Drying freshly cut walnut and woodworm help

[Treeeeee]

Hello,

I've recently purchased a piece of walnut, its around 80mm thick. The tree was felled 6 weeks ago.

I've done as much research as I can but you really can go on forever. A lot of the advice seems to come from the USA which won't be relevant to what I need.

So far, I have 'stickered' it what I believe to be correctly although it isn't off the ground which I will soon do. I've also made the mistake of using a tarp to cover it which I will also change.

What I am wondering is, in England, how long realistically am I looking at until I can bring it indoors to use as a coffee table.

I have purchased a cheap moisture meter to try and ***** its progress.

The second part of my question is woodworm/ wood boring insects.

At the moment there isn't any signs of woodworm or insect decay although I am led to believe walnut can be prone to this.

What is the best product/ method to prevent it becoming an issue?

Borax? Boron? Cuprinol 5 star?

Thanks for any help

 

[Ttrees]

Borax ....I believe, is only used to coat on top of wood that has been processed .
I might have to get some soon, as I may have to use non toxic woods in future.
You mentioned 80mm thick ...
Is it a bolt or split or sawn piece of timber ? guessing so since you plan to make a coffee table..
How long is it roughly and how wide ....
It sounds like its going from flatsawn to pith
Do you plan to have a live/waney edge or take all sapwood off to get to the brown stuff ?
This would greatly lessen the chance of beetle infestation .

If it had infestation and you wanted live edge and it was going in central heated house that wasn't damp
or infested .....you could pop it in the freezer freshly cut .

Was the tree dead standing ..this is when the critters move in .
Seal the ends ...hot candle wax ...old glue...(shout out some more cheap examples folks)

It would be good if you took a pic or two end grain too for drying tips ... right now before sealing today !!!


It could be a headache if you plan on getting a dead flat stable surface ...not to mention.....by the sounds of things... in the time you wish, it sounds like you want to get at this soon
The plastic does not sound like a terrible idea ...It needs to be slow dried so the bound water can evaporate out of the middle of the plank...the free water (close to outside) will evaporate a lot quicker (not good) as the dry stuff on the outside will shrink and the wood will crush itself and crack and other things

Tom

 

[Treeeeee]

Thanks for your help Tom.

I've attached a picture which will hopefully help.

I believe it was sawn using a chainsaw type mill. 1500mm long about 400mm wide at the base and then each branch off is around 300mm.

I'll be keeping the waney edge but removing the bark. Should I remove the bark now? or leave it until I'm ready to process it.

Wether or not it was dead standing I do not know.

I have sealed the ends with a watered down PVA mix and then neat PVA on top.

Thanks a lot

 

[Treeeeee]

Photo -

 

[Ttrees]

Wow :shock: what a plank !
Guessing you want the finished article to look like it is now ...not cut and laminated
They say a year for an inch ...
I'm interested in what folks say about the bark ...
I'd be inclined to leave it on ...should get an answer on this quicker now
I think you need to go real slow with the drying on this one, since you have got branch intersection
More than the time what's the recommended ...In the coldest place you can get.
It's stickered you say off the ground ...what timber ?
How flat are you planning to get/keep this ....is their going to be real precise joinery involved ?
You might loose a lot of the thickness in the end ....
It looks dense as f ..I would guess, you don't need worry bout the critters
Can't wait for others to chime in ....
Tom

 

[Treeeeee]

I know, Im so glad I was able to get it. An amazing piece of wood I can't wait to have in my house.

From my reading although the bark/ sapwood is where the critters can reside getting rid of it at this stage may possibly be leaving it in a similar situation to leaving the end grain exposed. (Loosing moisture faster than the solid part of the timber) Although I have heard you can seal this similar to the end grain.

It was just stickered with cheap pine I believe, the sort of thing you get in lengths at B and Q.

No real joinery involved, I will be welding up a steel framed base for the table to lay on. With slotted holes to allow for expansion.

I'm happy to loose some thickness as it's huge at the moment.

Thanks so much.

 

[whiskywill]

From my reading although the bark/ sapwood is where the critters can reside

You should not have a problem living in the far east of the U.K. Critters only live in the U.S.A and there is a big ocean between them and us. :wink:

 

[Ttrees]

It looks like it could take two distinct angle changes.
I wouldn't weld up the frame for this until youre done drying,

I have seen tables (laminated) with grooves routed out underneath ....
I wonder if this may help in the end if it started to cup when sitting on the frame ...

It would probably split if you done this too soon ..I wonder if it would even help atall ...I'm just sayin.
Eager to see some more folks advice on this

 

[custard]

What I am wondering is, in England, how long realistically am I looking at until I can bring it indoors to use as a coffee table.

A year per inch plus one summer. With anything over three inches thick the drying time increases exponentially. By the way, with all that crotch wood, it's a banker's bet you'll get a fair bit of warping, so keep it out of direct sun and take it slow.

 

[andersonec]

Walnut dries a little quicker than some, we had a large (3ft dia) Walnut sawn to 3" thick planks in Feb 14, it was stacked in a open fronted 'shed' and is now down to 14% and no woodworm.

Make sure however much weight you think is enough,,,double it.

Andy

 

[Treeeeee]

Whiskywill - Thanks a lot, so I don't need woodwork treatment etc?

Ttrees - what do you mean by angle changes? No I certainly won't be welding anything up until it's at its final dimensions - thanks so much for your help so far.

Custard - I was hoping you would comment Gary. I'm gutted you've said that although it was what i was expecting. Any clever tricks to speed this process up?

Andersonec - Do you mean weight on the top? yes i've got some paving slabs on it, however I'll add some more. I've also sent you a PM.

Can I store this at the front of a garage or is it best to be outside to get a through flow of air?

Thanks so much chaps!

 

[Ttrees]

By angle change ..I mean it taking a v shape from looking at the endgrain ...
It might see-saw on your frame width ways
This would probably be more apparent looking from the bottom end grain of the tree ...
as the crotch with its intersecting grain would probably combat this to some extent ...
Producing different warpage, more than likely splitting slightly in random places ....
not down the length of your timber .
That kind of long split would be the result of improper drying time.

That's a lot of paving slabs that would be necessary

Does any folks here rip these kind of slabs through the middle and joint them later again ?
Might not be necessary with this particular piece as the crotch grain goes more than half way down the length though.

 

[Treeeeee]

Ahh, I'm with you now!

I was tempted to rip it through the middle and then have two boards at 40mm. However, i'd be scared that to loose a few more MM once finished and after taking out the warpage I'd be left with two thin boards that wouldn't have the effect I'm after.

Thanks for your help

 

[Treeeeee]

Would asking someone to stick this in a vacuum kiln be an option?

Or is that something thats going to cost mega bucks? Or I'll have to wait until they have other 3 inch walnut boards in there?

Cheers

 

[sploo]

Custard - I was hoping you would comment Gary. I'm gutted you've said that although it was what i was expecting. Any clever tricks to speed this process up?

You could look into making a poor man's solar kiln. I have a plastic Keter garden storage box with a low current PC fan in the top of the rear panel, powered by a small solar panel (and a few vent holes in the bottom of the back panel, with mesh to prevent mice getting in).

The theory is that in the day the heat from the sun warms the box and the fan drives off the moisture. As the evening cools down the fan stops, and the moisture in the air condenses on the wood and gets reabsorbed - preventing the outside drying too quickly vs the core.

Mine works ok - certainly it does seem to prevent molding in the storage box and what I've put in it looks ok.

 

[Treeeeee]

Yeah I have heard of this as an option too.

What would this reduce the drying time to roughly? and is there any drawbacks of doing it this way?

I'm awaiting someone calling me back about using a vacuum kiln to dry it.

Thanks for your help

 

[rhrwilliams]

Regarding treating the timber - there are no products that will be effective long term in preventing insect damage etc. The only thing that will prevent insect damage is the timber being dry. If it is below say 10% moisture the timber cannot and will not be able to survive. Additionally most UK insects etc will eat sapwood only and not heartwood.

 

[Treeeeee]

So for the meantime what should I do in terms on insect damage?

Nothing?

Cheers for the advice

 

[custard]

So for the meantime what should I do in terms on insect damage?

Nothing?

Cheers for the advice

I've heard of people treating freshly felled Holly with disinfectant to guard against blue staining, but I've never heard of anyone trying to protect wet boards against worm. When looking at Walnut boards in timber yards I occasionally see some worm holes in the sap, but it's not all that many. Personally I'd make sure there's no rotting timber in the immediate vicinity where your board is stored, after that I'd just take a punt and hope for the best.

Good luck!

 

[rhrwilliams]

When the wood is freshly felled it has tannins in it. The natural tannins protect it from wood boring insects.

There is less tannins in the sapwood, and the sapwood is softer. There is more tannins in the heartwood and it is harder.

The insects come when the wood is wet for prolonged periods and the tannins washes out of the wood but this is usually a long process. Ergo, drying freshly cut timber is usually safe and if it is going to get eaten the wood is either old / dead and rotting already , or the insect damage will be to just the sap area.

I would keep the wood under cover and do nothing or if your in a rush to use it kiln dry