Free electric

[lurker]

I see British gas are planning to offer dual fuel customers with a smart meter, free electric for 8 hours at the weekend. You have to nominate a day.

With a few changes to our normal routine I think me and her indoors could put our high use all into the same day.

In the winter we could use the tumble drier without any cares and thus do the all the weeks washing on Saturday

A cheap 2000W fan blower could be left running with abandon so the house is warm by 5pm (when the free ends) and the gas central heating would just need to top it up after 5.
Ditto my shed in the winter could be toasty all day long withhout concern of the costs.

Just trying to think of a downside to all of this.

 

[graduate_owner]

There may be a limit on usage. If not they are just asking for wasted energy. You can't blame anyone for making the most of free fuel.

K

 

[lurker]

I think you must be right
a quick mental arithmatic, I reckon we could easily rack up 60 Kwatts per 8 hour day in the winter (say 5 months)

2 X fan heaters
3 loads of washing & drying
load in the dishwasher
Immersion water heater (presently disconnected)
extra cooking in the electric oven

 

[Homerjh]

anyone have a smart meter, we keep getting offered but not sure if it is worth the hassle of it all andif it is just a money making thing for them.

 

[Homerjh]

oh, and i am aware that this is likely to be a way to get people to get a smart meter!

 

[lurker]

agree, no such thing as a free lunch
They are not doing this out of goodness, there must be a down side

 

[NazNomad]

I'd love the chance to try this ... my downside being there is no gas out here in the Welsh wilds.

Just remember the phrase... ''there is no free lunch'' ... there has to be a way they are increasing profits from this scheme.

 

[RogerS]

I see British gas are planning to offer dual fuel customers with a smart meter, free electric for 8 hours at the weekend. You have to nominate a day.

With a few changes to our normal routine I think me and her indoors could put our high use all into the same day.

In the winter we could use the tumble drier without any cares and thus do the all the weeks washing on Saturday

A cheap 2000W fan blower could be left running with abandon so the house is warm by 5pm (when the free ends) and the gas central heating would just need to top it up after 5.
Ditto my shed in the winter could be toasty all day long withhout concern of the costs.

Just trying to think of a downside to all of this.

The newspaper report that I read commented that you need to look at the total package..ie how much does BG charge compared to others and suggested that it might not be such a good deal.

 

[RogerS]

anyone have a smart meter, we keep getting offered but not sure if it is worth the hassle of it all andif it is just a money making thing for them.

There is a Govt push for smart meters. But it is not compulsory. I won't have one because their security is questionable and potentially open to hackers to turn off your electricity remotely (or all those thousands with a particular type of meter). There is also the question of allowing a potential backdoor into your computer if they (the smart meter) are connected to the internet. Again, lack of security is my concern. Likewise cars that have internet connections...

Yes, I am paranoid but, then again, I have worked in the IT security business.

I also question the ethics of smartenergygb.org who are 'pushing' smart meters in general at the moment. In their list of FAQs, there is this question.

Can my energy supplier cut off my gas or electricity remotely?

You're protected by strict regulations against your energy supplier switching off or disconnecting your gas or electricity supply. This protection remains as strong with smart meters as it is with traditional meters.

This question requires a straightforward 'Yes' or 'No'. Their answer is disingenuous and misleading. The correct answer is 'Yes'. But they clearly don't want the general public to be aware of that. Just imagine nPower deciding that you haven't paid your bill (even though you have) and deciding to turn you off. That's going to be fun trying to sort out without any power as we all know just how responsive nPower are !!

 

[n0legs]

Wanna' borrow my sealing pliers and some seals? That's proper free electric :lol:

 

[lurker]

I see British gas are planning to offer dual fuel customers with a smart meter, free electric for 8 hours at the weekend. You have to nominate a day.

With a few changes to our normal routine I think me and her indoors could put our high use all into the same day.

In the winter we could use the tumble drier without any cares and thus do the all the weeks washing on Saturday

A cheap 2000W fan blower could be left running with abandon so the house is warm by 5pm (when the free ends) and the gas central heating would just need to top it up after 5.
Ditto my shed in the winter could be toasty all day long withhout concern of the costs.

Just trying to think of a downside to all of this.

The newspaper report that I read commented that you need to look at the total package..ie how much does BG charge compared to others and suggested that it might not be such a good deal.

I saw that but we already have bg dual fuel.
Their wbsite says this deal is still the cheapest tariffs

Had not considered they could use the thing to cut me off
They would have no reason to but I am aware they all have a bad reputation for admitting they might be mistaken.

I think I will find out what consumption limits there are before I go much further

 

[defsdoor]

I can't see a downside to a smart meter. They aren't connected to your local network - they have a SIM card in and report usage to the vendor using SMS only so they can't be remotely hacked.

They give you the ability to be invoiced accurately for once, and if your IHD is good let you keep an eye on your usage.

The big problem with smart meters though is that they are provider specific. Change your supplier and you need a new meter.

I'm on my second already.

My current smart meter is from OVO and it has some (what you might consider deliberate) flaws. Primarily that the display default to your bill to date usage not current usage and the high usage warning LEDs do not light up on this page. So you can't just glance at it and realised you've left the header on in the garage etc..

 

[n0legs]

No good will come of these smart meters.

 

[bugbear]

I think you must be right
a quick mental arithmatic, I reckon we could easily rack up 60 Kwatts per 8 hour day in the winter (say 5 months)

2 X fan heaters
3 loads of washing & drying
load in the dishwasher
Immersion water heater (presently disconnected)
extra cooking in the electric oven

Heat up swimming pool?

BugBear

 

[RogerS]

I can't see a downside to a smart meter. They aren't connected to your local network - they have a SIM card in and report usage to the vendor using SMS only so they can't be remotely hacked.

.....

SMS is simply the data transfer layer. As is wi-fi, or an ethernet cable. From the Govt's website...

The communications hub has two functions. Firstly it allows the smart meters and In-home Display (and other devices which consumers may wish to use) to communicate with each other over a Home Area Network, in a similar way to wireless computer networks (Wi-Fi). Secondly it provides a link to the Wide Area Network which allows information to be sent to and from meters by energy suppliers, energy network operators and energy service companies.

And a very quick Google...

"In Spain, researchers have already managed to hack smart meters and send false information to energy providers.

The UK has set out guidelines aimed at beefing up the security of smart meters, but this might not be enough to stop determined hackers finding a way to bypass protections.

“Cyber criminals and cyber terrorists are improving their capabilities very quickly," Rivas-Vásquez continued."

So, yes, they can be hacked.

And Ross Anderson at Cambridge University seems to agree with me

https://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~rja14/Papers/ ... switch.pdf

 

[n0legs]

See, I told you so ^^^ :lol:

 

[woodpig]

No good will come of these smart meters.

Is the correct answer. They are of no benefit to users only the utilities. The £300 per household cost to install them will no doubt be hidden within your normal bill over a period of time. You only need to look at the problems they've had with them in America to realise its a bad idea. Germany have now cancelled them as the cost of installing them is not of benefit to customers. Other European countries are expected to follow suit.

If you do a quick search there is plenty of anti smart meter information out there. And it's worth remembering for those that don't want them that even British Gas say you are not obliged to have one fitted if you don't want one.

 

[Sheffield Tony]

I can't see a downside to a smart meter.

They consume electricity, not save it ?

 

[defsdoor]

The local home network (home area network) is open to attack - the protocol and means that it communicates with the IHD but, to my knowledge, there isn't anything you can control/manipulate on the meter itself from this. I have even contacted my provider for the protocol details so I can develop my own web based usage display.

That document you link to is pure theory - i.e. what could be open to attack - not what actually is based on any specific models.

The HAN is local - so China can only attack it en-mass if they sit outside each and every house they want to target. This is far less a risk than your home wifi etc.. as (pre-payment meters aside) there's not a lot you can do to a normal smart meter other than read the usage. You can't turn off power - even the provider doesn't have that legal right - regardless of arrears.

 

[defsdoor]

Is the correct answer. They are of no benefit to users only the utilities. The £300 per household cost to install them will no doubt be hidden within your normal bill over a period of time.

How do they benefit the utility companies ? They currently benefit greatly from estimated bills and over charging. Smart meters can eradicate this completely. As a user you know what your to the minute cost is and current usage. That is all smart meters and IHDs are about. There's nothing the utilities want in them at all - they've been mandated to provide them.

How can £300 be hidden in my bill ? It's calculated from actual usage plus standing charge. It's more likely that the entire smart meter costs will be factored in to everyone's base tariff.