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sunnybob

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Its not much by most of you lot's standards, but I have never managed to get that many straight edges glued up at the same time.

The centre is beech and the edges are walnut. All joints are splined, with 4 mm plywood full length. Not sure if thats good or bad, but as this was a test piece, why not?
Not happy with the finish though. Two coats of Liberon finishing oil and it looks wrong as you can see in the second pic. Any suggestions on improving the finish?
cutting board.jpg


cutting board finish.jpg
 

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AJB Temple

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If you intend to use the board as a cutting board, then I would not worry much about the finish. I use a number of wooden boards (end grain mostly) in my very busy kitchen and I use a mixture of mineral oil and bees wax. The boards are full of knife marks, and are wiped down frequently with cleaning solutions. The best finish is plenty of signs of use!
 

sunnybob

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Its my OCDness, I need to know why it looks the way it does and what if anything I have done wrong. :roll: 8)

I have some mineral oil, but also as this was just a trial run I used up some of this finishing oil which has now been on my shelf for a couple of years.
If I make any more I shall pay more attention to what to finish it with.
But on the Liberon tin it does state it is safe for toy use, so presumably non toxic.
 

AJB Temple

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Any time I have had setting oils or varnishes on my boards, the finish degrades quickly. I have a 6" thick Italian made end grain butcher's block and that arrived coated in polyurethane varnish. This got badly marked almost straight away, and the edges of the cuts discoloured brown.

I would flat your back with wire wool or a nylon pad and do another 2 or three coats if you want a good finish. It's no different to oiling anything else really and absorption will vary across the piece.

If you buy end grain or fancy blocks made for the domestic kitchen market, they are often hard varnished. However, if you buy a commercial block made for butchery, then usually they have no finish at all. Mine is like that. They will be workhorses and scrubbed down and scoured with bleach.
 

profchris

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sunnybob":e5esge1a said:
Its my OCDness, I need to know why it looks the way it does and what if anything I have done wrong. :roll: 8)
Nothing wrong, it's just that 2 coats is nowhere near enough for an even finish. Your coats are (or should be) very thin indeed.

Rub very gently back with wire wool or fine abrasive (I like the latter better, but just a very light touch to remove any roughness) and apply more coats. I'd guess somewhere near 6 or 7, abrading lightly every couple of coats, would do it. After maybe coat 4 you'll see the effect improve, and you can decide where to stop.

Note that because the grain is unfilled you won't get a mirror shine, but an even sheen is quite achievable.
 

Sheffield Tony

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sunnybob":3k3e7rcd said:
The centre is beech and the edges are walnut. All joints are splined, with 4 mm plywood full length. Not sure if thats good or bad, but as this was a test piece, why not?
Erm, have you ever wondered why breadboard ends are called breadboard ends ? I'd be careful about getting that at all wet.
 

sunnybob

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I've sanded off the finishing oil. Apart from anything else I really didnt like the smell.
I've recoated with baby oil. Yes, I know, baby oil is scented mineral oil, but again, I had some on the shelf and again, this is a prototype To see if I want to make any quantity, so it just doesnt matter.

Bearing in mind this is only about 40 cm long and 2 cm deep, I think any expansion will be controlled by the adhesive, but I will put this to a testing period to make sure.
Rebating the middle section to fit inside the ends will add about 30% to the labour, so I dont particularly want to do that.

I've struggled so long just trying to get a long straight joint that I'm happy whatever happens to it. 8) 8)
 

Sheffield Tony

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I mention it because when I was getting back into woodwork, I made a hinged lid for a box, about 600x400x20mm, beech, and almost exactly the same design as your board. Brought it in from the workshop and was startled by what happened. Moved several mm across the width.

My first attempt at an end-grain beech carving board ended up dished and cracked after putting a steaming hot chicken on top of it. As for the glue holding it, the ancient Egyptians used the swelling of wet wooden wedges to split stone !
 

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I have been making a point of using olive oil for a finish. Firstly because I have lots and lots, and secondly because some people are adamant that oil will go rancid and smell awful, but mine doesn't. So there!

I have also made a finish out of beeswax and olive oil - 4 parts oil to 1 part wax by weight, melt the wax (gently in a microwave) and stir in the oil. It is also being used as a moisturizer and lip balm, which is annoying me no end. I haven't achieved a nice glossy wax finish yet, so I will take the advice above on board (wire wool and many coats) and see what happens. It's all a voyage of discovery at the moment.

Btw, nice board!
 

ED65

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That's a lovely looking board Bob, nicely done. Not sure how those ends would hold up to use and washing though, so you might want to have a rethink on the design for the next one.
 

ED65

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Sheffield Tony":3m88rows said:
Erm, have you ever wondered why breadboard ends are called breadboard ends ?
Perhaps even more telling is what they were called before the term "breadboard end" came to be used. It seems this has become the default name for them which I find a bit odd since they're now mostly used for tabletops :lol:


Trainee neophyte":3m88rows said:
I have been making a point of using olive oil for a finish. Firstly because I have lots and lots, and secondly because some people are adamant that oil will go rancid and smell awful, but mine doesn't. So there!
Yes! Isn't it funny how often we see the same thing repeated every time the subject comes up? But go back just a generation or two ago and vegetable oil was just about the only thing recommended it seems (often olive oil specifically).

Trainee neophyte":3m88rows said:
I have also made a finish out of beeswax and olive oil... I haven't achieved a nice glossy wax finish yet, so I will take the advice above on board (wire wool and many coats) and see what happens. It's all a voyage of discovery at the moment.
You can't really get a glossy finish with an oil/wax blend, and certainly not with a non-drying oil. When waxes are blended into other finishes it's generally to lower the sheen (as well as for hand feel but that's partly an aspect of the former).

If you want a properly glossy finish wax has to go on by itself. However, you might find beeswax is a little too soft for this by itself, as well as too easily marked by handling, in a warmer climate. But beeswax, being a natural product, varies a ton so you'll have to be guided by what you have there and not generic guidelines.
 

sunnybob

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I shall have to study the boards (yes, boards, I've made another with Maple in the centre :shock: :roll: ), I've had these walnut sticks hanging around for a couple of years and couldnt work out what to do with them.

My possibly flawed logic is that the vast majority of the wood has the same grain orientation, so expansion will be along the board, taking the end boards with it.
The splines go through all the walnut pieces, so the glue area is quite large which will hopefully tame the end boards sideways expansion.

Now that I have all you "proper" peoples attention, give me your recommendations on how to construct any future boards.
 

memzey

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sunnybob":17wjf4i0 said:
I shall have to study the boards (yes, boards, I've made another with Maple in the centre :shock: :roll: ), I've had these walnut sticks hanging around for a couple of years and couldnt work out what to do with them.

My possibly flawed logic is that the vast majority of the wood has the same grain orientation, so expansion will be along the board, taking the end boards with it.
The splines go through all the walnut pieces, so the glue area is quite large which will hopefully tame the end boards sideways expansion.

Now that I have all you "proper" peoples attention, give me your recommendations on how to construct any future boards.
I’m loath to describe anything I’ve made as “proper” but possibly something along the lines of this:
 

sunnybob

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Memzey, I was wondering where you had got to! 8)

That boards not bad for a beginner :roll: =D> =D> =D> =D>

I am considering working up to that kind of thing, but at the moment its more about using up odds and ends from the shelves and practising long joints so I could easily do several more of the frame style. But no point if they are going to spring apart on me.
Maybe we can discuss stuff over an EFES again? 8)
 

Sheffield Tony

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sunnybob":3bkxbkgf said:
My possibly flawed logic is that the vast majority of the wood has the same grain orientation, so expansion will be along the board, taking the end boards with it.
The expansion is across the board. Wood moves most tangentially to the annual rings, maybe (very roughly) half that radially, and hardly at all lengthwise. Which is why the end strips running across the grain are risky. Breadboard ends are only attached fully in the middle, so allow sliding. No ends at all is more usual - just a flatish board. It may not stay quite flat, but hey, it's just a chopping board.

I hope your splines do hold, it is a nice colour contrast with the borderr on all 4 sides.
 

sunnybob

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Hah, my logic was fatally flawed (hammer) (hammer)

following along though, if the ends were only fixed in the middle, the joints would literally open to warping and dust and dirt.
so the short answer is "dont do that again you stupid boy". :roll: :roll:
 

memzey

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sunnybob":1w9qbp9l said:
Memzey, I was wondering where you had got to! 8)

That boards not bad for a beginner :roll: =D> =D> =D> =D>

I am considering working up to that kind of thing, but at the moment its more about using up odds and ends from the shelves and practising long joints so I could easily do several more of the frame style. But no point if they are going to spring apart on me.
Maybe we can discuss stuff over an EFES again? 8)
As you well know bob, I have four daft females to chase after and that can be a time consuming endeavour! I’ve not been here or had much shed time lately but hopefully things will calm down soon. Sera does want a new kitchen and built ins in the bedroom after all.

One of the good things about the style of end grain chopping board I’ve shown above is that it lends itself very well to using up off cuts, particularly long rips off the edges of boards. The key thing is to get your edge joints just right (no gaps). A bench plane and thicknesser are super useful when it comes to making one, as is having plenty of cramps. I suspect that we will have an opportunity to discuss this over an efes or three this summer but not 100% sure just yet.
 

sunnybob

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I shall order some in for the outside fridge 8) 8) 8) 8)
we're flying to the UK on sunday for 10 days, truly madly deeply not looking forward to it, but we have had such a cold winter I dont think I will notice the temps, just getting ready to be ill again is enough for now. You would have been happy here. Days in a row unable to work in 8c and lower. on 2 days it was still ZERO c at 9am. :roll: :roll:
Conversing with AES the other day, he was warmer in switzerland that I was here :shock: :shock:

I have just started using the thicknesser for other than getting rough sawn planks to usable surfaces. I'm definitely leaning towards an end grain board.
8) 8) 8)
 

Myfordman

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Watch out for Storm Dennis SunnyBob. Storms, pestilence and plagues of frogs due to hit UK this weekend. I would not be surprised to see flights affected. Forecasts speed of 50mph wind, structural damage and 120mm rain - could be an exaggeration to cover their backsides though.
 

sunnybob

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I would expect nothing less for my visit :roll: :roll:

I have been quite seriously ill on my last four visits back to my homeland.
I think its got the hump that I have rejected it. :shock:
At least I'm going south and west (Bristol) which usually avoids the stupidly bad weather that the north and the midlands get.
 
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