relatively cheap if you get a mixed pack from FleaBay and I wash mine out in a washing machine when it gets a bit clogged. I think my sets are over a year old!
Jim
If you do want to make a whole new chisel handle, first expose the tang on the old one so you know how wide and deep to drill the hole. If you can, do the drilling on the lathe to keep it central. You will probably need to drill a long narrow hole, then open it out a bit for some of the depth, then a bit more at the top - be guided by the shape of the old one.
If you can't drill on the lathe, drill at least the long thin hole first, and let it sit central on your tail stock. The hole needs to be a tight fit, and would not originally have been glued, but epoxy resin (eg Araldite) is good for making things fit and will fill small gaps. When the fit starts to get tight, hold the handle in the air and knock the back end sharply with a mallet, using the inertia of the metal to seat it in nicely. You don't want to be hammering the whole thing into the bench!
If you can't drill on the lathe, drill at least the long thin hole first, and let it sit central on your tail stock. The hole needs to be a tight fit, and would not originally have been glued, but epoxy resin (eg Araldite) is good for making things fit and will fill small gaps. When the fit starts to get tight, hold the handle in the air and knock the back end sharply with a mallet, using the inertia of the metal to seat it in nicely. You don't want to be hammering the whole thing into the bench!
toolmaniac
Established Member
If you oil them the oil will mark any timber you are using, unless you use something like linseed oil - a wipe on a rag.
You could improve the appearance by scrubbing the handles with fine wire wool dipped in paraffin. You will be surprised at the amount of c**p that comes off.
Pick the paint off with the back of a knife or chisel, them give them a wipe with linseed oil or tung/danish/antique oil.
You will think they are new.
If you are buying at boot sales, you won't go far wrong if you buy by brand (Marples, Stanley), or buy chisels with wooden handles. The best ones have boxwood handles.
Now and again you will come across a real treasure.
You could improve the appearance by scrubbing the handles with fine wire wool dipped in paraffin. You will be surprised at the amount of c**p that comes off.
Pick the paint off with the back of a knife or chisel, them give them a wipe with linseed oil or tung/danish/antique oil.
You will think they are new.
If you are buying at boot sales, you won't go far wrong if you buy by brand (Marples, Stanley), or buy chisels with wooden handles. The best ones have boxwood handles.
Now and again you will come across a real treasure.
